[merrick4]

I must say that I did anticipate that I'd be making more money. The thing is you read here people always complaining that the sure way to have a million is to start with two and buy a truck. GMAN is the only one really that says you can do well. As I posted above you can go drive for a company as long as you want but you will never see the numbers. Probably I had a better chance at seeing that cause they liked me and they could tell I wasn't stupid. As I said earlier they brought me in the office and was showing me their customers (so I would understand why they needed trucks at certain places)

So I'm on my next load. I had to deadhead about 50 miles though I went another 20 to take a shower. It picks up in Oklahoma City and has 3 stops, one in Illinois and two in Wisconsin. With deadhead I'm being paid about $1.00 a mile. It's newspaper inserts so the stops should be real easy. I did not think as an O/O I'd be seeing a $1.00 a mile. What did I base that on? Nothing really. What could I base it on? Like I said how do you learn the money said unless you are brought up in it?

I think the dispatcher thought I was gonna get mad or something. He said he called both the owner and some friend of the owner who has 19 trucks and they both said they would run it on their equipment. That I just better be getting a good rate coming out of Wisconsin which means $2.00 or better all miles.

So far I do not regret getting into this. My wife has a good job, my mortgage is prepaid until November and I only really have a truck payment which is not that bad. If I had started out with nothing, I think I would be much more stressed out. I can see how one breakdown and if you are not prepared, there goes everything.

I think from reading here that people get into this, (including myself) without truly realizing what they are getting into. You see companies paying $1.00 a mile and you think if you get $1.30 you'll be ahead of the game. Well that thread recently about O/O vs Lease on really elucidated the differences. I remember Pepe asking what he was missing when he got $1.30 a mile or something like that from Schneider and he wondered why Lease on drivers would stay for $1.00 a mile. This insurance cost me $14,000. Next year it should be a lot less I'm hoping.

I have not failed nor am I writing this to say that people shouldn't get into this, this is not a post based on emotion, just the numbers. As I said I do not so far regret getting in to this.

Anyway, how do you guys get to where the money is? I mean honestly I really never thought about having to be in one area over another (which is why the company showed me what they showed me on their computer so I would understand that money isn't everywhere). So from what I understand now, reefer money is in Wisconsin, Indiana, Michigan. They are booking me loads straight to these areas. I went previously from Pennsylvania (sp?) to Wisconsin but I thought it would have made more sense to go to Ohio and then over to Wisconsin as the path I took had me on the Penn Turnpike and thus made that trip unprofitable.

Do you guys move around like a piece on a chessboard to get to where you want? And if the money is in the Midwest what are the people in California or out west doing? Are they trying to get out to the same area as I am? I guess this would make sense as if you are based in Cali I guess you would have more of a chance of getting a good load out of there so you go to Wisconsin and head back to Cali.

I am less worried about the negotiating part now. Eventually I will know what's what and the rate will be what it is. Thus I shouldn't be worried about the negotiating but rather being worried about knowing the proper information to base rates on. When I learn that I think the negotiating will be easier. For example, when I am in Wisconsin and if someone asked me to head out for a $1.40 a mile, well no I won't do that. Out of there they need to pay me more.

I guess like anything time is what's needed. Rome wasn't built in a day afterall.

[pepe4158]

You should get at least 1.30-1.50 comming outta Wisconson I heard....hope Im right.

Y eah Ill move 500 miles or so, at a crap rate, as Steve mentioned to do, just to get a better rate in a better lane....as G-man said sometimes you gotta wait a day or 2 for the better rate too; I wouldve thought you could get at least 1.20 outta OK city, especially your refer....ummm right?....I know I can for 53 foot dry van....your using get-loaded and internet truck stop?
I pretty much know I always can get a good rate outta LA...then its chess game time :-p

[Sonny Pruitt]

You are lucky in one way that someone is doing the legwork for you.
And if you do leave that person to go on your own
It may be hard to come back?
You have to understand that reefer especially frozen food
Is the same shippers going to the same recievers over and over again
I am an o/o for 28 years with no reefer exp and
own authority for around 2 years with a reefer
The only way I got through it is that I had a mentor who knows his stuff
anyhow, unlike other freight, you can tell who the shipper and reciever are by the posted cities Westfield Mass....C/S Allentown...probably Millard or Americold there are a finite group of shippers/recievers
you need to get in a relationship with certain brokers so you are not running all over the place this winter
when you hit a decent load from a broker ask for it again and again
I did a food bank load for a guy a month ago
Every week I call for another load
This week they called me "we got a food bank load for you"
nice money etc
I hope to spend the winter banking on food banks

Unlike others on this board I contend its not that easy to make money as an independant and a lot of people inflate their independant earnings to save face. Or keep up their image
Most of the people I know who took the plunge either went to Landstar or
eventually went back to leasing.
There may be 2 or 3 left out of 10 that I know
and thats over a couple of years
A lot of guys got destroyed over last winters lack of freight
The load boards are way too confusing and signing up with brokers is a royal pain
Especially when you don't have a clue who they are
If you are under the pressure of feeding your family and attempting living the life of a normal person car pmt,mortgage, landscaping, soccer,college, Macy's, Home Depot etc you would be crazy to attempt your own authority without years of experience and a book of tried and true brokers given by a mentor
This is an area of trucking where you either have little responsibility except for the stupid truck or your wife is the CEO of a fortune 500 company
I've seen them come and go

as far as negotiating and not pulling cheap freight
I have a friend who has an account for 4 loads a week from wilmington mass
to downingtown pa
they weigh about 8,000#
it pays around 1.25 per mile
It is GOLD
An account every carrier would kill for
waiting for your price is a message board cliche
If you wait til you get your price in New England you will have one hell of an accent by the time you get out.

[merrick4]

Originally Posted by Sonny Pruitt

If you wait til you get your price in New England you will have one hell of an accent by the time you get out.

Well it's too late for that as I already talk like that. It makes for exciting times out here. Try asking for a Stahbucks in Louisiana. Yesterday I asked for an iced coffee at Mcdonalds and the girl actually called over the manager to help her. Still don't understand that one as there is no letter "r" in iced coffee but I guess in Oklahoma they say ahced instead of how I say it.

It's funny a couple of weeks ago I was delivering the cardboard to Delaware and the guy says to put the trailer "with the cahboard..." so I say, hey you talk normal where are you from? He looked at me funny as he was the owner of the place and I don't think was used to being questioned about anything, and says Maine. We ended up having a nice conversation.

Anyway Sonny, yes if I leave this guy I need to do it in a right way. I of course want to go on my own but would like to go with this guy's blessing. He's a nice guy and he's been a big help so far. Besides I am very quick at picking up things and if I find something that will be useful then I will bring it to him. Of course I pay him $600 a month but there are things that I can do that he can't which is how we became friendly in the first place.

I'm not in over my head with bills like you mentioned that a lot are. I started this with quite a bit of money (well it's all relative) which is now gone but I'm not so far in debt with very good equipment.

I'm glad the short time I did otr with a company was with a reefer company. I have some contacts that I've kept the info for and when I get a bit more settled I will be calling them.

I know what you mean about inflating the rate to save face. I don't even know anyone here and I was somewhat embarrased to put the rate I was getting for this trip. However I am a very genuine person and am doing this thread for 2 reasons: 1) to obviously seek out advice on how to do things better and 2) to put out honest info that those that are going to come next can read to make informed decisions. I have gotten a lot of information here and if I can offer some in return I would be glad to do it.

Well I'd like to write more but just stopped to make a sandwhich. I can't rest until I get to where I need to be or at least a lot closer. I'm neurotic like that.

[GMAN]

I will say a few words about rates. i have hesitated to post some of my own numbers, simply because most who are posting their numbers don't seem to be getting the same rates. Frankly, the last week or so, rates seem to have taken a nose dive. I have been offered several loads today around $1.50 for a step deck. That is much different than a couple of weeks ago. I spoke with one company in the Midwest who told me they have been getting $1.85/mile for steps. That seems low to me, considering the high cost of fuel. There are areas of the country where rates are better some times and lower at others. For instance, in winter months rates tend to be higher in the Sunbelt, especially when the weather is bad. In Summer months, rates are usually better in the Sunbelt. The reason is because many people don't want to run in bad weather, so rates are higher. The same with hot summer weather in the South. It is cooler in the rust belt in summer. Lower capacity equals higher rates. Higher capacity and lower rates. I suppose it could be looked at like a chess board, as someone mentioned. You constantly need to be aware of where the better paying loads originate.

[GMAN]

Sorry, double post. ops:

[pepe4158]

Yeah ran into a guy with 4 trucks, own authority, in Idahao, n he constantly ges 1.70-2.00 for dry van, so I know the better rates are out there, he shared a few sources with me n we talked shop......he uses a little trick tho.

He owns no trailers, and he moves other peoples trailers, and loads his freight on them, so if you owned your own trailers minus the 40c or so he probably gets to move those trailers.

[merrick4]

Originally Posted by Sonny Pruitt

Unlike others on this board I contend its not that easy to make money as an independant and a lot of people inflate their independant earnings to save face. Or keep up their image
Most of the people I know who took the plunge either went to Landstar or
eventually went back to leasing.
There may be 2 or 3 left out of 10 that I know
and thats over a couple of years
A lot of guys got destroyed over last winters lack of freight
The load boards are way too confusing and signing up with brokers is a royal pain
Especially when you don't have a clue who they are
If you are under the pressure of feeding your family and attempting living the life of a normal person car pmt,mortgage, landscaping, soccer,college, Macy's, Home Depot etc you would be crazy to attempt your own authority without years of experience and a book of tried and true brokers given by a mentor
This is an area of trucking where you either have little responsibility except for the stupid truck or your wife is the CEO of a fortune 500 company
I've seen them come and go

So what seems to be the main thing that makes people fail or makes them go back to leasing on or to Landstar is lack of good paying freight. I was thinking of your post tonight while I was driving and I think, as stupid as this sounds or maybe naive, that when becoming an O/O too much emphasis is placed on the aspect of getting the truck. I mean what is the truck but a tool to carry the freight. The truck by itself does nothing but look pretty.

I haven't studied the truck industry but it seems like from the little I read, a lot of these big truck companies started out with a contract. I think I read Celadon had some contract I forget with what I think auto parts though could be wrong. LCT, now part of Gainey, started with a couple of trucks hauling flowers. Swift, well that guy was hauling his own stuff I think. But it seems like they had the freight before the truck while a lot of us get the truck before the freight.

This honestly is my dream. I'd love to haul my own stuff. Buy things by the truckload and deliver it. I know it's far fetched but what the hell. Actually I know a guy who has some land on a main road and we talked about buying a truckload of Christmas trees and setting them out on his lot during the season.

A few months ago, a relative by marriage came over to my house with a friend that was staying with them for a few days. Well lo and behold I get to talking with this girl and she works for a logistics company in Ecuador. They ship flowers over here and all over the world. I was working for a company at the time and it was one of the ones that were hauling some of their flowers out of Miami. I'd love to get some type of contract straight with people down there to haul flowers (actually they didn't contract with the trucking companies here the importers here did that) I don't know I started asking a lot of questions but I didn't want to be rude so I didn't get to ask as many as I'd have liked to.

Yet the guy I work with doesn't haul for shippers. He deals with the brokers. He doesn't want to deal with shippers as he says they don't pay. Yet GMAN advocates getting work straight from shippers so I'm trying to reconcile the two points of view.

Also, as this guy doesn't haul for shippers which seems to go against the getting the freight before the truck. This guy though is born and raised in this industry so has a better chance at dealing with the brokers.

Really another factor I guess is how far in does one want to go. What I mean by that is if you have one truck, low overhead and know what you are doing as far as picking loads, then I guess you can do well. However if you have 3 trucks with massive overhead well that changes things quite a bit. Or even if you have one truck with massive overhead and don't know what you are doing, well that's heading for trouble.

I hope it's clear what I'm trying to say, as I guess I'm trying to say too many things at once. There seems to be many variables at play here and there is not a one size answer for all. Just as one person can live well off of $50,000 while another would go into massive debt on the same salary.

Low overhead and good freight I guess that sums it up. Quite obvious really. Finding the good freight can take time so I guess if you get the truck first then one should be prepared to live lean for awhile. I guess if you can get through the lean times then the money will come. I'm sure GMAN wasn't getting the rates he's getting right out of the box. I mean he's get many years of experience.

One final thought, these checks come in kind of large. I mean in 3 weeks I've billed over $12,000. A lot of people get money and they are thinking "what can I buy". I think "what can I pay". Money management is key here.

Pepe I'm planning on doing a lot better than $1.30 to $1.50 out of Wisconsin. Last time I got $1.75 and the guy I'm working with got mad with his dispatcher for putting that on my truck. And to answer if I'm using Getloaded and Internet truck stop, you might have missed it in the beginning but I pay someone to load my truck. I do monitor Getloaded though and try and see what's where. I have little patience with slow internet though.


Oh by the way Sonny as for New England I don't think the guy I'm working with goes there. He said he has a $500 surcharge for going to New York which basically means he won't go. Not only the rates and tolls he mentioned that it tears up the truck up there. As for me I have no desire to go there anyway. With the company I was with I was so happy when they sent me to Mass. I mean you are always going to be nostalgic for where you are from. Well I get up there and it starts to snow and I've never driven a rig in snow before and it's freaking cold and I don't even own pants really as I live in Florida and that was it for me. I never ever need to see that place again.

[pepe4158]

[quote="merrick4"]

Originally Posted by Sonny Pruitt

Unlike others on this board I contend its not that easy to make money as a

Pepe I'm planning on doing a lot better than $1.30 to $1.50 out of Wisconsin. Last time I got $1.75 and the guy I'm working with got mad with his dispatcher for putting that on my truck.


.

Glad to hear it....you guys generally make a little more then we dry van haulers anyway tho....just almost panicked when you could only get a buck....what would I get 50c???? :-p hmmm no dont tell me...I gotta pay the broker for the privilage of having a load :-p

Yeah trying to get a Sureway load outa LA right now.....I can usually get 1.40-1.60 outta LA....but you refer guys consistantly get $2....but obviously many wont go to California tho....being a native I know the little tricks some dont to avoid getting hasseled.

[GMAN]

Originally Posted by Sonny Pruitt

Unlike others on this board I contend its not that easy to make money as an independant and a lot of people inflate their independant earnings to save face. Or keep up their image/

Nothing is life which is worthwhile is easy. However, running your authority does involve more than driving the truck. Some people are better at multi-tasking than others.

Originally Posted by Sonny Pruitt

Most of the people I know who took the plunge either went to Landstar or
eventually went back to leasing.
There may be 2 or 3 left out of 10 that I know
and thats over a couple of years
A lot of guys got destroyed over last winters lack of freight
The load boards are way too confusing and signing up with brokers is a royal pain
Especially when you don't have a clue who they are
If you are under the pressure of feeding your family and attempting living the life of a normal person car pmt,mortgage, landscaping, soccer,college, Macy's, Home Depot etc you would be crazy to attempt your own authority without years of experience and a book of tried and true brokers given by a mentor

I have also met those who have lost their shirt as an owner operator or running their authority. Not everyone should be in business for themselves. Some people give up their authority because they don't want to deal with all of the paperwork. I am not sure what is so confusing about the load boards. The main thing I would like to see changed with them is having the rates posted along with the load information. If you are cutting it so close as to not be able to feed your family and pay the bills, you probably didn't have enough reserves starting out. This can be a very unforgiving business. I believe you are correct about having a mentor to help you get a good start. Unfortunately, most are not willing to wait and learn. They would prefer jumping in and make their own mistakes. Doing so is a very expensive way to learn this business. I think that is one reason we have such a high failure rate.

[/quote]

Originally Posted by Sonny Pruitt

as far as negotiating and not pulling cheap freight
I have a friend who has an account for 4 loads a week from wilmington mass
to downingtown pa
they weigh about 8,000#
it pays around 1.25 per mile
It is GOLD
An account every carrier would kill for
waiting for your price is a message board cliche
If you wait til you get your price in New England you will have one hell of an accent by the time you get out.

I don't consider pulling freight for $1.25/mile as GOLD. Your friend could make as much pulling a van for one of the low mileage carriers. $1.25 is not a good rate. It is consistent business, but by the time he pays for fuel and his driver, there isn't anything left for himself or profit. He is one breakdown away from bankruptcy.