Originally Posted by GMAN

You get upset even when I agree with you?

Originally Posted by GMAN

As long as the politicians can pit one group against the other they can control the masses. There are those who are taking money from both ends. It isn't right, no matter who is doing it.

Originally Posted by GMAN

Your definition of bigotry is way off when you accuse me of being a bigot. Neither Christianity or Islam are racial or ethnic groups.

Originally Posted by Rev.Vassago

I was MOCKING them, since you were professing a bunch of crazy conspiracy theories that are commonly associated with them.



I guess that CERTIFIED Hawaiian birth certificate, which has been checked by countless government officials, both conservative and liberal, is imaginary. But you don't want it to be true, so I'm sure you'll spout the typical Birther nonsense about it not being a REAL birth certificate (even though it's been certified as real by the REPUBLICAN Governor of Hawaii)

I don't know if it is a real birth certificate or not. I have not seen it. All I know is what I have heard. And as I stated above, if he were not a citizen I would think that someone would have come forward and proven it. Of course, there is still the matter of his academic records. To my knowledge, every president has made his records public. When someone refuses to do so then it is assumed that they have something to hide.




No, your problem is that you don't like Obama, so you're coming up with crazy conspiracy theories to try to discount him. So far in this thread, you've professed:

I don't recall mentioning anything about a conspiracy.

1. Obama is secretly a Muslim

I only related what I heard Obama state in a speech.

2. Muslims want to overthrow our government

Of course they do. They have stated as much. They want to convert or destroy anyone who gets in their way to force the world to accept Islam. And what do you think the attacks on 9/11 were all about? They wanted to bring down our government. It wasn't only the trade center that was attacked. The Pentagon was also attacked and it is speculated that had the passengers not taken control of the last plane that it would have either hit the White House or Capital.

3. Obama is helping them do it

I don't recall specifically making a statement such as you noted. However, he is destroying this country with the programs and policies he is initiating. And that can help the terrorists to achieve their goals.

4. A Muslim terrorist is the same as any other Muslim

I don't recall having said this either. I did say that my their silence they were supporting terrorism. I still stand by that statement.

5. Anyone who has ever killed in the name of God is not really a Christian, and somehow that same standard doesn't apply to Islam

Christianity teaches that we should not kill. It is one of the 10 commandments.

6. Those who don't speak out against, or apologize for bad things done in the name of their religion are just as guilty as those who committed the atrocities in the first place
7. The President and the Democrats in Congress are trying to destroy the country

This is true. Everything this president has done since he assumed office goes against everything this country stands for. He has taken over the U.S. auto industry, banking and insurance industries, or at least a large portion of them. That is socialism, not capitalism. It is not the right or obligation of this government to take over ANY business. Capitalism gives business the right to succeed or fail. It isn't up to the government to take over failing business or put tax payer money at risk. It is also not constitutional for the government for force healthcare on it's citizens. This president and congress are out of control. They are spending money like a group of drunken sailors on a long weekend leave. The only problem is that they are spending money they don't have. They are jeopardizing the future of our country and citizens and putting us into servitude to our creditors. Rather than expanding government they should be reducing the size of government and cutting spending.

8. The President has circumvented the Constitution by appointing czars (I'll come back to this one later, lol)

There is a constitutional process for those who hold sensitive positions in government. None of his appointee's have apparently gone through any background check. In fact, Obama himself would not likely have passed a security check based on his past associations alone.

9. The President is like Hitler

Perhaps you would prefer Stalin, Lenin, Mao? Obama is acting like a dictator. He is attempting to act against the will of the people.


10. The words "Freedom of Religion" supposedly appear in the Constitution

I don't recall stating that "Freedom of Religion" appears in the constitution. The constitution does provide for freedom of religion. Basically, it prohibits the government from preventing us from worshiping as we will. At least it is supposed to work that way. Try praying in school or reading the Bible and you will bring a lot of trouble down on yourself. It is unconstitutional for the government to interfere in people who choose to pray or read their Bible anywhere. That hasn't stopped the liberals from pushing their agenda and ignoring the constitution.

11. Islam is taught in our schools

Some schools have been reading and studying the Koran. It has been on the national news.

12. Obama might not have been born in the US

You are repeating yourself.

Have I missed any?

Okay, back to the "czar" issue. Do you even have a CLUE what a "czar" is? Or are you simply buying what you're being told one is? I'll give you a hint: A "czar," as the term is being used today, is an ADVISOR to the President. EVERY President has them. The term was coined by RONALD REAGAN, when he appointed the first drug czar back in the 80's. Since then, it's been the commonly accepted term for Presidential advisers. It has NOTHING to do with circumventing the Constitution or the Congress, and EVERYTHING to do with helping Obama make better informed decisions. Reagan had them, Bush 1 had them, Clinton had them, Bush Jr. had them, and now Obama has them. Plus every other President of the 20th Century had them, only they weren't called "czars" back then.

So basically, you're complaining that Obama has advisers. LOL.

No I am complaining that he has attempted to bypass the congress by appointing so many czars. These people should have gone through background checks and been interviewed by congress. As far as I know, neither has happened. He doesn't want to answer to congress. Not that it makes much difference. This congress seems to be a rubber stamp for whatever he wants to do. If this were George Bush, all hell would have broken lose by now.


You said it best back on page 1 of this thread when you were accusing government officials of trying to divide the country, and later when you were accusing people like Jackson and Sharpton of doing the same:

They are doing just that by pitting blacks against whites. Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton have made a fortune by convincing blacks that whites are responsible for all their problems. They could have encouraged blacks to stay in school and learn a trade or get a college degree. Instead, they blame whites for their failures. And the government has done blacks the most harm by encouraging a dependency on the government rather than encouraging them to move out of their poverty. It is a way for some to stay in power. After all, who would vote against their paycheck? There have been many blacks who have made it out of poverty in spite of government. Jackson and Sharpton like to blame rather than encourage people. People need to take responsibility for their actions and themselves regardless of race. They get their power by dividing us. Imagine what this country would be like if we didn't look at race?



It seems you've bought what they are selling, since you seem hellbent on helping them pitting one group against another. You want to criticize Obama's policies? Then go right ahead! You don't have to help disseminate garbage about Muslims and Hitler etc. like you have in this thread to do so. If the FACTS aren't good enough, then maybe it's not his policies you really don't like.....

Originally Posted by GMAN

Originally Posted by Rev.Vassago

I fully expect that you'll gloss over this all, and dismiss it immediately,

Originally Posted by GMAN

I challenge you to show me one thing that I have lied about with Obama.

Originally Posted by GMAN

I also think that the Muslims want to over throw this government or bring this country to it's knees. Obama is doing a great job for them. They should be proud of the job their fellow Muslim brother is doing for them in bringing down the "Great Satan" (America).

Originally Posted by GMAN

It wasn't a loving people who attacked this country on 9/11. It was people who said that they were Muslims. The Muslims have sworn to kill Americans and anyone who stands in their way to force the world into believing the way that they do.

Originally Posted by GMAN

Everything this president has done since he assumed office goes against everything this country stands for. He has taken over the U.S. auto industry, banking and insurance industries, or at least a large portion of them. That is socialism, not capitalism.

Originally Posted by GMAN

Our forefathers put "Freedom of Religion" in our constitution.

Originally Posted by dobry4u

I am an American who supports her President who was elected by the People. Period. I support my country and her efforts to be a great Nation of People of the World. Period.

Originally Posted by Rev.Vassago

Since you embedded most of your post in my quote, I'll simply respond to the part you didn't. I'd also ask that in the future, you don't do so, as it makes responding all that much more difficult. Putting quote tags into a post before responding isn't tough. But when you embed your response in my post, when I hit the quote button, none of it even shows up.



I'm not. In fact, I've been called a "Bushbot" too. But when push comes to shove, I am a fan of the Democratic Process, and whether I like him or not, he is MY President. When I see people making blatantly false statements against him, it makes my blood boil (just like it did under Bush). When those people are citizens of this country, it makes it that much worse. When those citizens are simply mouthpieces for the media and talk show personalities, it makes me lose faith in humanity.



No offense, but you're not very good at it. You'll see why in a short while.



Seriously - could you stop invoking Godwin's Law? It's getting old. Plus it's contradictory. You'll understand why when you read further on.



Prove it. Stop making these blanket allegations and actually back something up for once. You obviously have a computer, and I'm sure you can find Google. PROVE IT.



I don't believe this for a second. I'm sure your friend has access to a scanner. Have him prove it.



Again, prove it.



So that makes spreading lies about him OK.



Ok, now you're talking about Socialism. Which is it? So far, you've likened him to a Fascist (Hitler), a Socialist, and Muslims, which most Muslim countries are Monarchies or Parliamentary Republics (like England). He can't be all these things. These type of governments don't coexist.



If you can't discuss Obama without talking about Hitler, then you've already lost the argument. And I've checked out Lennon. He was great in the Beatles. Lenin, on the other hand, was a Marxist. You clearly don't know anything about these different types of government, because if you did, you would know that Fascism (Hitler) does not jive with Socialism, which does not jive with Marxism, which does not jive with a Monarchy or a Parliamentary Republic.

You're so hell bent on attaching labels to him, that you're attaching contradictory labels. So here's your free history lesson for today. Since you're a self-professed "history buff," you should find this quite interesting and informative. I'm being nice and including links too:

Fascism: Single party state, opposes class conflict (pitting various economic levels against each other, like Republicans and Democrats readily do), and blames liberal democracies (you know, like OBAMA?) for the creation of those conflicts and Communists (you know, like STALIN?) for exploiting them.

So Obama clearly can't be a Fascist like Hitler. It goes against everything the Democrat party stands for.

Source: Fascism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Socialism: Not a political system, but rather an economic system. Socialists believe in direct ownership and control of resources by all, rather than ownership and control by a select few, including government. Commonly associated with the "working class." Lenin wrongly claimed that Socialism was a transition between Capitalism and Communism.

Since Obama clearly doesn't believe in direct ownership and control of all resources by the people, he can't be a Socialist either. Obama is commonly referred to as a Socialist because of his support of the working class.

Source: Socialism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Marxism: Also known as Communism. Thrives on social conflicts, and believes such conflicts result in future technology and production for the society. Believes a select few should control and exploit the majority, unlike Socialism (meaning that each person gives more than they take).

Since Obama is in favor of extending benefits to those who do not give as much as they take, he clearly can't be a Marxist/Communist.

Source: Marxism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Parliamentary Republic/Monarchy: See Great Britain. I don't think we have to worry about King Obama anytime soon.:rofl:


So there you have it, GMAN. Your free history lesson for today, and prima facie evidence why Obama cannot be all the things you've attributed to him.

Now I challenge you to prove anything I've posted here wrong with legitimate evidence, rather than hearsay, conspiracies, and speculation. I know that your regular information sources normally don't provide you with much more than talking points (hence the fact that you're up in arms about czars, even though it's a term that Ronald Reagan coined for advisors, and have NEVER been subject to Congressional approval, as they have no powers whatsoever), so I'm actually challenging you to go out and find the information. I fully expect that you'll gloss over this all, and dismiss it immediately, so I'm begging you - prove me wrong. I'd delight in you producing legitimate proof to show that Obama is a Fascist/Socialist/Marxist/Monarch.