I've done the job myself. There were enough chances for the same thing to happen while I was training, but didn't because I was there in the cab with the trainee. "It's new blacktop and the road is wet. You may not make the curve at this speed." It was as simple as that. But, if the truck hydroplaned, and the trainer was in the bunk, I question whether the trainer was qualified, and I don't have to assume anything. The trainer was in the bunk, training was not taking place. It's as simple as that. It's an excellent example of: "A TRAINEE TEACHING HIMSELF/HERSELF CAN BE FATAL." There is NOTHING I need to assume.

 

All the company needs to do is look at the log pages and know what is going on. If the trainer is on line 2 while the trainee is on line 3, no training is going on. Simple as that. Look at the miles driven. Where is the trainee when the trainer is on line 3.

For the company, it's more fright hauled and more revenue, for the trainer, it's more miles driven and more money. GREED, PURE AND SIMPLE. But, this time, it came back and bit them, and a potentially good man died. So, you're out of order on that one too.

 

I told my students to use a good ...water based...lube for deliverng the load SOLO or just spit and stroke, because oil based lubes are hard to get off and the hands can slip on the steering wheel ,And I highly suspect the swift mentor neglected this tutorial ,and the student bought vasoline b/c it was CHEAP and it was his demise...Damn you vasoline!!!... taking another unkNowing Swift rookie who never knew your dangers...DAMN YOU !!!

 

LOL...dont go throwing that word around NOW.....you know.."professionalism"...because you obviously still need to go back and look it up in the dictionary. I am HARDLY a 'supertrucker'. I'm not the one beating my chest saying "...i've done that before...and that isnt how you do it..."...or worse yet, knowing WHAT exactly was being said or done in the accident truck in the days and weeks before.

You are a class act, and you STILL cannot accept that a fellow DRIVER was killed. You still like to refer to him as a 'student'. (which he is, but he is STILL a driver).

grow a pair.

 

Yep.... sadly killed by an inept " trainer " and by a company who has a very poor training curriculum..... :roll:

Now work on a response that you pick out from your coolie carriers handbook.....

It is interesting that nearly everyone (except for your "Good Buddy" buckshot ) who has responded on this topic has proven you wrong at every turn.....:rofl:

What a tool....:rofl:

 

You that desperate even NOW that you have to fabricate crap in a vein effort not to look totally stupid?

Wrong at every turn? Tell me where i am wrong when i said it wasnt a good idea to base an opinion on guesswork. Almost everyone here ASSumes they know what was going on, being said in that truck in the hours, days and weeks leading up to the wreck. It is all SPECULATION. the FACTS are, the trainer was in the sleeper, Mr. Fay was going too fast and/or fell asleep at the wheel for road conditions. Everything else is speculation.

As far as your OPINION to company procedures, unless you have a company handbook, you have no real clue what they are. Again you are left to ASSume you know. And pretty much every company has the same general format. Train or hire a student, test them, get on road training, test again, and if you show you're competent enough, you get upgraded to your own truck. Now some schools run for 2 weeks, some run for 10. The school i went to ran 3.

So....point out where my FACTS are wrong...please point out where i'm proven wrong at every turn. Time to wake up, and quit living in your dream world.

 

Let me start at the bottom and work my way up. My last speeding ticket was inMarch of 1980. I was driving my sisters brand new Camero Z28, headed west on I-80 to Wendover NV for a 4-day weekend. My car was in the shop for a blown rear main-seal..so Sis let me take her car. She was pregers at the time, so didn't really want to be driving around in the snow. I was doing 95 going across the salt flats. The car drove so smooth and quietly...I didn't look at the speedo. I shoulda looked at the speedo.

Since 1979 I have ZERO log violations...None..zip...nada. Of course....Your not going to believe that...but I don't really give a flying......! I have had my log book checked by CHP at Dunsmuir, Cottonwood, Bannin, Long Beach, and Truckee scales. By the NV DOT at variuos open scales, by WY scales in Evanston, Kemmerer, Cheyenne, in NE, in CO, in NM, in LA, in MS, OH, OR, WA, ID, UT, MT, TX, SD, MN, IL, GA...and a couple others I am sure. No tickets...zip...never. In CA way back in 1980 I learned how they check your speed against your logs. The supervisor at the Wheeler Ridge scales was married to one of the senior dispatchers in Bakersfield, at the company I worked for. He showed me how they did it then. NOW they use the computer and your license plate number.

As for the death of Mr. Fay.

One more time. The trainer should have been in the jump seat. Period. No excuses...no "He might" haves. He should have been doing what he was being paid to do...train Mr. Fay. That stretch of road is 10 times better now, than it was in 1987-1988. There is no good reason for that accident.

If Mr. Fay was swerving to avoid a car jumping from the left lane to the exit, which is highly possible...The trainer should have been there to keep him under control.

YOU work for SWIFT....Go chase down the trainer and ask what he remembers about that accident. IF he can't remember anything...he was asleep.

MY only problem with Mr .Fay's death, is his lack of training. He died in his 4th week of training...he was severly lacking in that. Had he been receiving proper training, he would not be dead.............and we would not be having this debate.

 

Let me tell you a little story. I cannot make this a short story, so you will have to deal with that. I know you only have the attention span just long enough to take a wiz...but try to pay attention.

The year was 1977, the place was the Canary Islands. This plane was enroute to Las Palmas on Gran Canaria. A bomb exploded in the terminal, and this plane was diverted (along with others) to Tenerife. Once Gran Canaria International Airport was reopened, planes were allowed to depart Tenerife. The ramp was so congested, that the only way for this plane to get out, was to taxi up the runway, and once it reached the end, turn 180 degrees, and take off. However the crew was told to hold and wait because another plane was going to taxi up the same runway, turn part way up and allow the first plane to take off. The delay had been so long that the captian was in such to hurry and take off. Bad weather was rolling in, alot of stress was put on everybody. Well guess what, the captian forgot to wait, and decided to just go. the first officer corrected the captian once about rushing to take off, and didnt think he was in position to correct him a 2nd time. Guess what....one of the worst avaiation accidents (until 9/11) occured, killing several hundred people, and only 61 survivors.

Now, knowing just those facts, how many years experience did this captian have? Was he a trainer? (what we call in the industry a 'check-airman') Was he well respected? I'll let you ponder that for a minute.








tick-tock.







The Captian was Jacob van Zanten of KLM Airways. He was in command of a 747 (the plane they hit was also a 747 operated by Pan-Am). Oh, and he was a check-airman. Captain van Zanten was not only senior in rank, but also one of the most able and experienced pilots working for the airline. Captain Jacob van Zanten was the preferred pilot for KLM publicity such as magazine advertisements. As such, KLM attempted to contact him to give public statements regarding the disaster and help investigating, before learning that he was the captain involved.

Now, could you know from just the information I gave you about van Zanten's credentials? Hardly. But had you been an avaiation buff, you would have speculated that he was an inexperienced pilot who had not paid his dues and been exposed to the different condtions being a major airline pilot brings. You would rather speculate rather than use the brain (as small as it might be) god gave you, and put it to good use and do some well thought out, independant thinking. You'd rather ASSume, and slam a company that currently is the doormat of the industry. B

 

First part....if he cannot remember anything that does not PROVE he was sleeping. As another poster claims that ..."he was sound asleep". How the HELL do you know what state of sleep he was in?? Could he or couldn't he have just been laying there because they did a driver change 10 miles ago? yes or no?? Could he have been in a period of deep REM sleep, because they did a driver change a half hour ago?? Yes or no?? You do not know what was going on, other than there was an accident. I will admit, if Mr. Fay's skills were lacking, and the trainer left him up there to fend for himself, yeah, trainers fault big time. Since you automaticly assume you know the level of training Mr. Fay received in the month and a half prior to the accident, please tell me where he went to school? Can you tell me if his mentor and him shook hands when introduced at the termianl? heck, did they even meet at a terminal? maybe they met at a Denny's?? You want to speculate so much, please fill me in what their last meal together was?? And even if i did run into the mentor, and asked him, if he dont remember, don't mean he was sleeping. You've never heard of PTSD? Some event in your life stressed you out so much, you have memory loss. How about i go track down Alex Zanardi and ask him about his big wreck in Germany where he lost his legs. He wont remember (dont remember) that leading up to the crash....oh...but according to you, if you dont remember, you were sleeping. ..... gotcha.

as far as the last highlighted passage. Seeing how I recieved the same level of training (obviously it is the exact same right? because poor training is allowed because of Swift standards, yeah? and because Swift has such poor requirements to 'complete' said training, correct???) how am i still alive, and not dead?? Tell me when was the last student driver/mentor accident with swift??

 

It is pathetic that you and your lack of experience in this industry is defending the actions of this " Trainer" (and your beloved company Swift) who was in the sleeper as stated by the WSP.

Maybe one day when you grow up to be a man, you will actually understand this topic....... But I doubt it......