[redsfan]

Great, I'm glad to hear that we're all on the same page. I, too, am not very good at expressing my true feelings at times. Not like Slim, man that guy brings a boatload of facts and info to back it up! I thought the debate between he and Fozzy on religion was one of the best posts on this board and I was sorry to see it locked. That's still another story for a different post...

My apologies to you, Mack. It's great to read and participate in these debates here. I think it keeps us all young. Now back to the Gay Rights thing...

[dieselgrl]

I believe that all people, regardless of their religion, age, sexual preference, color, origin...whatever... deserve the same rights as anyone else.

Now, I'm not a Christian, but it makes me stop and pause... what makes man think they know what a god wants? What gives us the right to legislate that? It was my impression that the Christian God was supposed to be all loving and understanding - he seems rather exclusive and hateful to me based on this entire argument.

It's just my opinion, but for those who stated bible verses as the reason for opposition, why not give everyone the same basic rights on earth, and let your God decide what is moral during your judgement time? :?

[redsfan]

Originally Posted by tndieselgrl

I believe that all people, regardless of their religion, age, sexual preference, color, origin...whatever... deserve the same rights as anyone else.

Now, I'm not a Christian, but it makes me stop and pause... what makes man think they know what a god wants? What gives us the right to legislate that? It was my impression that the Christian God was supposed to be all loving and understanding - he seems rather exclusive and hateful to me based on this entire argument.

It's just my opinion, but for those who stated bible verses as the reason for opposition, why not give everyone the same basic rights on earth, and let your God decide what is moral during your judgement time? :?

I don't think anyone here tried to judge them, I know I said that it was my place to judge them, but my "belief" is that they will go to hell in a handbasket if they do not accept the Lord Jesus Christ. IMO, God will judge them, not me. He is all loving and understanding, but you must accept him. Kinda like, my wife and I are married and we both love each other dearly, but I can't expect her to love me if I abuse daily her and deny her entire existence. May not be the best analogy, but you get the picture.

I am all for the same basic rights for everyone, just not special rights. It is my "opinion" that a person's decision to live a certain sexual lifestyle is not the same as being born a certain race or gender. I'm not pushing that belief onto you, that is just my personal belief.

I won't get into quoting scripture because there are many others here who are much much better at that than I am. If that's even what you're looking for???

[Ridge Runner]

Well since I hi-jacked the thread eairlier, I guess I can add to the orgional topic too.

Also sorry for naming Slim as the OP. ( But he is the one that usually starts this kind of thread :lol: )

Damn.....What a tough subject !!!

My thoughts....mixed.

Here is a run-down of my experences with gays: Grade school and middle school; There were always a couple of guys that seemed a little more on the "girlish" side and by highschool, we all kinda figured it but didn't really know ( this was the 70's in a SMALL town in the SOUTH ) Nobody talked about it but it was always assumed. It turned out these two WERE gay BUT and this is a BIG BUT: They both had issues as to how they were raised, one with only a mom and 3 sisters and NO father, the other was only chld with absent parents. They were both "cool" and had many friends and got along well in school with their peers. Who knows what will shape a young mind at an early age?

A few years later I meet a guy and we become friends. We have a lot in common. We hunt and fish and camp together for 3 + years. We have our work and other interests but we always got together for opening day of trout fishing, deer season, ect.... He one day tells me he is gay :shock: LAST person I ever expected to hear that from. Long story short: He was the best man at my wedding. Enough said!

And last but not least: My trainer 1 year ago. He ( IMHO ) was gay by choice because it was "cool" to be gay. All in all he was a person that I have NO respect for. Not because he was "gay" but he was just a bad person in general. He treated his "lover" badly, he lied to him ( I was in the truck and couldn't help over hear ). He lived to be gay.

So: Social environment, born that way, choice? I wish I had the answers.

Being raised Southern Baptist I know the bible too well. The first two, I don't know, can god change them? Yea. The last example, if he don't change his ways, he will rott in hell.

JMHO

[bulldog2036]

..tndieselgrl, sounds to me that YOU are judging GOD....HE does not owe US any explanations....personally I disagree with gay marriage but it is not for me to intercede....GOD will deal with all of us when the time comes whether you want to believe that or not......Peace to you....bd

[Slimland]

Originally Posted by tndieselgrl

I believe that all people, regardless of their religion, age, sexual preference, color, origin...whatever... deserve the same rights as anyone else.

Now, I'm not a Christian, but it makes me stop and pause... what makes man think they know what a god wants? What gives us the right to legislate that? It was my impression that the Christian God was supposed to be all loving and understanding - he seems rather exclusive and hateful to me based on this entire argument.

It's just my opinion, but for those who stated bible verses as the reason for opposition, why not give everyone the same basic rights on earth, and let your God decide what is moral during your judgement time? :?

What makes man think he knows what God want's?

That is a good question, In the bible God speaks of what he wants for his children. For example "Love your neibor as yourself" that is a will of God!

God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah for the exact thing we are speaking of. Did he give them a chance YES, he told Abraham "after some Jewing down" that if he found 10 Righteous fellows, He "GOD" would not burn it down. The only fellow that was found was Lot and his doughters and wife.

So 2 Angels let Lot and His family flea into the mountains. While God rained fire down from Heaven to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah. This was done as an Example for those in the futur, who will deny God.
It's not realy the fact of what they where doing "which has somewhat to do with it" it was the fact that they denied God. For if it was what they where doing then Lot would have not been saved. Because the word of God said Every day Lot soul was vexed with what he had seen. The word vexed, meaning Tempted, therfor being greived that he felt that way, but he knew right from wrong and chose the right way instead of the wrong way. Think about this after he fled his wife looked back and was turned to ash, after being in the moutains his daughters got him drunk and had sex with him. Thats pretty bad! But God knew where Lots heart was!!

The post I made earlier on this thread, about Romans explain why people fall into the ways of debouchery against God.

He is loving and understanding that is why He gave His Son for Our Sin.
Concerning Moral and Basic right!
Morality itself comes from God, it shows the Laws written on our hearts. Basic right, was given by those laws, not to be imputed to Immorality.

You say your not a Christian, I respect that. What do you believe " if you don't mind me askin"? I will understan if you wish not to answer, I am just curiouse!!

[redsfan]

Originally Posted by Slimland

What makes man think he knows what God want's?

That is a good question, In the bible God speaks of what he wants for his children. For example "Love your neibor as yourself" that is a will of God!

God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah for the exact thing we are speaking of. Did he give them a chance YES, he told Abraham "after some Jewing down" that if he found 10 Righteous fellows, He "GOD" would not burn it down. The only fellow that was found was Lot and his doughters and wife.

So 2 Angels let Lot and His family flea into the mountains. While God rained fire down from Heaven to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah. This was done as an Example for those in the futur, who will deny God.
It's not realy the fact of what they where doing "which has somewhat to do with it" it was the fact that they denied God. For if it was what they where doing then Lot would have not been saved. Because the word of God said Every day Lot soul was vexed with what he had seen. The word vexed, meaning Tempted, therfor being greived that he felt that way, but he knew right from wrong and chose the right way instead of the wrong way. Think about this after he fled his wife looked back and was turned to ash, after being in the moutains his daughters got him drunk and had sex with him. Thats pretty bad! But God knew where Lots heart was!!

The post I made earlier on this thread, about Romans explain why people fall into the ways of debouchery against God.

He is loving and understanding that is why He gave His Son for Our Sin.
Concerning Moral and Basic right!
Morality itself comes from God, it shows the Laws written on our hearts. Basic right, was given by those laws, not to be imputed to Immorality.

You say your not a Christian, I respect that. What do you believe " if you don't mind me askin"? I will understan if you wish not to answer, I am just curiouse!!

See what I mean? Dang Slim, you're good at what you do, I'll give you that! A few hours of sitdown conversation and you just might give an ole redneck soul like me a little edjumacation...

I also, agree with RR on this. However, I will say that I hope my best man doesn't turn out to be gay cuz I actually slept with him once and, my goodness, what would that make me??? Actually, we were in grade school and I had a sleepover at his house and nothing sexual happened at all, but still in a small town such as this, the rumors could run rampant!

And RR, I believe I was the one who highjacked this thread with my statement on democracy so don't you steal my thunder... The important thing is, that now we have it back on the right track and all is well in the forum.

[Slimland]

See what I mean? Dang Slim, you're good at what you do, I'll give you that! A few hours of sitdown conversation and you just might give an ole redneck soul like me a little edjumacation...

I also, agree with RR on this. However, I will say that I hope my best man doesn't turn out to be gay cuz I actually slept with him once and, my goodness, what would that make me??? Actually, we were in grade school and I had a sleepover at his house and nothing sexual happened at all, but still in a small town such as this, the rumors could run rampant!

And RR, I believe I was the one who highjacked this thread with my statement on democracy so don't you steal my thunder... The important thing is, that now we have it back on the right track and all is well in the forum.[/quote]

Thank-you, But it is not I that speaks but the Holy Spirit! I take no credit.

I have friend that are Gay also, I donot approve of there lifestyle, but it's there lifestyle not mine. Jesus never said we couldnot speak or be friends with these people, on the contrary we are to love them, and let the love of Christ shine through us. The ones that Jesus and the Apostles warned us about are the one who know God, and use him for Financial gain, and say they are a brother but deny the Lord that saved them. You are not even suposed to eat with such a person. EXAMPLE " the pharasees and saducees" the knew God, They knew his word, but relied on the traditions of men, than mercy, love, and faith.

[rikki_359]

Slim, I have no idea if my friend claimed Jesus Christ, silent or aloud. I know he used to be married and had 3 or 4 kids, I guess women weren't THAT bad, he he, and used to be in the Armed Forces. Him and his parner met at the big gay church in Ft Worth so maybe.....I hope so

[Slimland]

Originally Posted by rikki_359

Slim, I have no idea if my friend claimed Jesus Christ, silent or aloud. I know he used to be married and had 3 or 4 kids, I guess women weren't THAT bad, he he, and used to be in the Armed Forces. Him and his parner met at the big gay church in Ft Worth so maybe.....I hope so

I hope so too.