[Nighttrain71]

Tough question. Seems like no matter how one answers, someone else could spot a way that it will be abused. Add more hours? Dispatch will abuse that privilage. mandatory break periods? Those will be pencil whipped by a lot of drivers. Force the industry into 8 hour days like the rest of the blue collar world? A lot of drivers would starve to death. Listen to the oblivious members of PATT and forbid overnight driving? I don't even want to think about the parking problems and traffic jams that would cause. As for me, I like simple

Go back to ten on 8 off (Who cares if I spend 8 or ten hours parked at a truck stop, I'm not likely to sleep more than six. One wonders if this change wasn't lobbied for by the video game and vending indusrty.)

Dump the 14 hour rule. (If I spend 2 hours sitting on dock, sound asleep in the bunk, why is it counted against my driving day? And how are we improving safety by discoraging breaks?)

Keep the 34 hour rule (The rest of the world is considered fully rested after a weekend off, why aren't OTR drivers?)

Change the max hours to 10 per day (as opposed to 70 in 8 ) and institute a 13 day work rule (as many states have for hourly employees.) Simply put, If I can run ten in a day, that should be everyday. But mandate a day off at least once every two weeks.

[yoopr]

go back to the old 10/8

[Maveric]

My personal point of view (now keep in mind that I am not a driver, yet) is to keep the current HOS rules but take EVERYTHING that is considered ON DUTY-NOT DRIVING and make that OFF DUTY. That gives you pleanty of hours to get decent miles and decent rest, that has a realistic chance of getting approved through DOT and the buractic red tape BS. Some of the post folks have made are totall wishfull thinking and COULDN'T be implemnted for 10+ years as it would take restructuring the entire industry from the ground up.

[Nighttrain71]

Originally Posted by Maveric

My personal point of view (now keep in mind that I am not a driver, yet) is to keep the current HOS rules but take EVERYTHING that is considered ON DUTY-NOT DRIVING and make that OFF DUTY. That gives you pleanty of hours to get decent miles and decent rest, that has a realistic chance of getting approved through DOT and the buractic red tape BS. Some of the post folks have made are totall wishfull thinking and COULDN'T be implemnted for 10+ years as it would take restructuring the entire industry from the ground up.

Bear with me, I am merely playing devils advocate here. The truth is, you would never get that proposal through the FMCSA. The key purpose of the HOS rules is to cut down on drivers operating while fatigued / not alert. Now, it could be argued that an "on duty - not driving" activity such as fueling, attending a meeting or handling paperwork does not add to ones fatigue level. But, if we consider the fact that lumping 30,000 pounds of freight is also an "on duty - not driving" activity, then we must concede that some ODND activities do lead directly to fatigue. The only way we could possibly separate such things would be to create a very long and arduous list of activities that do and do not count, which is unlikely to make it through an sort of public debate.

The old HOS seemed to work rather well. But the old HOS changed. Why? Organizations like Parents Against Tired Truckers (PATT) lobbied hard and long for the change. There position being: truckers should be like everyone else, work 8 hours per day and only during daylight hours. Of course, that is ridiculous, but what else can be expected from a group of soccer moms that wouldn't know where to put the fuel nozzle on a semi tractor? Of course, the trucking industry (OOIDA, TCA, ATA etc.) had some different ideas about HOS. The new rules are an attempt at compromise. If the current mess of regulations is the best that could be hammered out, maybe it's best not to suggest any change at all.

[Maveric]

Well I have to agree with you there Nighttrain71, I would have swore that I had listed Lumping as the exception to that but I guess I didn't. And you are correct that the general (aka-non trucking) public has no clue what truckers have to do to make ends meat. Considering that a truck driver is held to a standard 10X that of a 4 wheeler, and has allot more training in the driving department.

[Nighttrain71]

As I said, I was only playing devils advocate. I've heard so many of the arguments against us that I can pretty much figure out what to expect next. I think that is what bugs me the most about the new HOS. It used to be that the Feds did their research, the industry argued there points and on we went. The new HOS is the first time that "citizens groups" (read: "woefully ignorant crybabies") got involved. It's hard enough for us to make a living, we don't need our work rules being advocated by outsiders with no concearn for us.

If it's any consolation, I do like your idea on it's face. Of course, I also like the idea of prohibitiing driver lumping in all of it's forms (except for chaining and tarping.) Then again, I wouldn't object to keeping the 14 hour rule, if it leads to more drop and hook (the only way to stop dock time from hurting us is to stop dock time.)

[Maveric]

Very true, the nice thing about the drop and hook and lumping issues that you mention is that, that can be done without any regulation. That is up to the trucking companies. If they stop offering it to their clients/customers the problem goes away and free's up the driver to do what he is paid to do, DRIVE.

[crow]

by "Highwayman"

You all are making it too damn complicated!

Hey, Highwayman....

Remember, you're dealing with bureaucrats and way too many drivers who've been institutionalized.

You got it exactly right! Good for you.

Randy

[kentucky orphan]

Just so it has been said, and in no way advocating a national "union".
Also not saying that the drivers point of view does not matter. You have to realize that the reason groups like PATT get their agendas recognized is that there are a lot of them and they are organized. I might add that they are this way because they don't work 14 to 18 hours a day bringing to market all of the things that they take for granted " will just show up". Until we drivers stop arguing about this and get together, what we think really doesn't count for much. However, should we ever get even 25% of the drivers out there to make the phone calls and write the letters then we can get something done. There are over 4 million of us. 25% is 1 million. Any way you cut it that's one heck of a constituency. People say that drivers can't change anything. Well I tell you we can. We just can't do it griping from the bleachers. If you want to effect change you have to get on the field. Get on the damn field.