Sorry, Bigtimba..... those of us you sent to the corner, are now at the corner BAR drinking a beer on YOUR tab!! YOU are going back one grade in school for flunking English! :lol: :lol:
Quote:
The language:
May not drive after 60/70 hours on duty in 7/8 consecutive days.
A driver may restart a 7/8 consecutive day period after taking 34 or more consecutive hours off duty.
The link:
http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regul...ochure2005.htm
It's not "may or may not" in either case.
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First, let's start with basic English. May only has one meaning. That you CAN do something if you WANT to.... but are not REQUIRED to do it.
May NOT has only ONE meaning.... that you CANNOT do it legally.
Ever play the game of "mother may I?" You ask her if you MAY. If she answers NO... you MAY NOT... you can't MOVE. If she answers Yes, you MAY.... it means you are ALLOWED to move.... but not REQUIRED to move.
Now.... if you change that word to SHALL, you will be COMPELLED to move if she tells you that YOU SHALL... and cannot move if she says YOU SHALL NOT. The correlation here is that MAY and SHALL mean a nearly oppposite thing when used without NOT. However, they mean exactly the SAME thing when used WITH "not."
So.... if you have reached 70 hours in 8 days, you MAY NOT nor SHALL not move until you EITHER take a 34 hour restart... OR... gain back hours at midnight that night IF you have any to gain.
Conversely, if you burn your 70 hours in less than 8 days, you MAY take 34 hours off and start all over even if you've only been working for 5 days or so, but.... NO ONE is telling you that you SHALL take a 34 hour restart before driving again. You MAY also sit on your arse and WAIT for the 9nth day and get back ONLY the hours from day 1 that have now been DEDUCTED from the 70 that you've used. But, again... NO ONE is telling you that you SHALL have to take the 34 hour reset, nor that you SHALL wait until day 9..... UNTIL or UNLESS the current rules are finally struck down which would ELIMINATE the 34 hour reset option and then, if you burn 70 in 5 days..... YOU SHALL have to and WILL have to wait until day 9!
Although I agree that the FMCSA sometimes is confusing, in THIS case THEY are using the right terminology with the CORRECT definitons. YOU are the one that is misinterpreting the definiton of MAY.
In summation... You MAY take the 34 hour reset (as they say... at ANY time... you might even have used only 50 hours... to get a NEW 70 hour tour of duty.) OR you MAY wait until you have hours to get back from day 1 .... which won't be until day 9.
But, IF you have burned your 70 in less than 8 days, you MAY not drive again until you've done ONE or the OTHER in my last sentence.
Futhermore... there is NO advantage to stopping at 69.75 hours. You're just wasting 15 minutes. IF you are on day 8, you will get hours back at midnight (if you worked on the 8th day back,) if you are on day 6 or 7, you will not get ANY hours back at midnight, and would only have 15 mins to DRIVE the next day... although you COULD work on line 4.
I'm sorry if this is a bit confusing..... but all our attempts at a SIMPLE explanation seem to have gone over a few heads here! :lol:
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You reset at 70, no ifs, ands or buts.
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Totally false and without foundation in the regs!
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The poster who recommended you stop the clock at 69.75 to keep your 70 alive is correct. The only way you can recapture your day 1 hours on day 9 is to have left time (not be at 70) on day 8.
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NO, he's NOT. You are allowed to drive/work combined EVERY last friggin minute of your 70 within 8 days. After that.... you can even WORK the rest of that day if you want.. (making it say... 80 hours!) You just can't DRIVE! There is NO penalty or violation for this. At midnight, you will get back whatever hours you WORKED (combined) on day 1... and you can DRIVE only 11 for that day as long as you HAVE them. You might get back 16 hours that day if you drove 11 and worked another 5 on day 1. However, you can still only DRIVE 11 of them...... and here's the kicker..... only THAT many if your NEW total of 70 hours DRIVING in the last 8 doesn't exceed 70. It is entirely possible that you WORKED more hours and drove less on day 1, so that NOW, when you recap lines 3 and 4 separately for the last 8 days, you may have STILL driven closer to 70, and therefore you might NOT be able to drive the whole 11 on day 9.... IF it would mean that you STILL had DRIVEN more than 70 in the last 8 days! :shock:
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That's unless a friend who just told me it's 69 even is correct. Her theory is anything more than 69 is out of HOURS. I think she's nuts and I side with 69.75, or less.
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Truth is.... you are BOTH "nuts!" :lol: :lol:
Quote:
May not drive after . . 70 hours on duty in . . 8 consecutive days." Has but one meaning:
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Correct!
Quote:
At the time you reach 70 within 8, you are done with lines 3 + 4 until you complete 34 consecutive hours on lines 1 and/or 2
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But.... THIS ain't it!! :roll: This is totally false on more than ONE basis! You are NOT "done" with line 4 at all.... and you do NOT have to take 34 hours off
IF you have hours to gain at midnight!
Quote:
"A driver may restart a . . 8 consecutive day period after taking 34 or more consecutive hours off duty." has a dual meaning:
1. It is your only remedy for reaching 70 hours in 8 (or fewer) days
2. You can reset at anytime prior to reaching 70 and restart your 8 consecutive days.
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No.... it doesn't! #1 is totally false! #2 is the ONLY true statement you have made.... and "MAY" does NOT mean "SHALL."
What that reg MEANS.... is that you don't HAVE to live off the hours you'll gain back each night. You MAY say "that's not gonna keep me rolling well enough.... I think, since I'm out of hours at 2 a.m. on my 8th day, and I'm ONLY gonna gain..say... 5 hours from day 1.. IF I SIT HERE ALL DAY... !!
I think I'll just shut down the REST of today (22 hours) and sleep thru tomorrow night (12 hours) and start with a FRESH "tour of duty" at NOON on day 9!! I'll then have a fresh 70, fresh 11, and fresh 14!! That will allow me to drive until 11 pm on day 9 and reach my shipper, whereas.... I couldn't GET there with only 5 hours!!!
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Rev, Ironeagle, TK, ct77, golfhobo, NotSteve . . go stand in the corner and face the wall . . the rest of you come join me at the bar.
Case closed.
Jury dismissed.
Next case.
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Sorry.... NOT happening! The case is closed.... but YOU lost! :lol:
Quote:
On an unrelated matter; does anyone know the square root of 69?
I'm no mathematician but I think it's around 8 something .
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You want to discuss advanced Trucker math.... and you haven't even masterd simple ENGLISH yet??? :shock: :roll: :lol: :lol:
Besides, square roots have nothing to do with how many hours a day one can work without busting his 70 hour clock. That has been established as being EXACTLY 8.75 hours. But, it is not related to the square root of 70 (or 69) and in fact could NOT be unless we were allowed 76.56 hours a week! But.... I guess you were just WONDERING! :lol: :lol:
However.... you are close. Don't feel like grabbing the calculator at the moment, but 8 is the square root of 64..... and 2 is the square root of 4. That might INDICATE something close to 8.2.... because 3 is the root of 9. And 64 + 9 = 73. HOWEVER.... it doesn't WORK that way as 8.3 squared is actually closer to 68.9 not 73. So.... the answer would be something like 8.3XX! :lol: :lol:
BTW...... thanks for the beer! :wink: