Beer on the Road
#71
10-18-2007, 06:09 PM
Originally Posted by Rev.Vassago
Originally Posted by Useless
Re: FMCSA, I thought it was more of a state by state issue. I'm no expert in this area.
Preach, Rev!!
§392.5 Alcohol prohibition.
(a) No driver shall— (a)(1) Use alcohol, as defined in §382.107 of this subchapter, or be under the influence of alcohol, within 4 hours before going on duty or operating, or having physical control of, a commercial motor vehicle; or (a)(2) Use alcohol, be under the influence of alcohol, or have any measured alcohol concentration or detected presence of alcohol, while on duty, or operating, or in physical control of a commercial motor vehicle; or (a)(3) Be on duty or operate a commercial motor vehicle while the driver possesses wine of not less than one-half of one per centum of alcohol by volume, beer as defined in 26 U.S.C. 5052(a), of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954, and distilled spirits as defined in section 5002(a)(8), of such Code. However, this does not apply to possession of wine, beer, or distilled spirits which are: (a)(3)(i) Manifested and transported as part of a shipment; or (a)(3)(ii) Possessed or used by bus passengers. (c) Any driver who is found to be in violation of the provisions of paragraph (a) or (b) of this section shall be placed out-of-service immediately for a period of 24 hours. MORE than "just a bit." It specifically answers the question of whether the reg applies to a driver using his (or a company's) truck as a "personal conveyance" while OFF DUTY!
Question 3: Does the prohibition against carrying alcoholic beverages in §392.5 apply to a driver who uses a company vehicle, for personal reasons, while off-duty?
Guidance: No. For example, an owner-operator using his/her own vehicle in an off-duty status, or a driver using a company truck or tractor for transportation to a motel, restaurant, or home, would normally be outside the scope of this section. So, given the fact that the FMCSA interpretations specifically state there is a prohibition against carrying alcoholic beverages, and if you are in your CMV, there is the potential that you could go on duty at any given time. WHAT??? NOT if you are out of HOS, and are on a required break! Yeah, you COULD be "asked" to go on duty, but you CANNOT be forced to DRIVE beyond your hours! Let's say you were parked in a truck stop, drinking in your sleeper, and someone bumped into you, and you got out to investigate. You just went on duty, and are in violation. If you are even sitting in your driver's seat, you are considered on duty, and would be in violation if you had alcohol in the truck. This is a REAL stretch! First of all, as answering your qualcom while on break is NOT considered "on duty," this is NOT a "safety sensitive" function, and you can call the cops and let THEM be "on duty." As for "sitting in the driver's seat," the regs refer to a CMV IN OPERATION! If you are on a required break, your CMV cannot be "in operation." So, if you can figure out a way whereby you do not go to the controls of your CMV (this would include starting the truck to idle it, going to the restroom, getting out for any reason whatsoever), then you can have alcohol in your CMV. It is VERY simple to get in and out of your truck, FOR ANY REASON, without "going to the controls." It's called the PASSENGER DOOR! :roll: I would love to know, however, how you managed to get the alcohol into your CMV without being at the controls.
__________________
Remember... friends are few and far between. TRUCKIN' AIN'T FOR WUSSES!!! "I am willing to admit that I was wrong." The Rev.
#72
10-18-2007, 06:14 PM
"What part of this do I not understand??" Don't get your bowels into an uproar, Golf!! :shock: I specifically told you that I wasn't calling you wrong, but rather I was I was merely asking a question!! Take a Chill Pill, Cuz!! 
#73
10-18-2007, 06:32 PM
Originally Posted by Molson
So can you stop at the store, pick up a six, put it in the truck, drive to the motel? or no.
IF you are still draggin a trailer full of crap, and you are under a load... manifested.... you CANNOT do so! But, once you get to the truckstop, and are OFF DUTY, you CAN drop the trailer/load and use the CMV/Bobtail as a "personal conveyance" to go get "supplies." You can do this EVEN if you have driven your full 11 hours for the day, and you can CARRY "unopened" alcohol back to your point of shutdown for the night. But, to echo the wise advise of those who got it RIGHT on this thread.... make sure that there is no "trash" or evidence in your truck OR your bloodstream when you, once again, go "on duty" again! Go to the motel first. Drop the trailer (IF it is "laden," or NOT for that matter,) and THEN drive a reasonable distance to get what you need/want for the night. If at a truckstop, and they allow it, drop the trailer and go do what you want. When you return.... park in front of the trailer, but DO NOT HOOK UP! If the trailer is loaded, but you are NOT "hooked" to it, you are NOT "laden." Now, remember that this "tractor" is now your personal conveyance. If you go to a bar in it and drink and drive back to the motel, you can get busted! Same for an OPEN container! But, the guidance CLEARLY states that using the CMV as a personal conveyance, while unladen, is like using your POV. You are under the same rules as a civilian.... but you are NOT under the "scope" of the regs against OPERATING a CMV (laden) with alcohol in the truck.
__________________
Remember... friends are few and far between. TRUCKIN' AIN'T FOR WUSSES!!! "I am willing to admit that I was wrong." The Rev.
#74
10-18-2007, 06:38 PM
Guest
Posts: n/a
I'm sort of doing the Bob Newhart drinking game right now. Every time Hobo makes a post, I have a drink.
I'm so Shitzfaced right now I can't remember my own name.
#75
10-18-2007, 06:43 PM
Originally Posted by golfhobo
It is ALSO legal, once off duty, to drive your UNLADEN truck to the Walmart or grocery store (not a good idea to go to a liquor store - but not illegal) and bring back some beer. And there is NO 14 hour clock considerations here!
Question 26: If a driver is permitted to use a CMV for personal reasons, how must the driving time be recorded?
Guidance: When a driver is relieved from work and all responsibility for performing work, time spent traveling from a driver's home to his/her terminal (normal work reporting location), or from a driver's terminal to his/her home, may be considered off-duty time. Similarly, time spent traveling short distances from a driver's en route lodgings (such as en route terminals or motels) to restaurants in the vicinity of such lodgings may be considered off-duty time. The type of conveyance used from the terminal to the driver's home, from the driver's home to the terminal, or to restaurants in the vicinity of en route lodgings would not alter the situation unless the vehicle is laden. A driver may not operate a laden CMV as a personal conveyance. The driver who uses a motor carrier's CMV for transportation home, and is subsequently called by the employing carrier and is then dispatched from home, would be on-duty from the time the driver leaves home. A driver placed out of service for exceeding the requirements of the hours of service regulations may not drive a CMV to any location to obtain rest.
#76
10-18-2007, 06:49 PM
Originally Posted by Useless
"What part of this do I not understand??" Don't get your bowels into an uproar, Golf!! :shock: I specifically told you that I wasn't calling you wrong, but rather I was I was merely asking a question!! Take a Chill Pill, Cuz!! 1) It's GREAT to see you back on the board! I have MISSED you! 2) Pay attention! :lol: I wasn't talking to YOU.... I was answering the REV's post! :wink: 3) Cut me some slack, will ya?? I'm ONLY on page ONE! :lol: ALL things come to those who WAIT!! 4) A friend of mine, who drove back in the 80's ( I think ) used to stop on his run and get beer to take to the motel. I'm pretty sure THAT is no longer legal (as he was still LADEN.) But, I'm quite confident of my interpretation of the CURRENT rules.... and even the Rev's "guidance" quote supports my view. 5) For the record, I've always considered the Rev's knowledge of the regs to be superior to most.... (not to MINE... but MOST.) That is why I was so shocked when he quoted a "guidance" that contradicted his OWN assertions! 6) I don't EXPECT "you" to know all the answers! YOU are a "fat cat" who manipulated his driver's earnings into an EMPIRE!! :lol: 7) Now.... back to our regularly scheduled "friendly" debate! :lol:
__________________
Remember... friends are few and far between. TRUCKIN' AIN'T FOR WUSSES!!! "I am willing to admit that I was wrong." The Rev.
#77
10-18-2007, 07:30 PM
Originally Posted by Useless
Originally Posted by Molson
So can you stop at the store, pick up a six, put it in the truck, drive to the motel? or no.
Seriously, Molsen, If drinking beer is that important to you, you really need to consider another line of work!! You are beginning to sound a wee bit like "Chad/Col.Toon/BrianGriffinn". If you haven't figuered it out by reading the replies that you are playing with fire, then please take this as your wake-up call and let me spell it out for you. Every now and then, if you are shut down for the night due to weather, or if you are on your 34hr. reset, and you want to get a motel room, call a cab for a ride to the package store & back, or walk to an eatery where adult beverages are offered, providing that there is a place that you can reach safely, and you know when to say "when", then you shouldn't have a problem, as long as your company has no problem with you doing so. On the other hand, beer drinking is so important to you, then this isn't the right career move for you. Can you dig that?? Drinking a few beers when shutdown for the night OR the weekend, is not the same as drug abuse! People on this board are SOMETIMES way too quick to tell someone that they are not "trucker material." I call B.S. on that! Surely, SOME people have a drinking problem.... and if they are not REAL careful and SERIOUS about this job..... it will bite them someday! But, many of us CAN have a few beers when OFF DUTY, expecially when laid over for a day or three, and STILL maintain a professional committment to the job. As for the "company," MINE has flat out told me that they 'understand' that drivers will frequent a bar now and then, when laid over. They have NO problem with it, because they TRUST us to do the right thing. Of course, we're a small company - not a megacarrier - and they know us! The FEW new drivers who "abused" the company's understanding, were fired... sometimes ON THE SPOT (3000 miles from home.) While YOU were "MIA" from the board, Molson came on and asked some good questions about starting out (possibly O/O.) He is in a unique situation. I think I guided him towards the proper forum, and he got some great advice! Now, he's just asking another question about what is and is NOT acceptable. He hasn't gone through a school or orientation yet (to my knowledge,) so he is just ASKING! He CERTAINLY hasn't driven a day down the road, and therefore shouldn't be JUDGED as "WE" are! You've got a GREAT "wit," Useless! And you have given it to those who deserved it quite often! But.... not EVERYONE that you "don't understand" is a Col. Toon! Please don't let your cynicism over those who are NOT seriously looking for guidance.... ROB those who ARE, from your considerable amount of experience and wisdom! :wink: I can't count the times I've read a post from someone who said THIS is the BEST forum on the internet for learning the truth about trucking.... WITHOUT all the personal attacks. I am PROUD to be part of THIS (and no other) board! (with minor exception) Sure, a certain amount of "razzing" occurs here, and I am responsible for my share of it. But THAT'S just "trucking!" :lol: Let's NOT jump to conclusions about the "newbies" who come here, with small post counts, and turn them away from their dreams (or the information they seek,) because WE think we got the keys to our trucks from GOD. I KNOW you are "with" me on this, Useless! So..... nothing more need be said. Unless, of course, you just want to add to your post count! :lol: Hobo
__________________
Remember... friends are few and far between. TRUCKIN' AIN'T FOR WUSSES!!! "I am willing to admit that I was wrong." The Rev.
#79
10-18-2007, 08:09 PM
KC0iv said:
I have yet to find any statement by FMCSA that says you can not have alcohol in your CMV. Only you can not consume alcohol for at least 4 hours before you go on-duty or be under the influence of alcohol.
The regs are pretty CLEAR about NOT having alcohol in a CMV, while in operation... or while you're at the controls. But, I believe they are equally as clear about the exception when you are OFF DUTY, or using the "unladen" CMV as a personal conveyance. The FACT is, folks..... that truckstops are FULL of trucks with guys having a few beers in the sleeper while watching T.V. on a break.... whether a 10 hour, or a RESET. The cops have been known to drive through the lots quite often. They are NOT looking for the responsible trucker who is having a few beers in his "bedroom on the road," or the guy who walked to a bar and came "home" to sleep it off! Every morning, the trash cans are FULL of the evidence! Drinking during a shutdown is as much a part of "TRUCKING" as it is any OTHER part of life.... and the LEO's are equally as concerned/understanding! If your truck is PARKED in a truckstop for the night, and YOU are not causing a problem, THEY have no problem with YOU! They have neither the TIME, Manpower, nor INCLINATION to be any MORE concerned! I am NOT gonna cite regs! I don't LIKE doing so, although I CAN. YOU and the REV have cited them ALL! But, if you will both READ them, you will see that the regs say.... or intend.... that you cannot have alcohol of ANY kind in a CMV that is UNDER OPERATION by the driver! Likewise, they provide an exception for using the tractor as a POV. Steve's conversation with the DOT, PROVES that THEY, at least, are using some common sense where this is concerned! I think we could end ALL the arguments, if people would JUST understand the difference between being ON DUTY, AT THE CONTROLS of a CMV, i.e: DRIVING a LADEN vehicle.... and the OFF DUTY status of a CMV driver!
__________________
Remember... friends are few and far between. TRUCKIN' AIN'T FOR WUSSES!!! "I am willing to admit that I was wrong." The Rev.
#80
10-18-2007, 08:29 PM
Originally Posted by golfhobo
Drinking during a shutdown is as much a part of "TRUCKING" as it is any OTHER part of life
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