[golfhobo]

Originally Posted by kc0iv

golfhobo,

You said "I see no reason why the fmcsa or DOT should object." To which I showed you my reasoning on why I feel the FMCSA and/or the D.O.T. would object. Nothing more nothing less.

Actually, I was saying that I saw no reason why they'd object to speed averaging a bit to get in the miles you should be able to get in 11 hours of driving (and of course, I was saying that tongue in cheek.)...... to which YOU gave 3 regs and a definition that pertained ONLY to how to fill out a RODS and had nothing to do with the topic OR my statement.

I said nothing about how I felt about the rule(s) or how a person can "fudge" the logbook to make it fit. So your statement: "And YOU seem to be "right behind them." is totally uncalled for.

You're probably right! And I didn't mean "YOU" in reference to the Pee Bomb, EITHER! I must learn to use the word "others" instead of the collective "you" when referring to what OTHERS might choose to do! :wink:

However, you DO seem to quote the regs quite consistently in answering people's questions, so it is reasonable to assume that you stand behind them 100%.

I can assure you I have forget more than you know about how to get around "fudging" logbooks. You just haven't driven long enough to know all the "tricks." As an example if "you" haven't figured out how to get around the "14 hour rule" "you" still have a few things to learn.

Oh, I never SAID I couldn't get around it.... I said I didn't NEED to in order to get my miles. AND.... personally, I don't think it is SAFE to "get around" the 14 hour rule..... 'specially when driving 20-40 mph above the speed limit! Perhaps, it is a good thing you retired! :lol:

The last truck I owned was a triple digit truck that had no problem pulling a full load at 100 plus. In fact I have never driven a truck that wouldn't do over 100. Some pulled better than others but all would do over 90 pulling a full load.

And your POINT is? (other than the fact that you were obviosly dangerous to be around when on the road?) :wink:

How "you" interpret the rules is your business. I could care less. It don't affect me one way or the other.

Glad to hear it! :roll:

And I sure don't worry about logging since I'm now retired.

Congratulations!

kc0iv

GEE!! And I was JUST bragging on another forum about how the guys over here had a "sense of humor!' :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :shock:

[Drew10]

Evertruckerr said:

I run for Crete and they demand that you run %100 legal. They audit your logs regularly and do not tolerate any "creative" logging.

Just curious: Why hasnt Crete and the sister companies switch to electronic/paperless logs. Much like Werner's. Ive heard that Crete takes logs very seriously (as all companies should).

Im not sure which computer/satellite system Crete uses, but if its Qualcomm, they own the rights to the electronic/paperless logs that Werner uses. I understand they are available to other companies and are DOT approved.

[ben45750]

Originally Posted by ssoutlaw

I bet there is enough here that play in the gray area on their taxes, but oh no, don’t do it on their logs, I’m a GOOD BOY I don’t have to do that. What a bunch of crap.....lol To the new drivers, don’t do this, your not making any money while you are new so don’t chance it! When you know your as$ from a hole in the ground, then you can let your creative side out to make the system work for YOU!!!!

Originally Posted by ssoutlaw

Give it a couple hrs, and someone will tell me Im wrong....lol

Your 100% right, There is a big difference between running 3 log books and fudging 15 minute breaks here and there to get a couple more miles or save hours. I run 100% legal according to my logs, thats all anyone needs to know.

[Jumbo]

And now you know why they came out with loose leaf log pages. In case you need an extra 15 minutes you can go back and see if you can find it. If you need to run more than 1 book I don't know what to tell you.

[bigdad7]

i agree

untill your ears are no longer wet you should log it as you do it....

i just had a level 3 inspection because i repowered a load and trusted that the driver scaled it in ohio before bringing it to kansas....not that i had a choice their were no scales before the weigh station and low and behold i was overweight .....

i knew my logs were good cause i only work 5 days a week kinda hard to get over that seventy ...i do push it over 60 hrs a week though ....

i do log a split sleeper which i think confused my little dot nitwit but after five minutes with his calculater i got a ticket for 171 dollars and got sent on my way ...then my dispatcher got an earful from me but they knew how to shut me up they paid the ticket and all is right with the world ...next time ill just eat the 30 extra miles and go aroung the scales as i know a few ways aroung that scale...but one small snafu can lead to bigger unintended issues so i do suggest all new drivers don't employee any tricks as i am sure at your student (slave) rate any company will keep you moving

[kc0iv]

golfhobo,

I'm sure you are smart enough to understand the rules and understand that "speed averaging" is not allowed. I'm also sure you understand when the rules says log ALL time you are driving there is no way "speed averaging" can be applied. I also think you understand what is to be shown on your logbook. Now I'm not saying it can't be done. What I said and showed it can not be done legally.

I try to answer people's questions by citing regs so they can see what the regs "say" instead what people "think" they say. In my years of driving I've broke most of the HOS at one time or another. But I don't want someone to say I told them to break and rule. I leave that up to them if they want to drive legally or break the law.

It is interesting that you would condone "speed averaging" but be against breaking the 14 hour rule. One is just as bad as the other. All you are doing by "speed averaging" is extending the 70 hour to get in more miles. The 70 hour rule is in place is an attempt for the driver to get needed rest. The same as the 14 hour rule. It is all in were you add the hours.

Maybe I was lucky or maybe I know how to drive around other vehicles. Having driven almost 1 1/2 millions miles in a truck and another 1 million plus in field service and only having one moving violation and no accidents I guess I must be one lucky guy. That is not counting all the miles I have driven in my personal vehicles.


kc0iv

[cclarke1268]

Originally Posted by ssoutlaw

Give it a couple hrs, and someone will tell me Im wrong....lol

Why?..........SSOutlaw
What you wrote should be the gospel.

and for those who say they log 100% legal.... IF you tinker around on your truck, or fixin cb's, or washing windows,or polishin, or make some phone calls to your company or shipper/ recvr., or ect.............. I bet you guys log that too!! if its over 15 min you should, to be 100% legal. break up a 10 hr break with an example like that and see the ckeck you be totin home on friday :roll: You still gonna say you log 100% legal.

[Skywalker]

I log as legally as the HOS/FMCSR's allow me to. I didn't set up the rules, but I play by them. Am I 100% legal? I won't swear to it, but I'm as close as you can get. What is on our logs is how we get paid....so if we were to cheat, we'd also be cheating ourselves out of money. So....we have no incentive to cheat.

My advice to drivers....if you can't make a living logging it "as close to as you are actually doing it".....then the company you drive for is bottom-feeder. Log it right, and keep it current. The real way to save time and make more money is to keep that freakin' left door closed and get where you are going.

This is because the way that the rules are set up is in 15 min segments... and every time you stop and log a stop for a break...you are more than likely losing time in the book.

Also, if you are quallcom equipped, you should be able to look at the "utilities" screen and see how may miles you have covered and how long it took. Our trucks have both Quallcom's and GeoLogic/MobileMax's. My truck has the Mmax. I covered 510 miles today, in 8 hours. Actually a couple of minutes less than 8 hours, but high enough to round up to the next highest hour...so I logged 8 hours. Thats a 63.75 mph average speed.... Now, ask yourself this: If I can do this with a chemical tanker with a Cummins ISM engine and 45,000 lbs of liquid in a non-baffled tanker.....and I have an "onboard computer" that is downloaded information wise to the home office.....why in the dickens can't you do it legally? I do. And my ECM and SatSys will back up my logs.

Trust me on this.....the DOT is NOT stupid. They can run your routes from point to point and generate a "legal transit time".... shoot, I myself have two programs that will do it as well. SO, before you get too cocky and get to in tune with "shuckin' and Jivin'" the book....and try to do the same with the "Man"....think long and hard about reality.

Before I left CFI last September one the big guys in Safety showed me xerox's of two tickets drivers got....both for logbook violations, one was $1000.00 and the other $518.00. Ask yourself.... Is it worth it? The simple and honest answer is "NO!".

Do what you will, but remember....if you do it wrong, you have no one but yourself to blame when the DOT collects the money before you can leave the scales.....and think about what you're going to tell your wife and kids about how daddy screwed up and there's no money this week and maybe the next cuz' you had to get a cash advance for a logbook violation.

You may get away with it for a while.....but also remember, if there's an accident, and forbid any injuries or a fatality....even if its not your fault, but the injured party or family of the dead person hires a lawyer... a full 180 days of your logs are going to end up in the hands of that lawyer and he's gonna have some real pro's audit them....and just let them find one error in the log.... Ohhhh, the picture he'll paint in court of you....and you will loose the battle.....and not only will you suffer, but also those who depend on you will suffer as well.

Its your life, live it as you will....but if you do it wrong and get caught, just make sure when you start blaming people and pointing that finger...make sure you are standing in front of a mirror.

[stanman63]

i avrg. log 80% of the time i just log at pti time legal until i get to my stop and then rip they get what i put down and i only fuel at the start of my day been doing it that way for a few years no proplems yet i run 693 miles a day given the freight is there

[ben45750]

Originally Posted by Skywalker

I covered 510 miles today, in 8 hours. Actually a couple of minutes less than 8 hours, but high enough to round up to the next highest hour...so I logged 8 hours. Thats a 63.75 mph average speed....

Originally Posted by Skywalker

The real way to save time and make more money is to keep that freakin' left door closed and get where you are going.

IMO.... That is the worst advice you can give to a person. You need to get out of that truck at least every 2 hours and stretch. Yeah, stay out of the truck stops but driving for 8 straight hours is stupid.

Don't believe me? Remember this guy? http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3079105/