[golfhobo]

Mr. Ford said:

But Hobo, China and Iran are cozy with each other?

Are they? I haven't had time to pay attention to minor stuff. Did China (or Russia) veto any of the sanctions placed on Iran by the World community? Besides.... China is pre-emptively placing blame on the Weegers. And THEIR territory is along the "arc."

That would put a dent in their relationship if they took them hostage

By "them" I guess you mean two little Iranian punks who weren't even supposed to BE on the plane? Let's SAY they all land alive somewhere (under Chinese or Chinese Mafia or Weeger control.) So.... a month from now, we hear that the two Iranian "students" were graciously returned to their homeland (that they were trying to escape.) lol. Come ON, man....

and really give Russia a headache too.

Why? Were there some Russians on board? You think China cares about giving Putin a headache? THEY are the booming economic power these days. They would rub it in Putin's FACE.... if he could look away from the mirror long enough!

Just LOOK at how this missing plane has all but "overshadowed" the events in Crimea!

Now.... this is NOT my "theory." It's just ONE of the many I have been considering. Which is MORE than I can say for the media! lol.

[Roadhog]

I wonder how no one got a cell phone call, text, or anything sent out, and it's not posted on youtube.
NSA should have record of any messages.

[chris1]

Maybe it was just repo'd.

[golfhobo]

Mr. Ford said:

Well, Hobo did you hear the Chinese report of a supposed seismic event in the area of last contact off Vietnam? Could a nuke have caused that even at 15 to 35K feet?

Yep. Heard about that AND a possible underwater volcanic eruption nearby. Maybe, the same event? Don't know. Think it was a coincidence. No, an "airblast" of a Nuke at 15 to 35k feet ABOVE sea level would not have caused either of those events. Now.... IF the wings stripped off on a dead man's dive, and the fuselage imbedded in the sea floor AND they had a major nuke warhead on board.... ah but, I don't think the timeframes match.

As for ruling out lack of spatial awareness, go back to the Navy flight that was lost off the coast of Florida, Flight 19. A group of them had no idea where they were and to this day we have no idea where they went down.

The left turn of the plane brought them back to, and over land that they KNEW to be there. Keeping the LAND out of your left window, would bring you right back down the west side of Malaysia, and BTW.... the airport is ON the west side of a ridge of mountains down the middle of Malaysia. IF altitude was a problem.... that would BE the way to return to the airport. Probably IS the standard "return to airport" flight plan for all domiciled flights. I.E: It might have already been stored in the auto pilot! Giving the "new" pilots plenty of time to input "changes" for the next leg of the flight.

Flight 19 had no spatial awareness because they were flying over open ocean. NO land in sight. IIRC... it even happened during daylight, so.... NO star "reckoning." THAT is when you lose all spatial awareness. Without the sophisticated systems we have Today... THEY were overmatched, and simply followed the leader of their "flock."

Cellphones don't have to be placed in airplane mode. I have never set mine to that or turned it off when I fly. Mind you I have zero signal while in the air BUT,

This is not upper Virginia (D.C.) we're talking about here. That far off the coast of a third world country... there are no towers close enough even if you had a megaphone! lol. Hell.... I can't even get a signal from Sprint in parts of NM and AZ! [More good planning?]

supposedly a relative claims to have talked with a passenger on board. Nobody has said if it was before or after the disappearance or if it was before the plane took off.......another hypothetical that has been unanswered.

Been watching MAJOR news outlets since I got home. Haven't heard that little rumor. You reading TheBlaze again? lol.

Maybe if it was terrorism, did they take all cellphones and destroy them? Anyone who doesn't prove they have no cellphone or refuses to give it up is then killed?

IF it was... maybe, they LEARNED from Flight 93? First step... take the plane to 45,000 feet and pop the masks and distract the passengers. They're already OUT of cellphone range and the plane HAS no wi-fi package. Maybe, they were smart enough to bring some kind of jammer? At any rate.... I don't believe any calls were made even if it was a "break-up."

As for the depth of the Indian Ocean, yes it is just as deep but for where we are looking the water isn't as deep the Air France landing. Now we have expanded it though so now it moves into deeper water. I'm not understanding as to why we didn't move the search area's sooner.

True... we believed it was a catastrophic event and crash somewhere in the area of last "voice" contact. Shallower water. Everyone did their part. Nothing there. We didn't move the search area sooner because the Malaysian gov't was holding stuff back! We searched where we thought it would be. Considering the mystery and vast ocean areas involved... I think, we are moving things along pretty quickly, now that WE are allowed to get more involved!

We knew we weren't picking up any black box signal. It was said by experts we should be hearing them within at least 500 miles. If that is the case, we should have been moving our search area quickly.

You might need to check those facts. Pretty sure I heard something more like 20 miles max. I even heard ONE guy say 1/4 mile! [but, I think he was on Fox.] Even the original search area was wide open ocean! We should have been seeing debris, too! We kept going farther out, thinking it was supposed to be in THAT area. THEN.... we heard about the military radar "hit." Like I said... perfect plan until you forget or don't know about ONE little thing! These guys may have studied the plane, and the area, and even civilian radars. But.... did they consider a simple EW radar site manned by two Malaysians who haven't seen a plane in months?

The difference with Air France was that as it was falling(it was in a stall and falling) real-time data was being sent to Air France and Airbus, so we had a very good idea of where it was. Even so, it took 2 years to locate the boxes laying in water nearly 13K feet deep.

Not SO good of an idea, eh? Point is, the boxes only ping for a month. It was two years later when we found them. Different situations completely (I think.) BTW... did you hear that the voice recorder won't be of any use if the #2 theory is even close? Know why?

With this one, if it went down, nobody has a clue as to where to begin looking. We have been looking in the waters west of Malaysia along the coast there, no dice so they started expanding more west when it came out that some intel showed something headed west for up to another 4-7 hours. Remember, they were at least 1 hour into the 4 hour flight with a reserve of 3 hours to give them a total of about 6 hours of fuel left depending on how fast it was going and any head/tail winds.

I heard it was about 7 hours of "unknown" flight time. The last "ping" around that "arc" was after 8 a.m. and the handoff was about 1:47? That doesn't mean the plane didn't fly on for some time AFTER that last ping... but less than one hour more. That's another 400 miles plus?

But.... I have a REAL problem with that "arc" that everyone on T.V. is "promoting." It's as if they thought the plane actually FLEW in that arc!

Take the last known (or even suspected) position of the plane, calculate the range in hours and convert to miles at both high AND low altitude, and then.... take a string and a pencil and create another "arc" that will intercept the arc they are showing! THAT will show you where they crossed the ARC (and then add another hour of flight) unless.... they circled a bit to waste time and frustrate our best investigators!

WERE they that smart? They've certainly had TIME to learn from OUR mistakes and weaknesses. You think they'd try to hijack another plane from Boston? No... I think the sleepy little country of malaysia is JUST about right!

[Roadhog]

All I really know is, if Shania starts to feel afraid, I would love to be her body guard, and be paid to keep a close eye on her, at all times.

[golfhobo]

Originally Posted by Roadhog

I wonder how no one got a cell phone call, text, or anything sent out, and it's not posted on youtube.
NSA should have record of any messages.

Well, I think I MAY have covered that. But, still.... I wonder also. I know if I'm ever in that sitution, I'm gonna hit 911 in a heartbeat! Oh, but wait.... that may not work out there. Certainly won't have "enhanced" 911 that gives my location. The other thing is.... cellphones won't GIVE a location over the ocean!

As for the NSA? Sorry. They only spy on phone records BY Americans IN America.... or on vacation.

Seriously though... you'd be surprised how involved the NSA IS in this investigation. What? You don't WANT them to help? Okay. Enjoy your next 9-11!!

I guess some people think our spy satellites can see everything ALL the time. It don't work that way. Here's your "word for the day," BORESIGHT. Look it up. It's how our satellites hone in on areas of interest. It's like a "spotlight" above a Broadway stage. Without changing the position of the satellite, we can change the "area" we are collecting data from. The U.P. is HARDLY on our list! lol.

Here's a clue. Unless the Soviets move an entire battle group out into the Indian Ocean, we are NOT going to have a "footprint" over a bunch of water!

However.... there are GOES satellites that are doing JUST that! Has anyone mentioned searching THEIR data?

I wonder if there were any A.F. Recon flights in the area when this happened? Cuz... there's a position on those planes dedicated "mostly" to monitoring International "Civilian" flights. I know, cuz I had to DO it for awhile. There would be no reason to pay much attention to this flight, searching for more important flights of "heads of states." But.... at the MOMENT this flight deviated from its flight plan.... I would have gotten an alert to "record" all data associated with it if I could find it. At least.... after 9-11.... I sure SHOULD have!

[Roadhog]

breaking news!!!

PLANE FOUND IN PAKISTAN

breaking news!!!

that is the headline Monday, but you heard it here first.

[golfhobo]

Originally Posted by Roadhog

All I really know is, if Shania starts to feel afraid, I would love to be her body guard, and be paid to keep a close eye on her, at all times.

All I know is... I HOPE you aren't using that avatar on the Shania FAN page!

I get the heebie jeebies just reading your posts!

Makes me want to buy a gun.

[Useless]

Heck, I can't figure it out. I had considered pilot suicide as a possibility, although that wouldn't explain why certain navigational and communications systems were disabled. Not all of those systems could be completely shut off within the confines of the cockpit, so a suicidal pilot would have to have someone else working in cooperation with him. Seems rather unlikely.

Hijackers would have to be able to assume control of the aircraft and disable those same communication and navigational systems. That wouldn't explain why they would keep the plane airborne for several hours. Seems to me that hijackers seeking martyrdom would want others to take notice, or would have deliberately crashed it into some populated area. That indicates to me that there might well be covert involvement on the part of some government, some where. In that case, the 777 might well have landed safely somewhere. But, in what country?? And why?? Go figure.

The only other possibility that I can think of would be some type of massive, cascading failure of the plane's electrical systems, but given the system redundancies the 777, something massive would have had to go terribly wrong in an instant. Highly unlikely, but not impossible.

[Mr. Ford95]

Back to China-Iran, they are cozy with each other. While under sanctions, Iran has been shipping cheap oil to China for their massive consumption of gasoline. China only cares about themselves, they will toss Iran under the bus in a second. We already know this in dealing with them ourselves. They claim to like you but will stab you in the back in a heartbeat if it benefits them.

By "them" yes, I mean the Iranians involved and on-board. You are aware a 3rd Iranian was involved right? A 3rd one bought the tickets for the other 2............if this turns out to be the Iranians involved from the start, China-Iran friendliness is gone. Their relationship will have a big dent in it.

As for Russia having a headache here, you betcha. China abstained from voting at the UN meeting yesterday over the Ukraine mess. China and Russia have voted together against Iranian and Syrian sanctions or military action. They have both also been against anything on North Korea. They have a relationship, China-Russia. Russia-Iran also have a good relationship. Russia has been helping them with their nuke program and working to keep sanctions or military action from happening against Iran as best they can. Iran and China look up to Russia, last thing Russia wants right now is to have China pissed at Iran and ready to launch a few missiles at Tehran. Russia has it's own problem with Ukraine/Crimea, you know Putin is sitting there going "awwww shiite" while rubbing his temples. This would be like England and France getting into it with each other, who do we side with since both are allies of us. There was also 1 known Russian on board.

Thinking more about it, I don't believe just 2 "terrorists" can take over a plane these days without some passengers fighting back. 2 against 200 and some? Sudden altitude changes will help keep passengers from fighting back some. Even if you kill them all, dumping the bodies and luggage is inherently dangerous.

You do know that Flight 19 wasn't just over open ocean. There was a report that they were passing over land. They assumed it was the Keys they were over and relayed that info to ground control. It is believed they were actually flying over the Grand Bahama Island area and ground control informed them to put the sun on the port wing and fly north. This Malaysian flight was middle of the night.............easier to become disoriented of just where you are, isn't the first time it has happened in commercial flight that has led to a plane going down due to fuel starvation.