[Windwalker]

Originally Posted by ilikeike

I really love the people who, when confronted with the volumes of information supporting the indisputable conclusions of demolition experts worldwide who say the 2 WTC buildings were brought down by controlled explosions and yet still believe that for the first time in the history of steel skeletal buildings, fire caused them to collapse in a pancake fashion at free fall speed in the manner of a controlled demolition and still believe that the planes brought them down because their government says the planes brought them down.

I've seen one piece of evidence that proves to me that the two towers were not brought down with controlled implosion. It was the fire from the planes' fuel that brought them down. I've also seen the evidence for the controlled implosions, and I find all sorts of holes in that. The steel structure that was made to special codes to withstand heat means nothing. Any steel begins to change the temper characteristics as soon as the temperature goes over 300 degrees F. With the burning fuel raising the temp of the steel over 1800 degrees, it has no more strength than a slice of warm cheese. Once the upper floors start to come down, the floors below can not withstand the impact, and the whole building comes down. Straight down. Also, neither one of the buildings' upper floors stayed upright or within the "footprint". The upper floors actually fell OUTSIDE of the footprint.

The "SO-CALLED-EXPERTS" that have all those "burning questions" have their heads up their butts. Just like the "expert" that said burning hydrogen in a normal engine will produce more carbon dioxide than using gasoline. A statement that violates the first law of physics, and is impossible, but because an "expert" made the statement, the country picks up on it and runs with it.

There was a plane, and burning fuel in each tower. There was a plane that hit the pentagon, and it was a plane that crashed in PA. Yes, it was a plane that came down in PA. I talked to someone that lives there and saw it come down.

Tell those experts with all the "burning questions" to get a different set of drugs that doesn't burn the common sense out of the brain.

[Windwalker]

Originally Posted by Malaki86

Now - where can I get my hands on some of that "super thermite paint" they used?

Actually, thermite paint is very easy to make. Two very simple, and easily obtained ingredients to make it. Got an old rusty nail that you can hit with a hammer to pulverize it? You've got one of them. The other, I can come up with even easier. Mix them together dry, then add lacquer for a binding agent and you've got it.

But, the explosions in the lower floors of the towers was not from what you would normally think of as explosives. It was fuel leaking down into the elevator shafts that vaporized and became an explosive mixture. Anything that ignited it meant a strong explosion all the way down to the ground floor. You have the same thing happening in your engine, every time a piston comes up to the top of a compression stroke.

I'm afraid "thermite paint" didn't have anything to do with it at all.

[MichiganDriver]

Ilikeike - rather than talking about 'the government' like it's a single cell organism with it's own volition, let me get you to talk about the thousands of people that collectively are 'the government'.

Take any one of them and run with it. What would be their motivation for being an accomplice to the slaughtering of a few thousand of their fellow citizens? There is no possible answer you can give because there is no possible answer that makes sense.

And then you've got the hundreds of people that would have to know about it and be complicit in a cover-up. And any one of them could sign a book/movie deal for millions for spilling the beans. I'm sorry but I think you're howling at the moon.

Don't mean to sound harsh but that's the way I see it.

[golfhobo]

I must have mis-read the title of my own thread! How did I end up in "loonie land?"

I heard this recently (several times.) I think they said it was St. Francis or Francis of Assissi (which I THINK are the same):

"To those who BELIEVE, no explanation is necessary. ....To those who don't, no explanation is POSSIBLE."

Roll it around in your head for a few minutes. Apply it to BOTH sides of this and all other arguments we are having these days.

To convince another (who BELIEVES he is right,) is extremely difficult and even more rare! To convince oneself that he is wrong, is damn near impossible!

I said that.

[ilikeike]

I truly appreciate all the thoughtful responses. I have to admit that I'm a little conflicted on all of these issues. My dilemna is that I'm trying to resolve just who it is I should be listening to: the four or five decent guys who've replied to my posts with no links or references, or some guy who has served in several very high intelligence positions under five presidents.

Steve Pieczenik - Biography

He is stating unequivocally that OBL was killed in 2001 and the recent assassination escapade is a complete hoax. He has stood firm on his previous contention that 9/11 was a false flag event. When I joined this thread a few days ago, I had no idea he was going to be on the air today with Alex Jones. It's on live now so I can't post a link you can replay now but I will try later on after they post it.

Hobo, I've got to warn you: When you hear what he has to say about Obama (to be fair, he runs down Dubya, too) your ears may burn off as you run screaming to the girls room.

[Orangetxguy]

Originally Posted by ilikeike

I truly appreciate all the thoughtful responses. I have to admit that I'm a little conflicted on all of these issues. My dilemna is that I'm trying to resolve just who it is I should be listening to: the four or five decent guys who've replied to my posts with no links or references, or some guy who has served in several very high intelligence positions under five presidents.

Steve Pieczenik - Biography

He is stating unequivocally that OBL was killed in 2001 and the recent assassination escapade is a complete hoax. He has stood firm on his previous contention that 9/11 was a false flag event. When I joined this thread a few days ago, I had no idea he was going to be on the air today with Alex Jones. It's on live now so I can't post a link you can replay now but I will try later on after they post it.

Hobo, I've got to warn you: When you hear what he has to say about Obama (to be fair, he runs down Dubya, too) your ears may burn off as you run screaming to the girls room.

Well.....Since you don't know Steve Pieczenik any better than you know any of US, YOU get to play 52 card pickup and figure things out for yourself!! The facts of what over 15,000 gallons of Jet-A can do when it is on fire is undeniable. The fact that water spreads petroleum liquids, burning or not, is also undeniable. The fact that extreme heat can cause catastrophic failure in steel products is also undeniable.

You can take the word of a man whom has a Bone" to pick with his former employers...and George Bush specifically, or you can research the facts of exactly how many gallons of Jet-A was loaded onto each of the aircraft that hit buildings, and what exactly happens when the "estimated quantities" of each aircraft's onboard fuel is burning inside structures made of concrete and steel, which are also filled with wood and paper products.

And.....FYI.......for the most part, anyone as high up as Mr. Pieczenik claims to have been, is a major league azz-kisser, and would be expected to say the things that each of those 5 Presidents, as well as his immediate superiors, would expect him to say, just to be agreeable.

You have to use a little common sense.

[ilikeike]

Originally Posted by Orangetxguy

And.....FYI.......for the most part, anyone as high up as Mr. Pieczenik claims to have been, is a major league azz-kisser, and would be expected to say the things that each of those 5 Presidents, as well as his immediate superiors, would expect him to say, just to be agreeable.

You have to use a little common sense.

Can you clarify your FYI? Maybe I'm reading it wrong but, to me, it reads like it's coming down on both sides of the issue.

As for the common sense . . Stan. The White House broke the assassination story. It wasn't filtered through myriad news agencies who might have slipped up on a few minor details as they rushed to break the story. The White House broke the original, official and only version of the story and since it's release, has changed it materially six times.

MichiganDriver: I want to trust my government, too. I did for a long, long time. I served 3 years, 10 months and 18 days In the Navy. I earned my Dolphins and 5 service ribbons. I was honorably discharged early to start school on time. I spent almost 3 years aboard the USS Batfish, SSN-681. You can read about my ships exploits during my period of service in the excellent book "Blind Man's Bluff". I was a spy. I wasn't trained as a spy, I didn't sign up to be a spy, but, by the nature of our missions, we, meaning everyone aboard, were considered spies. It wasn't because America needed more spies. It was because of the nature of the living/working environment aboard a submarine: there were no secrets. I know what our Defense Department is capable of and I was enormously proud to be a part of it.

On the morning of September 11th, 2001, I was at work in my store getting it ready to open. Shortly before 9AM, I got a call from my best friend who asked if I was aware of what was unfolding on TV. Sensing the urgency in his voice, I ran out the back door and up the stairs to my landlord's office and sure enough, he and a few others were riveted to the TV. Then the second plane hit. The first words out of my best friends mouth were "It's a terrorist attack!" At whatever hour the Pentagon and Shanksville images began to appear, I and the 4 others who were watching started asking, almost in unison "What the fark are they talking about? What airplane?" Just as surely as my friend had so astutely proclaimed a terrorist attack, 5 presumably astute adults unanimously agreed "I don't know what they're talking about! Where are the other planes?"

I don't know how old you are or how many plane crashes you've had the misfortune to observe, but I grew up during a time when the air travel business was . . er . . exploding, or really taking off. For a long time, it seemed like there was a major airliner crash every few months, with all it's vivid imagery, splashed all over the evening news and daily papers. I grew up in the 4 channel era of CBS, ABC, NBC and PBS. I watched the news every night and read a paper everyday. Without ever intentionally setting out to do so, I developed a mental set of images of what I could expect to see the next time a plane crashed. My expectations were and still are routinely met with two notable exceptions: There was no plane crash at the Pentagon on 9/11/01 and there was no plane crash in Shanksville, PA on 9/11/01. You can believe whatever you want. Can you prove what you believe? I admit my job is easier: there is nothing to prove because nothing happened. Where did they go then? How would I know? NORAD was, for the only time in it's history, on stand down at the time. What a coincidence.

[MichiganDriver]

Ilikeike - I'm not sure if you were directing just the one paragraph to me of the majority of that post.

I notice you didn't attempt to explain anyone's motivation. Money, love, the promise of eternal youth? It would take something unbelievably huge to convince someone to aid the slaughter of their own people. Even that is just a tree though. It would have to be hundreds of people promised something unbelievably huge. NOW we're looking at the forest (imho!). Not in a million years. Not in a $10 novel. Not in your wildest dreams. It simply didn't happen that way.

[ilikeike]

Check the (link posted above) man's credentials and then listen to his story, here:

http://www.infowars.com/top-us-gover...-a-false-flag/

This link will take you to yesterday's appearance. It's a few paragraphs of introduction followed by audio/video of the interview. Every word he speaks is backed up by the public record with links provided. The motivation is clear. Do you want me to give you my interpretation or would you prefer to hear it from the horses mouth? Check it out and we can discuss it. Or don't. If you don't, we can't discuss it.

[golfhobo]

I feel pretty confident in my INITIAL analysis of this guy as a MAJOR FAKE!

Checked YOUR link, now check mine:

Steve Pieczenik - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I've never SEEN a wiki page that so vehemently questioned the validity of the info, even called it more of an "advertisement." Notice the last para of the Government service section. It's written POST interview with the conspiricist nut Alex Jones (someone on another website called him Glenn Beck on steroids or something.)

The whole Wiki article might have been written about that same time. I can't find ANY proof of this guy's credentials ANYWHERE but from the mouths/keyboards of these people who are giving a bio on him that HE provided!!

I checked over 10 pages of google results. As usual, they are mostly to websites that are showing the same youtube link of the interview. I haven't even seen it yet..... don't know if I'll waste my time.

The guy WRITES POLITICAL THRILLER novels..... IF that part of his bio is true! I did see a link to amazon.

A little more research (for the fun of it,) and I'll probably be ready to bet my EBI clearance, my combat crew wings, and my velcro patches ..... that this guy didn't hold any of those positions in gov't that he claims!

If you're not just "yankin' our chain," then I suggest the answer to your dilemma is to believe "us" here on CAD! [But not robertt. He's a Beck/Blaze "mole."] :lol::lol2: