[Jumbo]

You know I think this is a very interesting topic. I think you may have a point with what you are...................zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzz

[Twilight Flyer]

Dac reports are also very accurate.lol

So, tell me what this thread has to do with DAC reports?

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Syncrosonix]

Originally Posted by Manicmechnic

I did not inhale!

i drank beer, but didn't swallow! :P

[comnking]

Originally Posted by Twilight Flyer

Whether or not I, or anyone else, believes you is a moot point. My point was that false positives are extremely rare and I stand by that claim. My other point was that if you start throwing names out over a messageboard, you ARE starting a witch hunt against someone that you claim is dirty, but have zero proof. Not a position I think you want to get yourself in.

:roll:

I could not careless whether anyone believes me or not. The point of the post was to outreach to others in my situation. I appreciate your concerns about any potential legal danger that I might be placing myself in but I have not accused anyone of anything. None of the questions asked are open to opinion, they are facts about the test and its processing. I am very certain that sharing true facts that can be supported by documentation poses no risk. Read the post again. All I am simply stating is that if similar cases exist, they should all be investigated. It is up to the regulating authorities to conduct the research and determine how such errors occurred. Gathering facts and posting public notices to do so is common practice. Check out the newspaper sometime and you'll see many such notices. Heck, they even advertise on TV.

If you are comfortable that there is absolutely no way that errors occur all I can say is that when you get hit with a positive, you decide how you'll handle it.

[Rev.Vassago]

Originally Posted by comnking

I appreciate your concerns about any potential legal danger that I might be placing myself in but I have not accused anyone of anything.

Yes you have.

Are you prepared to cover the potential legal danger you are putting CAD in as well?

[felix5oh]

Everyone's an expert.


You wont get anyone to admit to a false positive here.
Goldenseal doesn't work anymore and they test for it now.
Canabanoids get stored in the fat and your blood pulls from it constantly.
The 50/ng they test for will show if your in a car with several smokers.(Jeff Spicoli style)
If your sample is diluted, by drinking extra water before the test, they can test 15/ng.


False positives come up with some other drugs by prescription drugs but not Canabanoids.
Do some history and reading.

[Orangetxguy]

I was all set to call BS with this guy......and I still might.

My question.
Was your receipt for the sample presented for the "split" testing?

If your answer is "NO", why wasn't it? THAT is why you were given the receipt in the first place. That is why your receipt is green. When a "positive" is challenged, they don't just open up the second sample and test it. Receipts are compared first. IF the receipts match up, then the "split" is hand delivered to a second lab, and everyone involved is present for the testing..you included.

I have seen 4 challenges in 29 years. Of those 4, only one was "false". After investigation, it was determined that the nurse at the Clinic had switched samples with a driver, because "She" was known to be clean. The nurse needed a sample from a clean female, to pass her own test. The switch was made with the help of one other male nurse at the clinic.

So..yeah..I know it can happen...but twice in one company, at the same time?


I wonder...did someone make "Brownies" for the crew and you and the other "positive" driver pigged them down??

Otherwise...why wasn't your receipt presented before the second sample was tested? That is how it is done. They don't test that second sample until "You" challenge the test results. That is why there are two taken.

[Twilight Flyer]

I agree totally with Orange...the chances of two guys from opposite sides of the country having the same issue with the same MRO is practically astronomical.

Yes, I'm sure it happens...but again it's extremely rare. However, whether or not your statement is true, you are still barking up a dangerous tree. When you are looking to call out and accuse a specific person and are prepared to name names, you are opening yourself up to serious liable, because I guarantee you that someone will direct the MRO to this thread. I'd be willing to bet that the MRO will have the legal backing of a large medical lawyer staff, too. Again, probably not the sort of trouble you want to get yourself into.

Additionally, Rev makes a valid point and I have contacted the owner of the board to review the thread to discern what, if any, legal issues might arise for CAD.

[Orangetxguy]

Originally Posted by Twilight Flyer

I agree totally with Orange...the chances of two guys from opposite sides of the country having the same issue with the same MRO is practically astronomical.

Yes, I'm sure it happens...but again it's extremely rare. However, whether or not your statement is true, you are still barking up a dangerous tree. When you are looking to call out and accuse a specific person and are prepared to name names, you are opening yourself up to serious liable, because I guarantee you that someone will direct the MRO to this thread. I'd be willing to bet that the MRO will have the legal backing of a large medical lawyer staff, too. Again, probably not the sort of trouble you want to get yourself into.

Additionally, Rev makes a valid point and I have contacted the owner of the board to review the thread to discern what, if any, legal issues might arise for CAD.

Forget opposite sides of the country for these two guys. Even from the same terminal. Either they were out partying all weekend and got caught...or they was served up some of them brownies that were so popular back in the 70's and early 80's! The ones with MaryJane in them!

It just doesn't pass muster.

I've worked for a couple hard core companies. If there was an issue with a "positive" test, they took every precaution to make sure it was a true "positive". To cover their own behinds as well as to give the "driver" every opportunity to prove they were innocent.
The one "false" positive in Seattle was just as I described it. The only woman driver at the terminal had her urine samples switched by the nurses in the clinic. They (the nurses, 1 male 1 female) partied together, then the woman was given a random notice, and as it happened, Anita, the gal I worked with, received her at the same time. The clinic was always notified that a "random" was coming, so the driver was in & out quickly. When you have an individual whom test's clean for years, then suddenly it changes...questions are asked by competent people.

[Roadhog]

Someone pointed out, we discuss this topic at length, and do try to advise from all perspectives. We are not going to say the system is perfect, but our interest is to discuss procedures in the system, not answer legalities. I posted this a while back, and rather than go through specifics, I'll just paste, and hope it answers some concerns;
______________________

Substances or Conditions which can cause false positives for testing for Amphetamines:

Ephedrine, pseudoephedrine, propylephedrine, phenylephrine, or desoxyephedrine
(Nyquil, Contact, Sudafed, Allerest, Tavist-D, Dimetapp, etc)
Phenegan-D, Robitussin Cold and Flu, Vicks Nyquil
Over-the-counter diet aids with phenylpropanolamine (Dexatrim, Accutrim)
Over-the-counter nasal sprays (Vicks inhaler, Afrin)
Asthma medications (Marax, Bronkaid tablets, Primatine Tablets)
Prescription medications (Amfepramone, Cathne, Etafediabe, Morazone,phendimetrazine, phenmetrazine, benzphetamine, fenfluramine, dexfenfluramine,dexdenfluramine,Redux, mephentermine, Mesocarb, methoxyphenamine, phentermine,amineptine, Pholedrine, hydroymethamphetamine, Dexedrine, amifepramone, clobenzorex,fenproyorex, mefenorex, fenelylline, Didrex, dextroamphetamine, methphenidate, Ritalin,pemoline, Cylert, selegiline, Deprenyl, Eldepryl, Famprofazone) Kidney infection, kidney disease, Liver disease, and diabetes.

It must be noted; prescriptions, over-the-counter medications, pain-relievers, antihistamines, cold-flu-allergy-PMS medications, even Food and beverages can cause false positives when you get down to the basic chemistry levels. Not just in Amphetamine/Methamphitmines screening, but in tests also for Barbiturates, Benzodiazepines, Cocaine, LSD, Marijuana, Opiates, PCP, and even alcohol. However, it is the quantity that will trigger you a problem.

The word "positive" or "negative" are the least important items returned by a drug test...the most important information on the test report is the "Quantity Level"...first of all it must reach above the "Cut-Off Level" for the drug being tested for. This cut-off level is a quantity level set by law to determine actual "knowing and wrongful use of controlled substances". If your Quantity Level does not reach above the cut-off level, this is the first indication that there is positively something wrong with your drug test.

If you are testing positive there will be a "Quantity Level" reported in the test. Ask what kind of drug test are they doing? Is it the initial "EMIT" test, or a "GC/MS" Confirmation test? Drug testing technology has improved significantly and False Positives caused by OTC (over-the-counter) medications are now rare, but not impossible. Knowing this, you need to be aware of what to do to avoid trouble.

A lesson about cross-reaction. A cross-reaction occurs when a substance is misidentified as a targeted drug/metabolite by a urine test. Such substances are known as cross-reactants.They are usually very similar in chemical structure to a targeted drug/metabolite. As a result, they can be misidentified and cause a positive result. Cross-reactants come in many forms; over-the-counter medications, food items, etc. What makes a substance a cross-reactant is simply the fact that it can be confused with a targeted drug/metabolite. Note however, that cross-reactions have become less common. In the past, the drug testing industry has received bad publicity for high cross-reaction rates. As a result, most manufacturers have made significant improvements. Cross-reactions can still occur. Yet required cutoff concentrations are usually too high to register occasional usage.

Prescription drug users need not be concerned, as long as the prescription was obtained legally. Do not discontinue using legally prescribed medications. Also, administered drugs should not be an issue, as long as you can provide medical documentation if requested. However, everybody should be concerned about cross-reactants, as their use can be difficult to substantiate. In fact, cross-reactants (not legal prescriptions) should always be viewed in the same light as illegal drugs.

Filling out the urine test consent form: Most labs provide a space on their urine test consent form to record your prescriptions. Some use broad enough wording to allow you to also include over-the-counter medications used recently and/or drugs recently administered by a physician.

Upon reviewing a positive test result, the MRO will usually contact you by phone. If you tested positive for a prescription or administered drug, the MRO will request medical documentation. A follow-up test may also be required. In the absence of medical documentation or if you tested positive for an illegal substance, the MRO should determine if a legal cross-reactant was involved. Help him. Begin by insisting that you were drug-free and that the test results must be wrong. You can mention the cross-reactant that you suspect caused the false positive. But avoid sounding too knowledgeable on the subject. Wait to see what the MRO says. He might simply ask for proof that you used the cross-reactant and/or a legitimate purpose for using it. But this is rare, as MRO's are always skeptical about such claims. He should schedule a more thorough follow-up test. If not, insist on it. Initial test results usually identify only the drug category that tests positive (ie. Amphetamines or Barbiturates) not the specific drug within that drug category. You have the right to know what specific drug caused your positive result. Gas chromatography/mass spectrometry (GC/MS) is about the only method that can pinpoint the specific source of the positive result. Standard testing procedures normally require a follow-up test following any initial positive screening. Though many companies will avoid using GC/MS because it is quite expensive. Unfortunately, it is the only method that can prove your innocence.