[Syncrosonix]

there's a very tight right hand turn in el centro, california that requires you to be waaaaaaaaaaaaay left in order to have a chance at making it. the problem with that is you leave the right side of your tractor-trailer wide open for any idiots who don't know any better, and they will try making the right turn as you're doing it. it's a turn from 4th street/86s going to on-the-go truck stop. if you don't make the turn, your trailer will likely take a chunk out of the power pole that's on the corner. other examples are ones in fontana, california, along etiwanda. there's a pretty good chunk that's been taken out of the telephone pole on the north-west corner of philadelphia & etiwanda. a traffic light was scraped off at the north-east corner of francis & etiwanda.

[ICS]

Originally Posted by Drew10

From what I understand the "Jughandle" is illegel. Not really sure thought. Never had and Law bother me for it.
The "Jughandle" is when you swing wide into other lanes before your turn.
The "Buttonhook" which is the generally taught and accepted practice is when you do not swing wide, but bring your trailer straight into the intersection then cut a hard 90+ turn to complete the right hand turn.
Some intersections will not really allow a "buttonhook" as the roads are to narrow and the turn is to sharp for the OTR length trucks, plus obstacles on the corners (poles/trees/mailboxes/people etc) make a "jughandle" start to the turn a necessary evil.

I had to pull the old Jug today to make a tight turn. I guess it wasn't that bad of a turn really I just didn't look ahead and saw a small delivery truck parked on the inside of my turn on the street i was turning onto. i came close but you could still see just a little bit of light between his truck bumper and my trailer. I had to have made it by a 1/2 inch easy. :roll:

[headborg]

Quote TomB

the "button hook" is the technique used in ALL correct right hand turns, where you drive your tractor straight out until the trailer tandems are far enough forward to clear the corner when you bring your tractor around.

this is correctly called the "square out"--

the "button hook" is the where you swing wide.

the "safety" people want you to always use the "square out" WHEN possible- despite the fact it's much harder on tires and axle barrings/seals--- you drive streight out until your trailer tandem clears the corner-- then you Pivot on those axles( to keep as close to the curb as possible to discourage 4-wheelers from cutting in between.)

Now, When do you use the "Button Hook"??
when you HAVE TO-- since the "square out" usually requires you to push back traffic from the center/left turn lane to complete. A driver is suppose to be Looking/Sizing up the intersection and planning ahead- if there's a center curb or sign post or other obsticle( or simply a double lane
to single lane) a "button hook" will need to be employed.

[cowdoc]

Didn't realize bumpin a curb was that big a deal til I ruirnt a wheel last fall. That's the only thing I can figure as it didn't hurt the tire just bent the lip of the wheel.

[worldisnotenough]

Originally Posted by Syncrosonix

there's a very tight right hand turn in el centro, california that requires you to be waaaaaaaaaaaaay left in order to have a chance at making it. the problem with that is you leave the right side of your tractor-trailer wide open for any idiots who don't know any better, and they will try making the right turn as you're doing it. it's a turn from 4th street/86s going to on-the-go truck stop. if you don't make the turn, your trailer will likely take a chunk out of the power pole that's on the corner. other examples are ones in fontana, california, along etiwanda. there's a pretty good chunk that's been taken out of the telephone pole on the north-west corner of philadelphia & etiwanda. a traffic light was scraped off at the north-east corner of francis & etiwanda.

Made that turn in El Centro many times. You can look at the curb and see how many people have run it over. It is gonna get worse there now that they put an In and Out burger at that intersection.

[hatt91]

We had a driver making a right hand turn into a parking lot in New Jersey. It was a three lane in each direction divided highway. He was in the right lane driving, then moved into the center lane to make a wide turn with his right blinker on. An impatient driver behind him, sped around him to pass him on the right. Our driver was already in the middle of the right hand turn (taking up the center and right lanes). The 4 wheeler jumped the curb, flew OVER (not through) about 15 feet of bushes and slammed into the right side fuel tanks of our truck, rupturing them. The DEA was all the way up our drivers ass about the diesel spill (which our driver contained the best he could, we carry diesel spill containment kits in all our trucks.)

The 4 wheeler claimed he was doing only 15 mph.

The police gave our driver a ticket for making an illegal right hand turn, the 4 wheeler recieved no ticket.

The judge said that the law in New Jersey says it is illegal to make a right hand turn from any lane other than the right one unless otherwise marked.

[Windwalker]

Originally Posted by Drew10

Observation here....backing up to do it again, probably wont be an option. Remember you are on a city street when accomplishing a "button hook". This is generally a one shot attempt, as traffic will be behind you, impatiently waiting and "pushing" you to get out of the way. Most of the time you gotta get this right the first time.How do you know when the "jughandle and button hook" are needed comes throught experience with city streets and practice of the manuever, and really important to understand the turning radius of the tractor trailer combo. Position of the tandems will also dictate the turning radius. Another note if the tandems are forward, you have to keep in mind the trailer tail swing, that you dont "swing" it into a hapless 4wheeler coming around your side.

You will also find LEFT TURNS that require much the same thing. Off one narrow street into another, and traffic, as usual, will be half way across the stop line. You'll soon learn that you can start making your corner, but in order for you to complete it, the other traffic must back up out of your way so that you can complete your corner.No matter how tempted you are, YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO HIT THEM.

[worldisnotenough]

noted.

[dieselgrl]

A tractor trailer combination will always take 4 eighteen foot wide lanes from start to finish to complete a turn. We teach this to our new drivers every week. Don't believe me? Count next time you take a turn :wink:

An intersection going from two lanes to two lanes (the most common kind of turns we make) will require you to "swing wide" into the adjacent lane, and occupy both lanes of the street you are progressing onto. This would make the lane you started in 1, the one you pulled wide into 2, and the two on the street you were turning onto 3 and 4.

This works for pull throughs at the truck stops as well. It's the same as going from 3 lanes into 1. You don't think about it when you do it, but it still requires the same amount of space. The driver that has problems doing this is not taking enough space to complete the turn to get the trailer straight to the tractor before entering the single lane, or there isn't enough space to swing out three full lanes.

I have drivers every week that claim they can do a turn in 3 or even 2 lanes...and every week during the demos, they are the ones that run over the curb. If you only take 3 lanes, the trailer will find a 4th one....usually over a curb or into a light pole, or god forbid, a 4-wheeler's hood.

[Drew10]

Originally Posted by hatt91

We had a driver making a right hand turn into a parking lot in New Jersey. It was a three lane in each direction divided highway. He was in the right lane driving, then moved into the center lane to make a wide turn with his right blinker on. An impatient driver not in Jersey (add sarcasm) behind him, sped around him to pass him on the right. Our driver was already in the middle of the right hand turn (taking up the center and right lanes). The 4 wheeler jumped the curb, flew OVER (not through) about 15 feet of bushes and slammed into the right side fuel tanks of our truck, rupturing them. The DEA was all the way up our drivers ass about the diesel spill (which our driver contained the best he could, we carry diesel spill containment kits in all our trucks.)

The 4 wheeler claimed he was doing only 15 mph. Yea right..

The police gave our driver a ticket for making an illegal right hand turn, the 4 wheeler recieved no ticket. The 4wheeler should have been cited for wreckless driving. Ill bet if the tanks hadnt ruptured there probably wouldnt have been a citation given to your driver. Just guessing.
The judge said that the law in New Jersey says it is illegal to make a right hand turn from any lane other than the right one unless otherwise marked. Thats what I was mentioning in another reply, about the "jughandle" being possibly illegal, and like I said the law probably wont even blink an eye if they see you doing it, however if you get in an accident thats when they will cit you.