Wind: And, the sun is what? The core of what ever there was here before? That would suggest that other planets have water as well.

The Sun is just a small star, a mass of gases and matter pretty much like the core of a volcano. If some planet is about the same distance from a similar size star, and is made up of a similar bunch of mass from the Big Bang, it MIGHT have water. Does that mean it has life? Not necessarily.


That means the guy stepped there first, and a dino stepped in it.

Or ON him! :lol:

And other artifacts have been found that suggest early civilizations as advanced as we are today. Aircraft and all. And these artifacts do not fit into the "time-line" set down by conventional wisdom.

My personal theory on this is that some day in the future, we will discover time travel, go back in time to warn ourselves of our impending doom. The record of our existence (the pictures look JUST like our spacesuits) will be recorded in the past times that we visit, and are therefore availbable for us to find TODAY.

Slim: People lived about 600 to 900 years

I believe I saw a documentary that explained how an extra zero was included in the translation we know as the King James Version. Just like Gman using M for 1000 instead of K. It would make the Bible MUCH more believable if we would just agree that those long livers lived 60 to 90 years. At THAT time, this was unheard of!

RMP: Rocks stick together, pressure creates volcanoes, volcanoes create heat, Heat creates water and atmosphere, Water and oxygen create slime, slime turns to fish, fish turn to mammals, mammals evolve to humans.

You ALMOST had me until... slime turns to fish! Don't really buy that one, and IMHO that puts a big hole in Darwin's theory.

Littleman2: If matter can not be created nor destroyed. how then can Satan be destroyed if he is matter?

Who says he was destroyed? Just caged. But, if God wanted to destroy him, I suppose he could. Besides, Lucifer was an angel, and they were NOT of this Earth. Therefore NOT made out of earthly matter.

Wind: Is our sun the center of the "big bang"????

Some other body in the center of the milky way the center?

Our Sun is just a star on the edge of our galaxy (milky way.) It is not the center of the universe, let alone even the center of our galaxy. The universe is not expanding outwards from US, we are just on a "wave" sort of like the middle row of a truckstop.

Martin: Guys and Girls...Love is Free, Understanding is free, Life is free, Compassion is free.

Then I want back my alimony checks, my tuition, my taxes and my Heart! :lol:

Slim: Before the bang, was there light or darkness?
If light, where did it iminate from?
If darkness, what was befor it?
Was it nothing, and if so how did nothing from nothing=something

The Bible says God created the Heavens and the Earth. It also says God existed before this in the "Void" before the universe. I would say it was dark, since he said, "let there be light." And with the wave of a hand, he could EASILY have created the Big Bang and all the celestial matter in one nanosecond. NOTHING before, not a tight ball of molten mass. Just a thought in His mind.

Gator: Steven Hawking offers up a marvelously simple piece of observation to show that the universe has not always been here. Here's how it goes:
If the universe had always been here and had no beginning, then all parts of the universe would be the same temperature. All pieces of dust, all matter would have absorbed heat from all their distant neighbors and would have reached a quiescent state of temperature stability. He says they would all be hot, and I can see where he's coming from....

I can't! Hawkings is brilliant, but this makes no sense to me. ANY celestial body, held close to a star by gravity, would be receiving ambient heat from it, as we do from the Sun. Move a little bit away from that heat source, in the cold vacuum of space, and another similar size celestial body will not and does not have the same heat source. A star billions of miles away, putting out the SAME amount of heat, couldn't possibly help bring it to a "constant" temperature same as the first body. This would be fact even if the universe was constant, not expanding, always here, or not.

Slim: This is scripture and irrifutable.

There is nothing but the word of Man to say that the Bible (scripture) is the word of God, and therefore irrefutable. This is the type of dogmatic belief that makes people like Fozzy foam at the mouth. You state as FACT, something that can ONLY be supported by your BELIEF.

but Himself He made Limited, by His own physics.

"All things are possible through God." I don't think he has put ANY limits on himself. Sometimes, you talk yourself into a corner.

Slim:

1 Then the LORD answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said:

31 ?Can you bind the cluster of the Pleiades,
Or loose the belt of Orion?

Hmmm.... I could have SWORN that the names Pleiades and Orion were given to these constellations hundreds or thousands of years AFTER the life and death of Job. Either way, these sounds like the words of MAN, and not those of a God who made so many stars he bothered NOT to name them.

Fozzy: Why would a monkey be locked in a cage if it werent for man. Humans are the only creature that locks up things that they cannot understand. I go back to the concentration camps theme.. why do souless creatures not have any history of killing others for simply being?

In the Animal Kingdom, animals kill not ONLY for food, but also for territorial protection as well as self procreation/natural selection. So one could say that they DO kill others simply for "being."

Slim: If you do believe in Adam and Eve, then the next thing, that would make sense is that the Cro-magnion and Neanderthal, would have to be a desendant of them.

Again, you talk yourself into a corner. Now you are claiming that Adam and Eve, from which WE supposedly all descended, were of a level of sophistication "below" that of the ignorant species you mentioned. Do you really believe THAT is in God's image? And if A&E were God's creation of MAN, why did he create the species JUST prior to them?

I see NO irreconcilable differences between Creationism and the Big Bang theory. It fits nicely for me. But, I don't buy that Man evolved from chimps who evolved from fish who evolved from amoebic slime. I don't see enough scientific proof of this to warrant a total belief in THIS theory. Sometimes scientists can talk themselves into a corner, as well, in their attempt to disprove God and Creation. This one just doesn't pass the "smell test" with me.

 

At it again hu? :lol:

I said
GolfHobo said

I have yet talked myself into a corner, Let me explain again:--

God made Himself subject to His own Law! Otherwise, there would be no creation. For the scriptur say's that God cannot be temted, and that he cannot lie. So therfor He is Limited by His own Law. And that is the Law of Sin and Death. So instead He died to the Law, in order to allow us to die to the Law, and Now we live in a new life through the ressurection. For the Law of Creation still stands, even after the change, for the prerequosits of the law, are still active, either you believ or not. That is the question, and therfor God cannot, Not believ in Himself!
So no corner backing, just that I have spoken to these people in wich we have had these conversation, so I did not need to elaberate, because they already knew what I was talking about. Since we had already covered the subject insome way or fashion. wether this thread or another!


As for the book of Job--No one knows who wrote it, and No one knows wich timline it is in, some say that Mosses wrote it, some put it 900 years BC and Some during 600 BC, but most lean toward the time of Abraham. But who knows, So no argument here, cause I don't know, but I believ it was inspired!!

I said
GolfHobo said

At this moment we are below God and always will be!
As for your comment, We donot know the timeline between Adam and Eve and the Flood. And between all the Children they had, and add in the Nephalim, who knows? Could've & could've not this was a speculation, Not a Fact, so don't try to make it so.

 

Slimland:

Not trying to offend or upset you. Yes, I've read many of the other threads in which you discussed this "theory" of God's Law. I just don't find any support for it in my memory at the moment. You spoke with others about it before, and now you are speaking with ME about it.

You said:

God made Himself subject to His own Law!

Please quote the scripture that supports this....

Otherwise, there would be no creation.

And the rationale for this.


For the scripture say's that God cannot be tempted, and that he cannot lie. So therfore He is Limited by His own Law.

I think you are confusing pure attributes of God, that he is Truth and therefore cannot lie, and that he is above temptation, with some self-imposed LAW that he is 'subject' to.

And that is the Law of Sin and Death.

Sin is an act of rebellion AGAINST God's law, and Death is a consequence of that sin. They are not Laws in and of themselves.

The only REAL Laws that have ever been attributed to God, were the 10 Commandments that he gave to Moses.

I'm impressed by your conviction of faith, and your dedication to follow and understand God, but by your own admission, you are pretty much "self taught." I might suggest that some classes in the Bible, or guidance by an established church might help you. The Bible is VERY difficult to just read and comprehend.

This is why I say you sometimes talk yourself into a corner. You try hard to understand His Word, but it might tend to lead you in circles where, after awhile, you grasp at straws to find your way back to what you believe was your intended point.

If it helps you any, my father has been studying and preaching the Word for some 50 years now, and he doesn't understand it all either. Sometimes, he just has no answer to my questions.

Hobo

 

You are not Offending me in any way, Nor are you upsetting me.

The law of Sin and Death, is the Law in which you speak. For this is the Law Which gives us the Knowlege of Sin and the Righteous requirments of this Law produces death in man. This Law "the 10 commandments written on stone" was the tutor to bring us to Christ. Now we as Christians Live by the Law of Love. ie Love thy God thy Father with all thy heart, And Love thy neibor as thinself.

We know that the knowlege of Evil comes from the Law of God. Other wise, we would have never Known, thou shall not covet! But now we know, we are condemed. For the breaking of 1 commandment is to break all, and the punishment for this is death.

Now as for God being subject to His own Law--
Hebrews 6:18
18 that by two immutable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we might have strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold of the hope set before us.

The Above scriptur, says that is Impossible for God to lie, Why? Because He is subject to His own Law. If He where to Lie, then He could be Tempted, for the Lie is the sin, but sin does not take root, untill the fall into temtation. For ANYTHING that is not faith is Sin. So if God where to Sin, and Sin according to scriptur is to go against God Word "ie unbelief" then God would no longer be. Why? Because that wich created, would no longer believe in Himself. And what happens if Sin ie Unbelief, where to happen? God would have to die!!! This is according to His own Law, This is Why He cannot be Temted Nor Can He Lie.

God Created Good and Evil

Isaiah 45:6-8
6That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.

7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

8Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.

So we know that God Knows Good and Evil, for He created it!
And the Knowlege of it is the Law.

The Law is Holy, but when it flows through man it kills him. Only God can fulfill the righteous requirments of the Law. And the main Point of the Law, is to acknolege God, and to trust in Him. But we humans where already spiritualy dead, because of Adam. So God Who Spoke the world's into existance, and His Word became flesh, and His Word is the Law. So Jesus "who is the Word" took the sins of the world upon Himself, becoming sin for us, and died! So 3 days later rose again to give us new life in Him. Therfor fulfillin the righteous requirments of the law. Instead of us dying, He took our place.

So Evil in its purest form, Glorifies God--Becuase it points us to Him, by showing us how sinfull we are. Thus the Law of Sin and Death. Now sin and death no longer has dominion of us, because we already died to the law through Christ.
As for the creation part of the law-- to believe or not to believ--that still stands, nothing has changed. Now it is much easier to believ than it was. And now there is no more condemnation for those in Christ Jesus. For it was a free gift, all we have to do is grab it!!

As for your father-- I respect that he has been a minister. But I will let the Holy Spirit teach me, and not man.

I will be more than happy to answer any questions you have!

But Hobo-- Let God teach you not man, expecialy now since the days are evil.

As Jesus said It is finished!

Sincerly
Slimland

 

Rocky: I sincerely apologize for hijacking your thread! I didn't mean to. You'll notice that the bulk, and the beginning, of my post dealt with the topic and posts relating to your thread.

Slim and I have decided to start a new thread on the so-called LAW of God.

As for your thread, I believe you and I are in agreement that there is nothing mutually exclusive about the Big Bang theory and the belief in God. But, do you REALLY believe that Homo Erectus and Homo Sapiens evolved from amoebic slime? To ME, that is a bigger "reach" than the belief in an invisible God.

Hobo

 

Send me a link please Cant find it!

 

I am confused what does this have to do with Duke Ellington and Count Basie? :? :? :? :?

 

Chad? is that you?

 

Sorry, guys. Bumped this so I could more easily get to some of Slim's quotes, ideas, links, etc.

 

Have any of you heard about "The James Webb Telescope" that NASA is building??? I was listening to Coast To Coast A.M. with George Noorey, and he was talking to an astronomer about it.

It's supposed to launch sometime around 2013, and it will orbit about a million miles away from Earth. The Mirror on it will be 605 meters in diameter (21.5ft).

From what I have read about it, it should be able to reach out to the ends of the universe, and it will either confirm or disprove "The Big Bang Theory"!!