[Mr. Ford95]

The entire organization may be parked for the rest of the year after trying to intentionally manipulate a NASCAR dyno test by placing shims(magnets on the bottom side of the gas pedal) under the gas pedal to keep the engine from being run 100% and therefore throw a monkey wrench into the test results. Question is, was this going on at the first dyno test when the JGR engine's came in at less HP than the MWR engine's? NASCAR is really hot about this.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nascar/news;...v=ap&type=lgns

[flood]

i say leave the drivers alone as they didn't have anything to do with it

but BIG A$$ fine (50% of income) for JGR and take ALL owner points away and bar for life who ever was responsible for putting the magnets in

[Mr. Ford95]

I agree, leave the drivers out of this since they are essentially free-agents who just drive the car anymore. I hope NASCAR parks JGR in the Nationwide Series though for the rest of the year. It will hurt the drivers then and that's too bad but you have to severely punish the team in this instance. Had it been a fender flare or a weird hood deviation that is your normal cheating hanky-panky but trying to intentionally hide your actual engine HP's..............No wonder Stewart was pulling Edwards in yesterday's race until halfway down the straight when Edwards would blow his doors off. It looked like Stewart was tied to a tree until they got to the corner and he pulled back up to Edwards. This explains it, it was the same as running a cylinder down.

[turnleft]

Now they need to find out how JGR is cheatin like hell in the Sprint series, cause you'll never convince me that Kyle Busch is that good. I've seen a couple races this year were Kyle went to the tail end of the longest line and in 25 laps he's up front pulling away from everyone.

[ironeagle_2006]

Now the bigger question is are they doing the same thing in the Sprint Series. Think about it Kyle was NEVER that good at Hendrick even last year when they were winning everything under the sun yet this year JGR has won 9 races with hamlin winning one and Kyle 8 and they have won 14 in the Nationwide series. Something is going on there that is not right. From what I am hearing JGR is looking at even bigger peanlaties than what they are thinking they might even get hit at the Sprint cup level also if their entire Engine department gets suspended like what the Speed network message boards are thinking for the rest of the year.

[Double L]

Yeah this strikes me odd is how Kyle Busch is winning all these races. I'm a Tony Stewart fan and he has won one race I think I don't remember. I tell ya what I'm glad Stewart is leaving JGR to go do his own thing. Now if this does affect the sprint cup level then that means Kyle loses his points lead and every JGR driver gets disqualified out of the chase because of their greedy engine department. Actually in the Nationwide series Toyota was forced to reduce their horsepower cause they were producing more horsepower than Chevy, Ford, and Dodge. If you really think about it Toyota is dominating in the truck series as well! I'm starting to think that Toyota is the one cheating here but thats my opinion.

[Larry Heyns]

I applaud NASCAR for trying to stop cheating, but Toyota engines were legal before NASCAR tried to castrate them. Let the other manufacturers play catch-up.

In the history of cheating in racing, even Richard Petty was guilty. In 1983, Petty won at Charlotte but was fined $35,000 and docked 104 points following postrace inspection. Petty had illegal tires and an oversize engine. As a result, Richard Petty resigned Petty Enterprises after 26 years. He was driving for Mike Curb in 1984 when he won the July 4 race with President Reagan in attendance.

Previously, Petty and Chrysler departed NASCAR due to the hemi being outlawed. Richard, Maurice and Lee went drag racing in 1965. I think NASCAR learned what sudden, severe rules changes can do to ticket sales.

[Mr. Ford95]

Well, this was more than just a few numb-nuts at JGR who came up with this. I got a good feeling this goes big time into Toyota themselves. Which is probably why Nascar was delayed their decision until Wednesday. It isn't as simple as throw in any old magnet, you can't make it obvious something is up. If you throw too large a magnet in there and the dyno shows you only putting out 300 HP, Nascar knows something is going on and will tear the car apart to find it. This was trial and error on a dyno to figure out the right size magnet to show the engine's were running about 15 HP less than everyone else now. Either it was done on Toyota's factory dyno or it was done on Gibbs own dyno. If it was done at Gibbs then it really hurts JGR's whole motto.

How Nascar found that magnet is beyond me, it must have fallen off. Funny thing is, they could have magnetized a washer and got the same thing and it would have been easier to explain and possibly get off with no penalty. "Well we lost a washer putting this car together and couldn't find it, thanks for finding it for us."

Larry, that Petty deal, it was Dale Inman who came up with it. The engine was funny as heck for the whole year before Nascar caught on. They melted wax paraffin into the engine and when Nascar did a compression check before the race, the engine came up legal size. Didn't have to start the engine to get compression, just make it turn over. Once the race started the wax would melt and burn off thru the headers and instead of the engine being like 355, it was slightly larger. Nascar finally caught on by doing a post race compression check but they didn't say anything. They waited a few weeks and did another compression check then confiscated the engine and did a complete tear down on it before they found the wax.

The Toyota engine's weren't legal if they were putting out 25 more HP than any of the other makes. They are using some different parts inside, hence why Toyota's are blowing up more than any of the others, they are trying different things and sacrificing reliability. When they don't blow up, they have more pony's than anyone else. Only Gibbs hasn't had a problem with blown engine's, they build their own but still talk with Toyota about them.

Yes Kyle Busch is just that good, there were several races at Hendrick last year that he did not win because of circumstances late. He just missed the Pepsi 400 to Jamie McMurray, had strong runs going at Martinsville in the fall and at Texas 2 weeks later before the car went away from him. Last year he won once, he should have won at least 6 times and Alan Gustafson said so himself for making the wrong change on the car. It was a mistake on his part that Kyle still nearly won races with. He was taking a bad car and getting top 5's out of it.

[Mr. Ford95]

What a joke of penalties Nascar handed out.

— Suspended Jason Ratcliff, crew chief of the No. 18 car, and Dave Rogers, crew chief of the No. 20, indefinitely and fined them $50,000 each.

— Suspended No. 18 car chief Dorian Thorsen, engine tuner Michael Johnson and crew member Toby Bigelow and No. 20 car chief Richard Bray and engine tuner Dan Bajek indefinitely.

— Docked 150 Nationwide driver points from Tony Stewart and Joey Logano.

— Docked 150 Nationwide owner points from Joe Gibbs for both cars.

— Placed the entire teams, including both drivers, on probation through Dec. 31.

So they are suspended from being at the track but they can still work in the shop and fine tune the art of hiding their cheating. The driver points don't matter for either driver and neither do the owner points unless the 20 car is still in the hunt for the Owner's title.