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I never did the recap either KC
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When I had to use a regular log. I always did the recap, but it was because my company required the recap to be done on the log sheets. It is not required anywhere in the regulations..
Why is this so hard for some to understand? :roll: |
Originally Posted by kc0iv
Dawn let me ask you a question. How many times have you been in a scale house or a roadside inspection having a logbook inspection?
Before I started using DDL I never used a recap per se. All I did was add the last 7 days (plus today) and subtracted that number from 70. Let's face it -- It is not rocket science. It really is that simple. you said: Everything boils down to what someone said earlier! Log it as you do it, Don't speed and write down what you are doing and you should not have a problem with anyone Company or DOT because you are logging legal! you said: DOT probably would not have ran the last 7 plus today's log in his computer. And BTW I never was cited for a logbook related problem. Many of those logs were some of the most creative logs that could be created. I was never called by the log department nor were they detected by the one DOT audit the company went through. Here's a example. Drove slightly more than 6000 miles in 5 days. Make 15 stops. Had one logbook only inspection (no record of this check) and a full inspection on the 5th day. Only citation was for a missing license plate lamp which was not a OOS. After completing the trip I rewrote the logbook to fix the MANY problems with the log. In the end all miles and fuel stops matched. BTW I was using DDL at the time. I can assure you DOT would have had no problem with this trip had they did a full audit. You said: "Orientation Training: Well let me tell you about that, Everyone is different, everyone has a different learning capability , so you can beat a guy to death to learn something and he doesn't get it, he goes to someone else and he learns it, because of different words the person uses or pictures!" you said: I came here to chat with you guys to maybe learn things as I have learned many things from drivers, no not the regulations, just how things go out on the road! You act as if your way is the only way. Your views may be correct for the way you do your work but what other do is every bit as valid and in some cases more valid. You have stepped outside your limited world and then insulted those that disagree with your view. Needless, to say that rubs people the wrong way. I suggest you go back over your postings and look at them from the other persons view. See if you would accept them as they are written. Would you see them in the same light. Or would you see them as a "know-it-all" who puts people down. Sorry for this vary long post. kc0iv I beg the differ that I didn't come in here saying I know it all, as a matter of a fact I came in here saying I like to learn things from drivers as well and I do know the logs. I was attacked on my first response to a question and Rev (was the main fire starter) asked questions and I answered them and he still turned the words around. He attacked me so after a while I attacked back (I am a red head ok) I even tried humor thinking maybe he would lighten up! Again I only tried to help those who might come along and need help on certain areas, and I do know I recieved 4 e-mails being thanked for my help and how they say they do not like posting on the board because of "certain people" attacking. So it really is not just me ok! I can handle criticism and I can handle debates (I figure debating is the way we learn) what I can't handle is being attacked and many feel this should be stopped on the boards! Running all the miles you did is fine with me, again a driver is going to do what a driver is going to do. Just like the teenagers and sex. DOT may not have audited you when they did the DOT audit within your company, they don't audit every driver and if what you say is true you was never written up by DOT/officer then you was more than likely not audited, they usually audit drivers on the internal audit from the Company Profile that have several violations (maintenance and logs etc) and sometimes they pull drivers like you that have no violations just to give the company a break ASSUMING the fact the driver is a good driver since DOT did not find anything wrong with his logs during the road side. They also tend to audit the drivers who had a DOT reportable accdient So it is all about luck and who you run across, Many of the DOT officers are going to the DDL and they assume drivers can't change the system once you enter your data and that you are running legal, when in fact some are using it to cheat. Some are using it to run legal. I did have a driver tell me that DOT was catching on to the fact it can be changed and they are starting to check the edit data? Now I do not know if that is a "trucker story" or if it is facts. The re-cap well everything you said is true and everything I said is true so combine it all to how the driver wants to do it! The more information you do put on your log is better though not that you "have to" it does look better and tends to make DOT think you are doing a great job! Now if you are cheating and he pulls the computer out, you might want to start sweating and thinking how are you going to pay the fines. Yeah of course you can cheat and you can back log and all that and make it all good on the logs, but really if you know the regs (all of them) there is no need to do all that, run it legal and you can still make a good check and not have the headache of worrying about what is going to happen if I am in an accident. OUCH! :lol: Some prefer plain english to learn! Again they wouldn't ask questions if they understood the Text out of the book. Also to add I in this message alone, I was replying to a driver who had a question (which no she isn't actually a driver, but that doesn't mean anything, she still had a question) and the next post was her "quoting me" and Rev had to be a smart but and then guess what "DOOGLE" never replied after that, but he knows that he got her the right answer, when I know if she got the right answer from him she would have said thank you I understand now, because us women are polite like this! Please stop attacking me, I did not do anything wrong and even through out the attacks I gave back I didn't say anything as bad as he did, and I partically can not believe the board "again" would allow this. He attacked a guy for asking a question earlier. I wonder if he will come back? Before you know it the board will be boring because they will not have anyone to argue with. |
You said:
I was attacked on my first response to a question and Rev (was the main fire starter) asked questions and I answered them and he still turned the words around. He attacked me so after a while I attacked back (I am a red head ok) I even tried humor thinking maybe he would lighten up! While I have no problem using examples to support an argument (I do it myself) if it deals with rules and regulations I try to always show either the rule or a link to where the reader can find the rule. By so doing the reader knows what is being said is most likely correct. To be frank I don't see where REV attack you. Yes I think he put you down when you just don't seem to grasp the the concept. For what it's worth I re-read every post you made since coming on this section of the board. Just maybe that red head is getting in your way. You said: I recieved 4 e-mails... You said: ...should be stopped on the boards! If you think something is wrong you can alway PM the Moderator and voice your concerns. You said: The more information you do put on your log is better though not that you "have to" it does look better and tends to make DOT think you are doing a great job! Now if you are cheating and he pulls the computer out, you might want to start sweating and thinking how are you going to pay the fines. Yeah of course you can cheat and you can back log and all that and make it all good on the logs, but really if you know the regs (all of them) there is no need to do all that, run it legal and you can still make a good check and not have the headache of worrying about what is going to happen if I am in an accident. OUCH! If a company wants additional information put it in a Trip Report. You said: Please stop attacking me, I did not do anything wrong and even through out the attacks I gave back I didn't say anything as bad as he did, and I partically can not believe the board "again" would allow this. He attacked a guy for asking a question earlier. I wonder if he will come back? Before you know it the board will be boring because they will not have anyone to argue with. This is where your lack of being a driver gets in the way. I think you think this is the way it is and can't see the whole picture. The same thing can be said about what DOT does at a inspection be it a roadside or a scale inspection. You see it from a audit frame of mind. We are or have been drivers see at from the drivers point of view. And a few of us have been on both sides of the fence. This board has been around for a long time. I've been on it this time for almost 2 years. I can assure you many poster come and go for many different reasons but the board will never become boring. There will always be those that want to learn and those that are willing to help. On this section of the board people seem to know about the rules and regulations and seem to want proof not theories. As I said earlier if someone want to use examples I don't have a problem with it. But I do believe it helps the discussion if they also support that theory with facts such as rules and regulations. Yes cut and paste works just fine. At least there is a start on why someone believes the way they do. My last comment. I know thank God. Respect is a two way street. A person first gains that respect before it is returned. When someone is wrong they have to accept their error and learn from their mistake. Just like kids some people keep complaining and crying their being attacked because their not getting their way. That's all folks - Off the soap box. kc0iv |
Originally Posted by Dawn
I was attacked on my first response to a question and Rev (was the main fire starter) asked questions and I answered them and he still turned the words around.
He attacked me so after a while I attacked back (I am a red head ok) I even tried humor thinking maybe he would lighten up! Again I only tried to help those who might come along and need help on certain areas, and I do know I recieved 4 e-mails being thanked for my help and how they say they do not like posting on the board because of "certain people" attacking. So first it was "many", then it was "hundreds", and then it was "thousands", and now it is four. I bet they were all from the same person too. :lol: what I can't handle is being attacked and many feel this should be stopped on the boards! The more information you do put on your log is better though not that you "have to" it does look better and tends to make DOT think you are doing a great job! Some prefer plain english to learn! Again they wouldn't ask questions if they understood the Text out of the book. Also to add I in this message alone, I was replying to a driver who had a question (which no she isn't actually a driver, but that doesn't mean anything, she still had a question) and the next post was her "quoting me" and Rev had to be a smart but and then guess what "DOOGLE" never replied after that, but he knows that he got her the right answer, when I know if she got the right answer from him she would have said thank you I understand now, because us women are polite like this! Please stop attacking me, I did not do anything wrong and even through out the attacks I gave back I didn't say anything as bad as he did, |
Well Dawn you have been WRONG. Just two examples: (1) Your statement dealing with logging Not-Driving when a driver is on private property. (2) Logging time when a driver is NOT un-loading a load. Here is perfect examples had you taken the time to read the rules and regulations I don't think you would have made these mistakes
#1&2 wrapped in one answer: Although tell me how long does it take to back up your truck? So if I am pulling into the shipper/consignee and when I stop my truck then I would from then on log on-duty time until the time they start loading/unloading me, at that point. Tell me how many companies are going to allow you to leave the load/truck there and leave that property to go shopping etc. What shipper/consignee will allow you to do that? Hmm not many, the rules specifaclly says: B-6. How would "waiting time" at a terminal, plant, or port be logged? "Waiting time" at a terminal, plant, or port may be recorded as off-duty, sleeper berth, or on duty/not driving, depending on specific circumstances. For "waiting time" to be off-duty, the following off-duty conditions must be met: The driver must be relieved of all duty and responsibility for the care and custody of the vehicle, its accessories, and any cargo or passengers it may be carrying. During the stop, and for the duration of the stop, the driver must be at liberty to pursue activities of his/her own choosing and to leave the premises where the vehicle is situated. If circumstances permit a driver to utilize a valid sleeper berth without being disturbed for a specific period of "waiting time," that time in the sleeper berth may be recorded as "sleeper berth" time. However, a driver must take eight consecutive hours in a sleeper berth, plus another two consecutive hours off duty or in a sleeper berth, in order to meet the requirement for the equivalent of 10 consecutive hours off duty. In most other circumstances, such as when the driver is required to remain with the vehicle to move it when necessary, the "waiting time" should be recorded as "on duty/not driving." These provisions should not be confused with waiting time of drivers of vehicles that are specially constructed to service oil wells. Again: How many Companies/Shippers/Consignee's will allow you to leave your trailer and responsibilites there? I simply said it is an eyebrow raiser to the DOT officer and sometimes can be proven that you was there the whole time! Now be honest how many times was you relieved to go do laundry while your load was being taken care of or how many times did you actually want to leave your load? So therefore you was either standing there watching them or you was in the sleeper? So why log off duty and why not log the truth, it will only make you look better! I agree the term 15 minutes but if you put it at 7 1/2 minutes it does help drivers stay legal and most companies give you 1/2 hour lee-way time anyhow (although mine is more)! So I did not say anything wrong it is how the person read it! The one thing I did say wrong is personal property, but if you really think about it, you won't be driving on that personal property for more than 15 minutes! Unless you are having a bad day! :wink: |
Dawn said:
Although tell me how long does it take to back up your truck? So if I am pulling into the shipper/consignee and when I stop my truck then I would from then on log on-duty time until the time they start loading/unloading me, at that point. Tell me how many companies are going to allow you to leave the load/truck there and leave that property to go shopping etc. What shipper/consignee will allow you to do that? Hmm not many, the rules specifaclly says: Going the other way. Many companies have a line of trucks waiting and you move your truck one spot at a time. To be completely legal you have to log "Driving" for the whole time. I've been in a few of thoses lines for more than 6 hours. So if you do it like you say you have shot most of driving time. Again the grocery warehouses are the big offender along with Walmark. You said: So I did not say anything wrong it is how the person read it! The one thing I did say wrong is personal property, but if you really think about it, you won't be driving on that personal property for more than 15 minutes! Unless you are having a bad day! To make worse I've had the guard time stamp my truck when I signed in and then time stamp it when I left. Maybe you should take a day or two and go find-out what a driver has to do. Try a few grocery warehouses and Walmark distribution centers. Just maybe you would learn a few things about the real world. Not the little world you live in where everything can be done your way. Just remember lost time to a driver cost him/her money. If a few more companies really knew what a driver faced they would change the way they allow warehouses to get away with what they do. It's my feeling no driver should be required or allowed to be responible for loading/unloading or watching them load or unload. A driver should do what he does best - DRIVE. kc0iv |
Originally Posted by kc0iv
Dawn said:
Although tell me how long does it take to back up your truck? So if I am pulling into the shipper/consignee and when I stop my truck then I would from then on log on-duty time until the time they start loading/unloading me, at that point. Tell me how many companies are going to allow you to leave the load/truck there and leave that property to go shopping etc. What shipper/consignee will allow you to do that? Hmm not many, the rules specifaclly says: Going the other way. Many companies have a line of trucks waiting and you move your truck one spot at a time. To be completely legal you have to log "Driving" for the whole time. I've been in a few of thoses lines for more than 6 hours. So if you do it like you say you have shot most of driving time. Again the grocery warehouses are the big offender along with Walmark. You said: So I did not say anything wrong it is how the person read it! The one thing I did say wrong is personal property, but if you really think about it, you won't be driving on that personal property for more than 15 minutes! Unless you are having a bad day! To make worse I've had the guard time stamp my truck when I signed in and then time stamp it when I left. Maybe you should take a day or two and go find-out what a driver has to do. Try a few grocery warehouses and Walmark distribution centers. Just maybe you would learn a few things about the real world. Not the little world you live in where everything can be done your way. Just remember lost time to a driver cost him/her money. If a few more companies really knew what a driver faced they would change the way they allow warehouses to get away with what they do. It's my feeling no driver should be required or allowed to be responible for loading/unloading or watching them load or unload. A driver should do what he does best - DRIVE. kc0iv And I agree with you, although you have the choice not to log it correctly. I thought everyone wanted the way it should be logged, if you want how to get around things well I can tell you that to, although I prefer not to because you can drag me to court and I really do not want that Yes I agree you should be able to drive and your logs should really be based on what you get paid or you should get paid for your on-duty time, unfortunately that isn't the way the trucking companies (all) work. SOme do I know a guy who owns about 7 trucks and he pays actual miles and he pays you for line 4 time. But who knows what he will do when he gets big! I do know what you guys go through and I feel for you all in the hard job you do, but if we didn't have rules then "the world would really be scary" I am scared enough driving beside a trucker, not knowing if he is tired or not! Just as I am scared of 4-wheelers for the same reason (more so drinking and driving). But I stay away from truckers for the just incase he does fall asleep behind the wheel! I have taken plenty of accident reports and I know what "can" happen and I would not know what you go through or what we as 4 wheelers go through if I didn't take accident reports! Just because i haven't been on the road does not mean I do not know what it is like out there, it is common sense and 17 years of experience! :) |
Originally Posted by Dawn
It's my feeling no driver should be required or allowed to be responible for loading/unloading or watching them load or unload. A driver should do what he does best - DRIVE.
And that is where you show that you are not a driver, nor have you EVER been a driver. Loading/Unloading, and watching loading and unloading serve a purpose. Whether it be a claim prevention, or making sure that the shipment is properly loaded or unloaded, it serves a purpose. You would just rather turn drivers into "steering wheel holders".
Originally Posted by Dawn
Yes I agree you should be able to drive and your logs should really be based on what you get paid or you should get paid for your on-duty time, unfortunately that isn't the way the trucking companies (all) work.
Originally Posted by Dawn
I am scared enough driving beside a trucker, not knowing if he is tired or not! Just as I am scared of 4-wheelers for the same reason (more so drinking and driving). But I stay away from truckers for the just incase he does fall asleep behind the wheel! I have taken plenty of accident reports and I know what "can" happen and I would not know what you go through or what we as 4 wheelers go through if I didn't take accident reports! Just because i haven't been on the road does not mean I do not know what it is like out there, it is common sense and 17 years of experience!
:) |
Originally Posted by Rev.Vassago
Originally Posted by Dawn
It's my feeling no driver should be required or allowed to be responsible for loading/unloading or watching them load or unload. A driver should do what he does best - DRIVE.
And that is where you show that you are not a driver, nor have you EVER been a driver. Loading/Unloading, and watching loading and unloading serve a purpose. Whether it be a claim prevention, or making sure that the shipment is properly loaded or unloaded, it serves a purpose. You would just rather turn drivers into "steering wheel holders". Rev: You really make no sense what so ever in this whole post! I agree "drivers" should not have to be responsible so they don't have to log it on line 4 which eats up their hours. That is true, it should be between the Customer's (business").
Originally Posted by Dawn
Yes I agree you should be able to drive and your logs should really be based on what you get paid or you should get paid for your on-duty time, unfortunately that isn't the way the trucking companies (all) work.
Yeah they should be why would you roll your eyes. Drivers work hard driving with all the crazy people on the road (Including me one of them) and if they can't get paid for everything they do, it is not really fare, that much I agree with. We must follow DOT Regs, but what I really feel is My opinion and Rev: If they log something that takes away from their miles they get to drive something (pay wise) should happen. How to get to a point where everyone is somewhat happy (some drivers will just not run legal regardless) that I don't know and I suggest drivers to send their comments to the Federal DOT with their suggestions so maybe you can "really be heard" So rolling the eyes at the fact I am standing up for drivers but trapped because I am a peon is nothing to roll your eyes at! If anything you haven proved my point to pick at me for nothing!
Originally Posted by Dawn
I am scared enough driving beside a trucker, not knowing if he is tired or not! Just as I am scared of 4-wheelers for the same reason (more so drinking and driving). But I stay away from truckers for the just in case he does fall asleep behind the wheel! I have taken plenty of accident reports and I know what "can" happen and I would not know what you go through or what we as 4 wheelers go through if I didn't take accident reports! Just because i haven't been on the road does not mean I do not know what it is like out there, it is common sense and 17 years of experience!
:) |
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