A Wal Mart Documentary Has Me Thinking..

[Malaki86]

There was a local grocery store that started out as union. When the workers went on strike for more pay, the store gave them an option of dropping the union or they'd close the store.

So, the workers all voted to remove the union from the store and continue working at their original wages. The store is still open and they're still employed.

[Orangetxguy]

naw man.. that's four months behind me lol.. i have a semi local job now!!
But i honestly missed that job, if they cleaned somethings up i would run back over there but for the time being i will look from the outside in..
BTW, i would never stay at that Pilot!!! Just about any Pilot For That Matter, I would rather make the U-Turn and go stay at the Rest Area on the Eastbound Side lol

I was there long enough to get a cup of coffee, use the facilities...and wait for load offers so I could go the right direction the first time.


Got hosed on that I tell you!

[VPIDarkAngel]

I didn't know Krogers, Safeway, and Winn-Dixie were Union. Hmmm. You learn something every day!

We used to have Safeway, years ago. Also Winn-Dixie. All of the Winn-Dixie stores here closed, a few years ago.

Could you imagine Wal-Mart employees being teamsters??

No, but then again, when I was at Kroger, I wasn't a teamster. At store level, we had the UFCW (United Food and Commercial Workers). Also, we never had to worry about our hours getting cut so that they could slash our benefits. Wal-Mart employees, on the other hand...

[cdswans]

. . It would not bode well for the administration if Walmart cut back too much on their purchases from China. That seems to be where Walmart gets most of their products these days. If they raise prices too much then sales will fall.

#5: Wal-Mart's rank, if it were a separate nation, among China's biggest export markets -- ahead of Germany and Britain

And a few other tidbits . .

$0.31: The legal hourly minimum wage in China

$0.23: Average hourly wage at 15 Chinese factories making clothing, shoes, and handbags to be sold at U.S. Wal-Mart stores, 2001

73: Average number of hours worked per week by employees at those 15 factories

42,000: Number of Wal-Mart employees in the state of Georgia in 2002

10,261: Number of children of Wal-Mart employees in Georgia who are enrolled in the state's PeachCare for Kids health insurance program, which provides medical coverage to children whose parents cannot afford it

There's plenty more at the source: Stan Cox: Wal-Mart's Magic Numbers

If you happened to watch the videos (I did), you'd know that Walmart bought 2 German companies. Their employees get above average wages, full benefits and 36 days of paid vacation per year. I'd source that but I really don't want to watch all 11 videos again. Anyway, the German workers have strong leadership, apparently.

Gman and many others think American wages and unions sunk American industry. For the five post war generations, American wages and, for a time, at least, unions, meant a two story split level home, a white picket fence, health care, college for the kids, a decent retirement and for many, all on a single income. Now, the mentality, it seems, is that if the Chicoms don't mind living in tree forts and mud huts, why should Americans mind living in tree forts and mud huts?

Now, instead of paying a decent wage to produce high quality goods and earning a respectable profit, it makes more sense to bypass the American worker, TRUCK the raw materials across country, ship them overseas, consign the entire manufacturing process to sweat shop labor, ship the finished goods back over here, TRUCK them to the stores and make an enormous profit for the shareholders. Do you honestly believe that there is value in taking the American worker out of the loop? They're spending humongous dollars on shipping to save you pennies at the register? Think again. And before you go jumping for joy about all that high paying freight, the Chicom shipping companies are getting the lion's share of the dollars. You can't see where it might be better for all Americans to cut the Chicoms out of the loop?

Let me give it to you straight. Big business is buying your leadership and your leadership is selling you down the river. Understood? In the meantime, you're willingly surrendering your liberties, YOU have a houseful of worthless, third rate crap and YOU owe the Chicoms 3 trillion bucks.

"It would not bode well for the administration if Walmart cut back too much on their purchases from China . . " God forbid we should do anything to upset the administration. What about if it's good for the country? Can we get you onboard if it's for the good of the country? My country . . 'tis of thee? Sweet land of Liberty?

The Port of Oakland drayage Driver's were set to go on strike today but either the city or the state or the port authority or whomever gave them an extension while they sort out funding for the new clean air contraptions. We all know to some degree a lttle of what's happening in LA/Long Beach. All I can ask is for the first guy to go on strike, would you please block me in, too? Oh, wait! Interfering with an interstate shipment . . even as an act of protest or a labor dispute . . is now an act of terrorism; hence a no bail, Federal crime, of course. That's our leadership. And to Gman et al, at least, that makes sense.

[cdswans]

I'm wondering, after watching a couple of Wal Mart Documentaries, i'm starting to think that it won't be long before these people go union and show Wally whose really in charge.. Do you guys think that could possible happen??

I have a coworker who is related to Wal-Mart employees who tells me that unionizing is a constant topic of conversation . . but NEVER at work. It's pretty evident from the videos that it goes on quite a bit. I am told there is a strong, well financed outside organization helping to design a new, non-affiliated (no Teamster, SEIU, etc) collective bargaining unit (they don't use the "U" word) at the DC level. If that's true and it takes off, it will be interesting to see if the other unions support the effort while being left out of the deal. I reckon we'd see their true colors.

Do I think it could happen? I think Wal-Mart is becoming it's own worst enemy. They're a darling of the demon Wall Street and their financials are open for all to see. They're so big, it's only natural that they have to attract attention to themselves which, in turn, invites closer scrutiny of them. Americans have a lot of recent experience with "Too big to . . " They are a fabulously wealthy company at a time when a whole bunch of folks are hurting. Look around. Remember when every community had a "biggest employer in town" that actually produced something? Remember how any commotion "down at the plant" would cause a ruckus and make front page news? Well, today, "the plant" is likely a Wal-Mart and that huge, shuttered, decaying old building in the rundown end of town is a haunting reminder of the thousands of businesses forced out and the millions of people sent on to the dole by the Wal-Mart/Gman/Pelosi/Obama global government business doctrine of higher taxes, more welfare, fewer jobs and lower wages makes for a stronger U. S. A.!

Individual stores have their ups and downs but I'd bet DC traffic is pretty consistent and, more likely, growing. That might make it a little harder for Wal-Mart to argue that a few extra sheckles for the crew is going to kill the company. If the right group of well coached employees used a precisely coordinated, well reasoned and very positive and public approach, sort of out Wal-Mart the Waltons, so to speak, I don't see how Wal-Mart could fight it and come out looking good. But you know they'll fight. The employees would have to have a blood bond with one another, though, as in, if one goes = we all go. As unlikely as that sounds in today's job environment, I don't think it's any less likely that Wal-Mart could get away easily with firing a bunch of people instead of bargaining. But, Wal-Mart once closed a store in Canada rather than submit to bargaining. At the rate they're building DCs, they could probably manage to mothball a few, if necessary. Beyond that, would a community then continue to support them?

[GMAN]

#5: Wal-Mart's rank, if it were a separate nation, among China's biggest export markets -- ahead of Germany and Britain

And a few other tidbits . .

$0.31: The legal hourly minimum wage in China

$0.23: Average hourly wage at 15 Chinese factories making clothing, shoes, and handbags to be sold at U.S. Wal-Mart stores, 2001

73: Average number of hours worked per week by employees at those 15 factories

42,000: Number of Wal-Mart employees in the state of Georgia in 2002

10,261: Number of children of Wal-Mart employees in Georgia who are enrolled in the state's PeachCare for Kids health insurance program, which provides medical coverage to children whose parents cannot afford it

There's plenty more at the source: Stan Cox: Wal-Mart's Magic Numbers

If you happened to watch the videos (I did), you'd know that Walmart bought 2 German companies. Their employees get above average wages, full benefits and 36 days of paid vacation per year. I'd source that but I really don't want to watch all 11 videos again. Anyway, the German workers have strong leadership, apparently.

Gman and many others think American wages and unions sunk American industry. For the five post war generations, American wages and, for a time, at least, unions, meant a two story split level home, a white picket fence, health care, college for the kids, a decent retirement and for many, all on a single income. Now, the mentality, it seems, is that if the Chicoms don't mind living in tree forts and mud huts, why should Americans mind living in tree forts and mud huts?

When I grew up we lived pretty well without union intervention. In fact, I find it ironic that you would think that the only way anyone can have a nice home or earn a good living is by giving over your rights to a union. I never stated that American wages sunk American industry. I have stated that it was the unreasonable demands made by unions what have contributed to the demise of the steel and other industries. There were other factors such as government foreign policy, high taxation and unreasonable regulations, such as the EPA. It isn't just one factor that has destroyed much of our industry.


Now, instead of paying a decent wage to produce high quality goods and earning a respectable profit, it makes more sense to bypass the American worker, TRUCK the raw materials across country, ship them overseas, consign the entire manufacturing process to sweat shop labor, ship the finished goods back over here, TRUCK them to the stores and make an enormous profit for the shareholders. Do you honestly believe that there is value in taking the American worker out of the loop? They're spending humongous dollars on shipping to save you pennies at the register? Think again. And before you go jumping for joy about all that high paying freight, the Chicom shipping companies are getting the lion's share of the dollars. You can't see where it might be better for all Americans to cut the Chicoms out of the loop?

I agree that we need a strong industrial base. 30 years or so ago people could earn a decent living on minimum wage. They could buy a home, car and live comfortably on minimum wage. One reason that is not possible today is due to huge taxes. Most of the taxes we have today did not exist 30 years ago. Reducing taxes and changing public policy against business would do more to return jobs to this country than anything. I would prefer to see import taxes put back in place. It could enourage businesses to make more products in this country. We also need to change the attitudes of the American consumer. Cheaper is not better. We used to demand quality in the products we purchase. We now seem to be more interested in buying something that is cheap and will last a year rather than paying more for a quality product which will last a lifetime.

Let me give it to you straight. Big business is buying your leadership and your leadership is selling you down the river. Understood? In the meantime, you're willingly surrendering your liberties, YOU have a houseful of worthless, third rate crap and YOU owe the Chicoms 3 trillion bucks.

I agree to some extent about big business buying our leadership, what little we have of leadership. This entire healthcare bill is supported by many large corporations. They would prefer that the government pay for healthcare rather than them having to pick up the tab.


"It would not bode well for the administration if Walmart cut back too much on their purchases from China . . " God forbid we should do anything to upset the administration. What about if it's good for the country? Can we get you onboard if it's for the good of the country? My country . . 'tis of thee? Sweet land of Liberty?

I said the above in a somewhat tongue and cheek manner. But, it would create some problems for the administration to cut back on imports from the bank. And China has become the bank for this administrations radical spending programs.

The Port of Oakland drayage Driver's were set to go on strike today but either the city or the state or the port authority or whomever gave them an extension while they sort out funding for the new clean air contraptions. We all know to some degree a lttle of what's happening in LA/Long Beach. All I can ask is for the first guy to go on strike, would you please block me in, too? Oh, wait! Interfering with an interstate shipment . . even as an act of protest or a labor dispute . . is now an act of terrorism; hence a no bail, Federal crime, of course. That's our leadership. And to Gman et al, at least, that makes sense.

I am not sure how you group me with the liberals. If these people want to strike or don't want to work for the wages offered, then they can stay home or find other employment. There are a number of things which are classified as terrorist acts or hate crimes which should not be classified as such. There is a lot more freight that pays better than hauling cans.

[GMAN]

I have a coworker who is related to Wal-Mart employees who tells me that unionizing is a constant topic of conversation . . but NEVER at work. It's pretty evident from the videos that it goes on quite a bit. I am told there is a strong, well financed outside organization helping to design a new, non-affiliated (no Teamster, SEIU, etc) collective bargaining unit (they don't use the "U" word) at the DC level. If that's true and it takes off, it will be interesting to see if the other unions support the effort while being left out of the deal. I reckon we'd see their true colors.

Unions are big business. I can't imagine them sitting back while another entity takes away their revenue.

Do I think it could happen? I think Wal-Mart is becoming it's own worst enemy. They're a darling of the demon Wall Street and their financials are open for all to see. They're so big, it's only natural that they have to attract attention to themselves which, in turn, invites closer scrutiny of them. Americans have a lot of recent experience with "Too big to . . " They are a fabulously wealthy company at a time when a whole bunch of folks are hurting. Look around. Remember when every community had a "biggest employer in town" that actually produced something? Remember how any commotion "down at the plant" would cause a ruckus and make front page news? Well, today, "the plant" is likely a Wal-Mart and that huge, shuttered, decaying old building in the rundown end of town is a haunting reminder of the thousands of businesses forced out and the millions of people sent on to the dole by the Wal-Mart/Gman/Pelosi/Obama global government business doctrine of higher taxes, more welfare, fewer jobs and lower wages makes for a stronger U. S. A.!

I am still not sure why you want to group me with the liberals and globalists. I am neither. I think that this country would be much better off with smaller locally owned businesses. The global companies are part of the problem. They wield way too much influence in Washington. It is liberal public policy that has been greatly responsible for so many businesses leaving the U.S. I include that along with what I have previously stated about unions.


Individual stores have their ups and downs but I'd bet DC traffic is pretty consistent and, more likely, growing. That might make it a little harder for Wal-Mart to argue that a few extra sheckles for the crew is going to kill the company. If the right group of well coached employees used a precisely coordinated, well reasoned and very positive and public approach, sort of out Wal-Mart the Waltons, so to speak, I don't see how Wal-Mart could fight it and come out looking good. But you know they'll fight. The employees would have to have a blood bond with one another, though, as in, if one goes = we all go. As unlikely as that sounds in today's job environment, I don't think it's any less likely that Wal-Mart could get away easily with firing a bunch of people instead of bargaining. But, Wal-Mart once closed a store in Canada rather than submit to bargaining. At the rate they're building DCs, they could probably manage to mothball a few, if necessary. Beyond that, would a community then continue to support them?

I think that the way Walmart has been doing business is anti American. They go into smaller communities and virtually kill many small businesses. The pharmacy, tire store and retailers are often devastated when Walmart moves into their town. Their size allows them to dangle big tax dollars to politicians who are starving for more tax revenue. They only see the short term gain. They have no idea of the long term devastation. Most of the better paying jobs of yesteryear are related to manufacturing. Walmart has often gone in to areas where they want to move and had local politicians to use the eminent domain laws to steal land from private property owners. I am no fan of Walmart. I rarely shop with them. Walmart got big because American consumers made them that way. If consumers refused to shop with them they would not exist.

[cdswans]

Now, instead of paying a decent wage to produce high quality goods and earning a respectable profit, it makes more sense to bypass the American worker, TRUCK the raw materials across country, ship them overseas, consign the entire manufacturing process to sweat shop labor, ship the finished goods back over here, TRUCK them to the stores and make an enormous profit for the shareholders. Do you honestly believe that there is value in taking the American worker out of the loop? They're spending humongous dollars on shipping to save you pennies at the register? Think again. And before you go jumping for joy about all that high paying freight, the Chicom shipping companies are getting the lion's share of the dollars. You can't see where it might be better for all Americans to cut the Chicoms out of the loop?

Let me give it to you straight. Big business is buying your leadership and your leadership is selling you down the river. Understood? In the meantime, you're willingly surrendering your liberties, YOU have a houseful of worthless, third rate crap and YOU owe the Chicoms 3 trillion bucks.

This flick reinforces my take on the problem. I don't agree with, in fact I am offended by the proposed solution. But the problem isn't going to go away by itself and it does beg a solution. Download and play or stream this flick at bed time and see if you can fall asleep before it's over . .

Zeitgeist - The Movie

[cdswans]

I am not sure how you group me with the liberals. If these people want to strike or don't want to work for the wages offered, then they can stay home or find other employment. There are a number of things which are classified as terrorist acts or hate crimes which should not be classified as such. There is a lot more freight that pays better than hauling cans.

The issue in Oakland is the same as it is in Long Beach: the $20k+ exhaust regurgitator required as of Monday on all trucks that enter the port. It's got nothing to do with wages in and of themselves.

Where wages are concerned, I lump you with the liberals because you have stated repeatedly, like you did here, that you believe government can manage welfare "wages" a lot more effectively than private enterprise can manage a respectable wage.

[GMAN]

The issue in Oakland is the same as it is in Long Beach: the $20k+ exhaust regurgitator required as of Monday on all trucks that enter the port. It's got nothing to do with wages in and of themselves.

Where wages are concerned, I lump you with the liberals because you have stated repeatedly, like you did here, that you believe government can manage welfare "wages" a lot more effectively than private enterprise can manage a respectable wage.

I don't see how these owners can afford to buy fuel, much less $20,000 to retrofit their trucks. When did I ever say that the government can manage anything? I have always said the opposite. I think that it is obvious that the government is incapable of managing anything. All you need do is look at this last year. They do know how to rob the American taxpayer and reward themselves for their incompetence and inefficiency.

[jonp]

Thats the point g-man. the independents and fleet owners can't. This leaves only the unions at the port to haul the containers and makes it a job-security monopoly. That was the point right from the start. I said this on a different thread.

[GMAN]

Thats the point g-man. the independents and fleet owners can't. This leaves only the unions at the port to haul the containers and makes it a job-security monopoly. That was the point right from the start. I said this on a different thread.

So you are saying that the owner operators and independents have basically been driven from the ports and the union companies have taken over that aspect of the business?

[Dejanh]

I have nothing against Wall-Mart.

Only thing that i've seen in that video is a bunch of hard core Americans who love their country and the freedoms of capitalism, bitching about the very same thing that they are embracing in the first place. it cannot work only one way, its a two way street and if you like capitalism then thats what you will get.

I shop at Wall-Mart, they have cheaper prices than any other store so why should I care if they go out of business.
These are the same people crying about how Wall-Marts stuff is made in China while theirs is too. I have bought couple of things at ACe hardware and they were all made in China. I overpayed by about 20% compared to the same thing in Wally world and thats why am never going back.

[GMAN]

Ace is a franchise with local ownership. I prefer going there because if I want to buy a single screw or nut I can without having to purchase an entire box. I can also easily find someone to help me, if needed. And I can get in and out pretty quickly compared to Walmart. I have never cared for Walmart. I just don't like the way that they conduct business. They can kill a number of small businesses when they come to a small town. They do a lot to suppress wages. When they come to town the guy who previously owned the local pharmacy is now working for Walmart because he could not afford to compete with them. Walmart is very predatory. And if you check around their prices are not all that low compared to other retailers. I have found items at other stores that cost less. I usually prefer quality to price. The cheaper product will often cost more in the long run because it will not hold up and need to be replaced.

[Dejanh]

Ace is a franchise with local ownership. I prefer going there because if I want to buy a single screw or nut I can without having to purchase an entire box. I can also easily find someone to help me, if needed. And I can get in and out pretty quickly compared to Walmart. I have never cared for Walmart. I just don't like the way that they conduct business. They can kill a number of small businesses when they come to a small town. They do a lot to suppress wages. When they come to town the guy who previously owned the local pharmacy is now working for Walmart because he could not afford to compete with them. Walmart is very predatory. And if you check around their prices are not all that low compared to other retailers. I have found items at other stores that cost less. I usually prefer quality to price. The cheaper product will often cost more in the long run because it will not hold up and need to be replaced.

But thats the capitalistic society for you, the thing that America is all about. If you cannot compete then get out of the business. I am sure you are glad that Arrow is out of the picture as you have more freight to haul.

I would love to drive for Wall Mart and I am actually seriously preparing myself for that move in the next year or so. Their drivers are the best payed company folks in the industry and they all are very happy with their job.

That store manager who was featured in this video at the beginning didnt talk about his salary, didn't he, yet he blasted every aspect of Wall Mart. Their store managers make well over 80K/year...

We like to complain alot when the capitalistic rules bites us in the butt, but when we are the ones biting and doing well, then its all good.

BTW
ACE Hardware is much more expensive than any Home Depot or Lowes around. You can find individual screws there cant you? Are you against them as well then?

[GMAN]

But thats the capitalistic society for you, the thing that America is all about. If you cannot compete then get out of the business. I am sure you are glad that Arrow is out of the picture as you have more freight to haul.

I would love to drive for Wall Mart and I am actually seriously preparing myself for that move in the next year or so. Their drivers are the best payed company folks in the industry and they all are very happy with their job.

That store manager who was featured in this video at the beginning didnt talk about his salary, didn't he, yet he blasted every aspect of Wall Mart. Their store managers make well over 80K/year...

We like to complain alot when the capitalistic rules bites us in the butt, but when we are the ones biting and doing well, then its all good.

BTW
ACE Hardware is much more expensive than any Home Depot or Lowe's around. You can find individual screws there cant you? Are you against them as well then?

I don't think the collapse of Arrow will have much, if any effect on the industry. I wish that it did. In any case, I don't like to see the demise of any business enterprise.

Lowe's and Home Depot usually sell several nuts and bolts together in a package, as I recall. In any case, it is still much easier and quicker for me to run to Ace. It is easier to find a person to help, too. Admittedly, Ace doesn't have as broad a selection of products as the mega building supply stores, but they do a brisk business and have been around for many years.

[GMAN]

One other thing, Dejanh. This country was built by small business. Small businesses create most of the new jobs in the U.S. Small business pay more in taxes than large corporations. Small business doesn't ask or receive the massive tax breaks or utility discounts that large corporations demand and receive at taxpayer expense. With more smaller businesses there will be more responsiveness to individuals from our elected officials.