Wow - I'm thoroughly confused now... LOL
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Now that I've tried to clear everything I just read from my brain, here's what I would do:
Assuming you own the truck and have a legal right for your wife has the legal right to not only ride as a passenger as well as drive on occasion: While riding as a passenger, keep a multi-day log showing the start/end date & times with "Off-duty Passenger" in the notes. When she's not in the truck (at home), keep a multi-day log stating this as well. When she WOULD be driving, she would then create a 'normal' drivers log for that period. Once she's finished driving/on-duty operations, go back to the "Off-duty Passenger". This way, any DOT officer would have a better understanding on what you're doing and it would take very little explanation for them to understand. Also, as a 'safety', I would have her log an 8hr sleeper berth prior to coming on-duty. This is to cover your asses just in case. I'm not taking any of this from any regulations, but it makes sense (at least in my pea-brain). |
After reading this thread, I'll chime in what I think would be appropriate.
My first question was if she had a qualification pack w/ drug and alcohol testing, but you've cleared that up. I'd have her always keep current logs, even if at home for the simplicity of not having to scramble in the event of an audit. You would be listed as primary operator, and she would be the co-driver. That definition (co-driver) can be murky, but I don't believe in your situation that her driving duties need to be paid. When she goes on duty for driving purposes, I'd play it safe and log a strict continous 10hr sleeper berth prior to driving (and legitamite). The rest of the time, I'd assume that all time in the passenger seat could be logged off duty as you're driving but would not count towards a 10 hr break should she decide to drive, and that is based on what saftey has told me at my carrier. As far as her showing up to drive in another state 1000 miles away to drive...that is legal 100%. However, in the event of prying eyes, they would investigate how she got there (airline travel, ground travel via train/car, hitched a ride, etc). I've done this several times with other drivers in a situation where I have flown them back to our home terminal. I've also been flown back to my truck to team with other drivers. Hopefully, I didn't miss your point and question, musicman. I do have a teaming question- If a driver wants to do a 34 hr restart, can he/she break a 34 hour sleeper berth? Example- logging 30 min off duty when the primary driver stops for a meal? |
Musicman said:
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I WISH I could say this also applies to you, and it MIGHT.... but, I'm just not sure. Once she takes the wheel to keep the truck moving, and you have already driven X number of miles and hours, I believe YOU would fall under the definition of a co-driver. The "intent" is clear. So, as I said earlier.... YOU should log all time in the sleeper EXCEPT the 10 hour breaks she has to take. I didn't say you had to BE in the sleeper. Since YOU cannot log part of your reset in the passenger seat, you MUST log all time that the truck is moving in the sleeper. When she stops for her 10, you can log line 1 and do whatever y'all want to do until she starts driving again. Just make sure that your 34 is a continuous combination of off duty and sleeper that coincides with her RODS. I know you want to relieve yourself of all responsibility during that time and be a "rider," but I don't think you can get away with it. That would be the one thing that would trip you up at a scalehouse. FWIW.... I think you SHOULD be able to as long as YOU show the 10 hour rest period before driving again. But, I think you have already established yourself as the "driver" for the dispatched load, and the regs do not allow a "driver" to work 70 hours without a "defined" 34 hr restart. Quote:
You would like to relieve yourself of all duties/responsibilities and be a "rider" during that time, but once you start driving again... you are subject to all HOS regs concerning a driver, and right now they say you can't be in the passernger seat and be off duty (during your last 7 days.) Now, to further confuse the issue... Much of this depends on the definition of ON DUTY as the REV and I argued about ad infinitum. I believe you read those threads on alcohol and OTR?? Quote:
My opinion is bolstered by the fact that the regs allow you to drive an "unladen" CMV to walmart while you are off duty and log it as line 1. You are obviously ON the truck, and in fact are driving it. But, because you have been relieved of duty... it doesn't qualify as anything on the list of "on duty" activities/definitions. However, the guidance for this reg mentions "short distances." That is why I don't believe you can consider yourself OFF DUTY while the truck is making "paid miles." As to some other comments made by other posters: I don't believe your wife needs to keep logs for months of off duty time. WHEN she drives, she needs to have the last 7 days (probably on one log sheet) AND show the rest period just before driving. The "retention" reg for 6 months of logs does not say it requires every day of the last six months. It says you must retain ANY actual logs of driving time during the last six months. It doesn't matter if she gets PAID for the time she drives. The regs say you must log any time "worked" whether paid or not. Yes, B.C.... you can interrupt a 34 hr restart as often, and for as long, as you wish... as long as it is only for line 1 time (and the truck is not moving.) A restart must be an "uninterrupted" COMBINATION of line 1 and 2 for 34 hours. Now... I MAY not have answered your question to your satisfaction, but... I've done the best I can with the confusing mess of regs that we have to deal with. The regs don't clearly define a co-driver, because they consider us all as DRIVERS when it comes to HOS, etc. Being the owner of a truck (or company) does not relieve you of the requirements for rest prior to driving, nor the 70 hour rule. However, you might try looking at your options under the 70 hour rule... getting some hours back.... that might preclude you actually NEEDING a 34 hr reset. |
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Or, is it that you just don't LIKE my answers? I would agree that the regs are confusing, cumbersome and even sometimes contradictory at first blush. But, I don't thnk they are totally "ridiculous." When you interpret them with the understanding that their underlying purpose is to ensure that you are rested before and while driving... it is not so hard to understand them. If they say you can log off duty while making a short run to the beer store, after being relieved of duty for the day, then they can't mean that ALL time at the controls, or driving, or ON THE TRUCK, must be logged as ON DUTY. If they say you can transport alcohol in the truck during these short trips, (and the beer is not on the manifest,) then... alcohol is not ALWAYS prohibited on a CMV. The difference is the "in operation - in interstate commerce" clause. Line 4 of the "On Duty" definition cannot apply at all times if you can drive short distances (or an unladen CMV) without being subject to line 3 of the same definiton. Definition 3 is dependent on def 1. [You still WITH me?] Now... can your wife drink beer in the passenger seat while you drive and she is legally "off duty" prior to being "in readiness to work?" NO! Because it's not on the manifest and the vehicle is "in operation in interstate commerce." But, once you are "relieved of duty" for the day, you can be IN or ON the truck (defintion 4,) AT the controls and driving (definiton 3,) and be transporting, or in possession of, alcohol (found in the guidance) without being in violation of FMCSA regs. WHY??? Because you are on LINE 5! :lol2: Now... does THAT cover all the bases? :moon::clap: On a side note, from a personal perspective: I deliver FedEx ground freight from terminal to terminal. When I get to one at say... 7 p.m., and am told to check with them at 7 in the morning, I consider myself relieved of duty per definition 1 of the on duty reg. Am I waiting to be dispatched... on company property... yes. But, not really... since they've given me a time to be "in readiness" to work. I bobtail to get dinner. I sit at the controls if I want to. I can't "service" my truck... but, I can do pretty much whatever I want and consider it OFF DUTY. I am NOT restricted to my sleeper! But, once we are dispatched and under a load... I am subject to every one of the definitons of the ON DUTY reg... regardless of which of us is driving. The REV is wrong.... I am right! Case closed. :lol2: |
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