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So if day 9 came and you had a 9 or 10 hour day infront of you to complete your run then this would mean that you could not complete your run because you would only have those hours that you used on day one. Correct. Now the thing that bothers me is that I made a call to the FMCSA yesterday to backup this 34 hour restart. According to them you must take a 34 hour no matter if you run out of hours on day 5 or day 8. The reason they stated is so that a driver has atlest 2 nights and one day of rest before starting another tour of duty (8 day/70 hour week). So any driver caught driving on day nine or driving after doing a 70 tour without a 34 restart would be in violation. I don't know but maybe there is a huge mixup somewere pertaining to this topic. I am not going to get into split berthing as that is a mess all of its own. Bassically, don't do it if you need a full 11 hour driving day along with 3 hours of onduty ahead of you. |
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You do realize what the difference between "may" and "will" is, don't you? Under no circumstances, at any time EVER, is a 34 hour reset mandatory. Period. End of discussion. Case closed. Blah blah blah. If you want to prove me wrong, post a reg that states that a driver must take a 34 hour reset. Otherwise shut up. Please. If I reach 70 hours at 11:59 pm on day 8, I gain back all my hours from day 1 at 12:00 am on day 9 (one minute later). Period. End of discussion. Case closed. This subject has been beaten to death both here and in other places already. The 34 hour reset is not mandatory. Here's some documentation to support it from several sources: Quote:
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I hope I don't need to post a definition of the word "voluntary". Now stop the damn misinformation in this thread already. :roll: |
Ya know. I don't think any of this really matters since only a few of us (NOT ME) could argue a case in our own defense when confronted with a situation where a DOT official says you are out of hours!
It's too bad that the person in charge couldn't read this and every other thread associated with HOS. |
Sorry, Bigtimba..... those of us you sent to the corner, are now at the corner BAR drinking a beer on YOUR tab!! YOU are going back one grade in school for flunking English! :lol: :lol:
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May NOT has only ONE meaning.... that you CANNOT do it legally. Ever play the game of "mother may I?" You ask her if you MAY. If she answers NO... you MAY NOT... you can't MOVE. If she answers Yes, you MAY.... it means you are ALLOWED to move.... but not REQUIRED to move. Now.... if you change that word to SHALL, you will be COMPELLED to move if she tells you that YOU SHALL... and cannot move if she says YOU SHALL NOT. The correlation here is that MAY and SHALL mean a nearly oppposite thing when used without NOT. However, they mean exactly the SAME thing when used WITH "not." So.... if you have reached 70 hours in 8 days, you MAY NOT nor SHALL not move until you EITHER take a 34 hour restart... OR... gain back hours at midnight that night IF you have any to gain. Conversely, if you burn your 70 hours in less than 8 days, you MAY take 34 hours off and start all over even if you've only been working for 5 days or so, but.... NO ONE is telling you that you SHALL take a 34 hour restart before driving again. You MAY also sit on your arse and WAIT for the 9nth day and get back ONLY the hours from day 1 that have now been DEDUCTED from the 70 that you've used. But, again... NO ONE is telling you that you SHALL have to take the 34 hour reset, nor that you SHALL wait until day 9..... UNTIL or UNLESS the current rules are finally struck down which would ELIMINATE the 34 hour reset option and then, if you burn 70 in 5 days..... YOU SHALL have to and WILL have to wait until day 9! Although I agree that the FMCSA sometimes is confusing, in THIS case THEY are using the right terminology with the CORRECT definitons. YOU are the one that is misinterpreting the definiton of MAY. In summation... You MAY take the 34 hour reset (as they say... at ANY time... you might even have used only 50 hours... to get a NEW 70 hour tour of duty.) OR you MAY wait until you have hours to get back from day 1 .... which won't be until day 9. But, IF you have burned your 70 in less than 8 days, you MAY not drive again until you've done ONE or the OTHER in my last sentence. Futhermore... there is NO advantage to stopping at 69.75 hours. You're just wasting 15 minutes. IF you are on day 8, you will get hours back at midnight (if you worked on the 8th day back,) if you are on day 6 or 7, you will not get ANY hours back at midnight, and would only have 15 mins to DRIVE the next day... although you COULD work on line 4. I'm sorry if this is a bit confusing..... but all our attempts at a SIMPLE explanation seem to have gone over a few heads here! :lol: Quote:
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What that reg MEANS.... is that you don't HAVE to live off the hours you'll gain back each night. You MAY say "that's not gonna keep me rolling well enough.... I think, since I'm out of hours at 2 a.m. on my 8th day, and I'm ONLY gonna gain..say... 5 hours from day 1.. IF I SIT HERE ALL DAY... !! I think I'll just shut down the REST of today (22 hours) and sleep thru tomorrow night (12 hours) and start with a FRESH "tour of duty" at NOON on day 9!! I'll then have a fresh 70, fresh 11, and fresh 14!! That will allow me to drive until 11 pm on day 9 and reach my shipper, whereas.... I couldn't GET there with only 5 hours!!! Quote:
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Besides, square roots have nothing to do with how many hours a day one can work without busting his 70 hour clock. That has been established as being EXACTLY 8.75 hours. But, it is not related to the square root of 70 (or 69) and in fact could NOT be unless we were allowed 76.56 hours a week! But.... I guess you were just WONDERING! :lol: :lol: However.... you are close. Don't feel like grabbing the calculator at the moment, but 8 is the square root of 64..... and 2 is the square root of 4. That might INDICATE something close to 8.2.... because 3 is the root of 9. And 64 + 9 = 73. HOWEVER.... it doesn't WORK that way as 8.3 squared is actually closer to 68.9 not 73. So.... the answer would be something like 8.3XX! :lol: :lol: BTW...... thanks for the beer! :wink: |
The Rev would not make this mistake, I'm sure. But, the Rev quoted somebody who did.
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I have no other problems with the Rev's post at this current time! :lol: |
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What has happened to the schools, log departments, and safety departments?
Whoever is teaching these people either don't know the rules or don't seem to be able to teach their class. It's no wonder so many drivers are placed out-of-service. kc0iv |
Tha is easy the REGS on HOS have changed so many times in the last couple years and the current ones are ON THE WAY OUT do to a court challenge. The Saftey Depts have no clue which ones the FMCSA is using at that time.
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