So what. Lemon juice works as a cleaner in many cases. But just because you don't see it advertised as a cleaner on the side of the bottle, doesn't mean it doesn't work as such. :lol2:

I never claimed to be a scientist or a researcher. All I did was offer information on what I have done with the vehicles I have owned and described to the best of my ability, the results I got in response to a question about what additives I use. I even said that I'm not offering empirical evidence but you haven't offered any empirical evidence showing that it causes any harm either, yet your not shy about stating that "Anyone who is putting transmission fluid in their fuel is a fool". There needs to be some clarification there too. I clearly started that I stopped doing that when they started dying off road fuel red and testing the fuel in the tanks of on road trucks. If that were not the case though, I would have done it right up to the last time I service a truck.

Maybe the packaged Injector Cleaning products are ATF or maybe just the detergents and solvents used in ATF in a high priced package. Who knows, I'm not a chemist or a marketing professional either. I'm just a retired truck driver that drove and pulled wrenches on trucks for more then 45 years. I know what worked for me.

Many cleaning products use lemon juice as an ingredient.

I never stated that it caused harm.

Sometimes you get fuel that is not quality & you don't know it. filled up months ago & got at least 1 pint of water in fuel. lucky my filter caught it. my neighbor had same problem, same location. so when you say use quality fuel in the first place, it's not like we choose to put low quality fuel in.

Knowing that I stopped adding it when the red dye became an issue, how else would your statement be expected to be taken. "Anyone who is putting transmission fluid in their fuel is a fool"

Because it's throwing money away on something that has not been proven to do anything, and then the guilty party is claiming it is solving all the woes of the world. That seems awfully foolish.

ATF is a thin oil; a lubricant. Adding it to your fuel increases your fuel's lubricity a great deal. Lubricity is why keeps your fuel injector pump alive, and lubricates the upper cylinder for longer engine life.

Back several years ago, when they lowered the sulfur content of diesel, what they added to remove sulfur also lowered fuel lubricity, and trucks left and right were breaking down because of it.

There is a definite benefit to adding ATF to you fuel at a ratio of say, 200:1. But you can also accomplish the same thing adding blue 2-stroke oil instead. Or maybe even whale oil for that matter.

I've also seen a study whereby adding 2-stroke oil increases your MPG a few % (but I can't seem to find it now, it was in a diesel pickup forum).

Show me an unbiased scientific study which supports this conclusion.

That is incorrect.

Right here!

http://www.johnfjensen.com/Diesel_fu...itive_test.pdf

Check out the chart at the very bottom.

The fact that the testing laboratory is never mentioned, and the credentials of the person conducting the test are "GM Duramax Diesel owner/enthusiast" aside, there is no mention of Automatic Transmission Fluid anywhere in that test.

FAIL.

The guilty party, that's me I guess, made no such claim. ...all the woes of the world? ? ?

It was my money to spend as I chose and I have been clear all the way through that the perceived results I am expressing are my opinion in response to a direct question which, if you don't remember was, "What Type Of Fuel Additive Are You Guys Using?"

I never suggested or recommended that anyone else do it and in fact, I pointed out in my very first post in this thread that I don't do it anymore because of the red dye issue.

I'm not just referring to you. I've seen countless people claim that ATF does everything from cleaning the injectors to cleaning the inside of the fuel tank. The fact of the matter is, there is no scientific evidence that it does any of the claims that people have attributed to it. Until there is, it's throwing money away. Sure, you have every right to do it. I also have every right to call you an idiot for doing it too.

I only use Lucas in my oil because I have seen the difference on my pressure gauge... no other reason.

After 20,000 miles with just plain old delvac, my pressure at 1,000rpm idle was about 40psi..... with the lucas it remained at 60psi. Thats all, not saying it's going to turn water into wine or walk on water, but then again, some take that as a SIGN too but who am I to judge what one person thinks is RIGHT?

I used their fuel additive as well, but only after my FLD had sat for a year without starting (turbo was off and it was winter here) the tiny bit of fuel left in it had gone to crap and even after adding another 260 gallons of fresh fuel it still ran bad. I added a bottle for the next 3 fill-ups and it cleared it up....... I dont add any now but I'm going to change injectors soon.

I could be mistaken but the count in this thread is only two that have indicated using ATF in their fuel so the countless people you are referring to must be from some other place.

I once had a man tell me story about another man that was offended over being called a jackass. His friend told him if one man calls you a jackass you can just dismiss it. If two people call you a jackass in the same day you might start thinking about what their saying. If a large number of people are calling you a jackass, you might want to turn and see if you have a tail. In your case though the countless people are the ones that are wrong I guess.

I guess I had it right a couple of days ago when I said "You seem to have a very cut and dried, short sited view of things." If it doesn't fit YOUR idea of what works or whats right, the person doing it is stupid. So when it comes to you, I can only surmise that all of your exaggerations, over dramatizations and name calling are just to try to make yourself sound superior.

Just out of curiosity, do you drive an ox cart?

There are other threads in this forum than this one. People have been claiming that ATF does magical things here since I joined in 2005.

Or maybe I just know more than you. :cool:

Only on weekends.

Well that's got to be it. You just know more then all of those countless people, myself included.

So what happened, you get banned or something??? Cuz it looks to me like your in ROOKIE status again with a 2010 join date.

I remember a Rev Vasco or something like that before......

That's right. And I challenged all of them to produce a scientific study that shows that ATF does a bit of good as well.

I used to be an admin here. I left the site last year. I'm sure I'll do the same again soon, since the average IQ here hasn't improved.

For those couple of you on this thread that have not been introduced to The Rev. on here or were not here before he left last time.....this is pretty much how you can expect every thread he participates in to go. Good or bad, this is what you will get. If you havent gotten the hint on several of his posts since his return, he considers nearly every one on here to be at a lower mental level than himself. Nothing is new. But he is good for board traffic. Everyone tends to tune in to his threads.

Not just here.:thumbsup:

Seriously though. I know everything about everything.

The results of ATF would be very similar to 2-stroke oil - PASS. :lol2:

So says you. And you aren't a scientist. You're a steering wheel holder.

I saw a study done by some diesel pickup truck forum on fuel additives. I believe it was the same test SAE uses? with the weighted ball scratch method???? Anyway the conclusion was that the best ones were 2 cycle oil, motor oil and Lucas in that order I'm pretty sure, but you would have to add them in such large amounts it would be impractical from a cost standpoint and having to carry 10s of gallons of additive with you required at each fill up. I think a 10:1 ratio fuel to additive is were results start to have an effect on lubricity.

This is all from my memory and I can't recall the forum because it was a just a link in another forum I belong, but I know what I posted here is fairly accurate. In any case - long story short - additives are ineffectual in the quantities prescribed by the mfrs.

If it makes you feel good - do it, it's a (mostly) free country and I'm sure the additive makers have a boat payment or Mercedes payment they need to make.

Cold weather from my experience the only sure way to be safe is a fuel heater. Kerosene may not work as good anymore since K-1 is now low sulfur also.

2 gallons of Howes and 5 gallons of Power service plus new filter didn't get me going in only -28F weather. And that was back when diesel was diesel! 1500 ppm sulfur baby! What it took was top off tanks with Kerosene. Probably ended up with a 60:40 ratio No2 to No1.

With my coolant powered fuel heater I don't need any of that crap. Just straight No2 and leave it running.

What makes you ATF users think your injectors are dirty to begin with? This new ULSD is more like a solvent than a fuel oil. It cleaned the inside of my tanks when it first came out. Went through a few rounds of fuel filters until things got spic and span.

It was only a matter of time before Rev-a-Saggy came a-crawlin' back.

Who's YerDaddy? Who's YerDaddy?

I generally use the ball scratch method to determine what I'm going to put in my fuel tanks. Since they itch a lot in the summer, I tend to spend a lot of $ on additives.