Elog Mandate
 

I just read that the bill that contains the elog mandate is going to the White House for the president's signature. I called OOIDA and was told that the litigation and debate is far from over and it may still be a long time before it is implemented, if ever.

Keep us posted as just about everyone is very interested in this outcome.

Well the debate is over, it is now here and folks have till December 2017 to comply. That is, unless it gets put on hold in some way. Sure won't be stopped with this president and this congress. Only real hope would be after the next election. Once those characters take office then, it will be 11 months from full compliance. Not a lot of time to get it put on hold. We'll have to see what happens.

Will do, Scoe. This could still go on for several years. I have an older truck that is currently exempt from the elog mandate, but should I decide to upgrade to anything 2000 or newer, I would be subject to the elog rules.

Copperhead, it is still not over until all the lawsuits are settled. We might get lucky with a new conservative administration next year, but it may take getting new blood in both the Democratic and Rino congress to make any meaningful changes that actually benefit this industry. The current administration and spineless congress have only increased the useless regulations on this industry and is costing us as an industry billions of additional dollars for compliance. I hope conservatives get out and vote in the primaries as well as in the general election. We need to take a very close look at each candidates voting history and background before casting a vote. Those who fail to vote are giving the left their vote. Rest assured that the left will get their people out to vote. I continue to stay in touch with my congressional representatives, as should we all. We have between 3 to 5 million drivers nationally. That is a strong voting block, if only everyone pulled together. The least any of us can do is to vote and to send an email or make a phone call on pending legislation that can impact this industry.

This has nothing to do with conservatism... The right wingers do not care about this at all because like most things,, it has nothing to with abortion or what gay people do in their lives or guns.... or brown people.

Truth is, one can file a lawsuit for anything, as to whether it has standing to continue on to litigation, that is another. And until there is legal action that would stay the implementation of the mandate, it will go into effect. All one can do is prepare for the worse, and hope for the best.

I am not sure why you wanted to make this an issue about conservatism or other issues, Fozzy. But, since you did, I will offer some definitions about what is conservatism is about.

Conservatives believe that we don't need government to legislate or regulate everything in our lives. Conservatives believe in the Bible and one GOD. We support the Constitution, as written, without changing the words to mean things that they don't in order to meet a certain agenda. Conservatives believe in life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Conservatives believe that it is up to us to take care of ourselves and our families and we don't need the government to provide for all our needs.

Conservatives believe in people taking personal responsibility for their actions. We believe the less government we have the better for the people in this country. Conservatives believe that people should be free to worship or not without interference from the government. Conservatives believe that life begins at conception and that ALL life is important, regardless of whether that life in in the womb or out and regardless of the color of one's skin. Conservatives believe that marriage is between one woman and one man, as decreed by GOD, and that it is not the place of government to create special rights for certain groups or those who would pervert marriage. Conservatives believe that something is either right or wrong.

Copperhead, it is still not over until all the lawsuits are settled. We might get lucky with a new conservativeadministration next year, but it may take getting new blood in both the Democratic and Rino congress to make any meaningful changes that actually benefit this industry. The current administration and spineless congress have only increased the useless regulations on this industry and is costing us as an industry billions of additional dollars for compliance. I hope conservatives get out and vote in the primaries as well as in the general election. We need to take a very close look at each candidates voting history and background before casting a vote. Those who fail to vote are giving the left their vote. Rest assured that the left will get their people out to vote. I continue to stay in touch with my congressional representatives,

Gee... maybe it was that?

You conservative and god twaddle is more of the same for more of the same.. Social Conservatism is not conservatism, Conservatives these days want the government in other people's lives.. just not their own.

Nice trick Fozzy.
Accusing republicans of being social justice warriors, like yourself is correct.
Your "kind" has infected that party, but you might not have got the memo yet, in Oklahomo. :)

True conservatives, and I know you know this, call that kind of republican, a backstabbing RINO sellout.
That kind of republican is as anti-American and anti-Christian as you. :)

You prove my point.. thanks. There are no conservatives left. Conservatism died with Goldwater. Now the GOP and their supporters are nothing but the Christian version of the Muslim brotherhood.

As for Oklahoma.. the "Conservatives" (Christian Brotherhood) have the state ranked practically last in everything and over 400 million in debt..

I don't think millions of conservatives or christians are finding anything in common anymore, with the GOP or the DNC.
For that matter, the DNC have already officially turned their back on Almighty God, so why any christian would have anything to do with the democratic party is crazy.

There is a separating of the chaff going on, and long over due.
We are being deliberately flooded with atheists, muslims and ready made socialists and commies to change the demographic, and our youth indoctrinated, so yes, we are being replaced.

There are a lot of people who either consider themselves conservative or at least profess to be conservative. I think that many of them have no idea what a conservative is or should be. We have become a nation of compromisers who will not stand up for what is right. They are more interested in being politically correct that doing what is right. I have heard some politicians say that they are financially conservative, but socially liberal. The two philosophies are incompatible. It isn't difficult to tell when someone is conservative. All you need to do is listen to them and watch how they behave.

Americans have allowed our children to be indoctrinated in our schools. I am sometimes amazed when I hear young people talk about this country. Most have no idea what is going on. They are only interested in themselves and what the government can do for them. Attitudes have change so much in the last decade or so. I guess it has been building for some time. It astounds me how blind some people are as to what has been happening to our country. Several people with whom I have spoken recently, don't want to even discuss politics. My grand niece really gets upset when people discuss politics. I think most people sense something bad is happening to this country. I think she is just scared. That may be why so many people are supporting Sanders. He tells them that he has a solution and that he will fix their problems with someone else paying the bill. They still don't understand that there is nothing for free. I still know a lot of true conservatives. In fact, most people whom I know are real conservatives. I don't see how anyone can be a true conservative without having a belief in GOD. I also don't see how anyone can be a liberal or so called progressive and call themselves a Christian. Their core beliefs go against Biblical teachings.

Obama and these globalists would like to destroy the foundation of this country. Our foundation is based upon a Christian belief in an almighty GOD. If they can destroy our foundation they can replace it with whatever they wish. There are those who believe that the god of Islam and the GOD of Abraham and Issac are the same. They are not. You can easily see they are not the same by reading the Bible and the Quoran. One teaches about love and forgiveness. The other teaches about violence, revenge, destruction and hate. I will stick to the GOD that teaches about love and forgiveness. I believe that unless we turn back to our foundation that this country will not turn around.

Total blithering idiocy when compared to the actual history of the "christians" in this country, for the thousandth time.. there is no mention of christianity in the founding documents of this country. The constitution is the basis of the country and the constitution is purposefully secular. The only people who insist that the country is christian based is radical usually white christians. This supposed great loving and forgiving white christian faction have enslaved and murdered millions of non white / non-christian people here in this country. So either you're crazy or you're lying about the foundation of the country. If the choice is turning the country into a Christian Iran or letting it be destroyed.. I choose the latter.

IDK why we have keep resorting to blaming the left or the right for the status quo. Both are corrupt. GMAN should not try to blame the left for regulations as he knows that the ATA and their bought and paid for legislators are of both parties. This is not a partisan issue and voting conservative in the general election will do nothing for our cause.
As to the religious blabble- The case for this country having been founded with the GODDESS COLUMBIA in mind is much stronger than any other deity, so let's just drop that bull. As Fozzy stated- that debate ended when the constitution made the country secular.

In both the regulation and religious issues there is a common thread: people that claim they want freedom but really want their freedom while taking others freedom away.

If I am not mistaken:
Truck drivers are exempted from minumum wage legislation due to the industry having argued that there was no means for verifying hours worked. If the ELOG mandate goes into effect, this is no longer the case and a push to pay all drivers hourly ensue.
In theory this could transform the industry back toward the model used before deregulation and increase the prevalence of LTL trucking.

UPDATE!! OOIDA has filed another lawsuit against the FMCSA concerning elogs. This time they filed challenging the constitutionality of the mandate. This is a different slant on the mandate that is supposed to be implemented next year. There are a number of reasons why elogs should not be forced on the trucking industry. I just read that the ATA is now pushing for a 75 hour hos extension from the current 70 hour due to elogs. I find it interesting that the ATA is now crying about how elogs are negatively impacting their member's business since it was the ATA and a handful of their largest members who pushed the legislation in the first place.

Are you refering to the below application for exemption?

https://www.federalregister.gov/arti...-for-exemption

OOIDA lawsuit is challenging the constitutionally of ELD's for violating truckdrivers 4th Amendment right. Thou I am no fan of these Big Brother Boxes, but can't the same argument be made for paper logs?

It is quite clear, GMAN, that YOU were the one who made this topic about "conservatism." And by the rules of the board, you should now move this topic to the POLITICS sub-forum. Just sayin' You seem to have a real problem discussing any topic without "blaming" Democrats or Liberals for all the ills you perceive in this industry as well as the country.

I guess it would surprise you to know that "liberals" agree with you to a great extent. The main difference is that conservatives consider the gov't to be meddling in their "business ventures" whereas... libs consider the meddling to be in "social" ventures. The Constitution, however, is more of a "social contract" with the citizens than it is a business contract. Oh, and BTW.... many of our founding fathers were considered Liberals.

That's fine... but, the Constitution also makes it clear that religious beliefs are NOT the foundation of our government. It makes it clear that citizenship is NOT "infringed" by ones belief or lack thereof. About the ONLY reference to religion in the Constitution is the clear FACT that there shall be NO "religious test" for the office of President or any other office in government. This was by design so that our government could NEVER be controlled by the "Church of England" which DID control the English government of the time... including even lower offices and administrative positions.

No you don't. You constantly try to interpret it to support your theocratic ideals of the country you WANT America to be. You want protection of religious displays on PUBLIC government properties in CLEAR violation of the 1st Amendment prohibition against government "establishment" of any (or a certain) religion. You rallied in support of DOMA (for religious reasons) in clear violation of the Civil Rights Act, and ignore the 4th Amendment when you vote for legislation that would invade a woman's body with ultrasound to tell her what she already KNOWS.... that she is pregnant!

Unless that "liberty" (or freedom) is exercised by a WOMAN. DAMN "her" pursuit of happiness. It need not even be said that conservatives by far are those most in favor of the death penalty. And, if it were not for liberals... there would be no laws requiring deadbeat dads to pay child support! So much for "taking responsibility."

Your side doesn't own the patent on this. Most Dems feel the same way. Get off your high horse! Statistics prove that the majority of "welfare" recipients in this country are white... and many of them vote Republican.

The day that Gov Rick Snyder commits "hari kari" for his actions that poisoned a whole generation of (mostly) black children in Flint, MI is the day I will believe that. And when corporations stop polluting our air, water and land... I will consider that we don't need the EPA (which was created by NIXON!) Have you forgotten that the gulf oil spill was created because a corporation wanted to save a few bucks and get around "regulations?" THEY were so-called "good" conservatives now weren't they? Perhaps, IF we could "trust" conservatives... we wouldn't NEED so many regulations.

Give me a break! NO ONE is stopping you! I grew up in the Baptist Church! You/They have lost NO freedoms in the 60 years I've been alive! Any "freedoms" you claim to have lost were not given to you in the Constitution! You decry "special interests" and "activism," yet it is YOU who want more than you are allowed... at the expense of others.

Bullshirt! As soon as a baby is born... to a poor or "colored" person... you obstruct ANY legislation that will help them get good healthcare or education. You only care about them IF their parents have the income to provide everything for them... and do all you can to keep those parents from making a living wage! I don't personally KNOW if we should consider an unborn child as a "citizen" or not... but... the constitution doesn't. And even the Bible says that (your) God breathed LIFE into us when we were BORN! A "stillborn" child has NO rights. Don't get me wrong. I am not callous. I have a child and grandchildren. I can be both Pro-Life... AND Pro-choice! I believe this is a personal decision that the gov't has NO right in deciding! Wow... how "conservative" of me! lol.

I am quite well versed in Biblical teachings. God never actually SAID that! In fact, early Jews often had more than one wife. [And that is only pertinent IF you believe that Jews were his "chosen" people and he hated the rest of his creation.] And, again.... our country was NOT founded entirely on what (your) GOD "decreed!" Our government has NOT created "special" rights for certain groups. It (and our Supreme Court) has upheld the ideal of EQUAL rights for ALL Americans. It's not really about the definition of marriage. It's about equal TAX status for "cohabitating" parents... and their rights to adopt or biologically produce children and raise them as a family. In fact... and I find this interesting... look up the definition of "marriage" in Webster's. The word actually means an "alliance" of two parties. Like "marrying" two metals to form an alloy. It's a "joining" together of two things or people. Why are "conservatives" so hung up on the definition of MARRIAGE? I don't totally understand why two people of the SAME sex are attracted to each other or, dare I say.... LOVE each other... but, it's not up to ME to decide... OR discriminate! It's NOT my "business!" It has NO bearing on MY life. Why is it so important to YOU?

No... conservatives believe anything that "offends" them is WRONG! WHO died and made YOU GOD?

I just saw a summary and it stated extending the hos from 70 to 75 hours. I did not see anything in the link that specified any sort of extension of the hos, only an exemption to stop the clock when the driver is waiting to be loaded.

Golfhobo, I won't spend the next hour going through your post and responding. It is obvious that you are having a meltdown. So, let's get back to the original topic, which is elogs.

No meltdown. Just tired of hearing you make every post an attack on Dems or Libs.... even when it's not in the Politics forum (as evidenced here.)

Don't know all that much about the origin of the ELOG mandate... but, pretty sure it wasn't Obama's idea.

Conservatives are aligned with big business. Surely, you don't argue that fact. The ELOG mandate, according to you, would give THEM more control over us drivers. Am I still right? I really don't care too much either way, cuz I've been using them for awhile and don't see a problem.

But... I note that it has not yet been "settled" during a Democratic administration. So... I'd say they aren't "all in" on it.

IIRC.... almost ALL of this new HOS crap started in 2001 or 2003. Do I need to remind you who was POTUS at the time?

Nice "try," GMAN. But, you conservatives OWN this one.

Both parties are aligned with big business and special interest groups. I find it interesting that Democrats choose to associated Republicans with business and try to convince the populace that they are not. Just off the top of my head I can name a few big businesses that support Democrats. George Soros and his many enterprises is a huge supporter of communist/democratic candidates and causes. GE is a big supporter of Democrats as are many in Hollywood. Then there is Walmart and Tyson Foods. Some big businesses support both parties so that they can wield influence whoever wins. I have been involved in political campaigns on both sides and seen it first hand. Both have dirty hands.

As far as elogs are concerned, I don't recall ever stating that it was Obama who created elogs or the mandate. It was the ATA and a handful of major carriers who pushed this legislation and when it failed to pass as a stand alone bill, it was put into the highway bill in the middle of the night and at the last minute so that they could force this through congress. It was under Obama's watch and his people who supported elogs. His administration is all about control. We have seen literally thousands of useless new regulations under his administration. Elogs have never been about safety. They are about money. Unfortunately, that is true with most regulations. If you are using elogs and happy with them, then good for you. Most of us don't want to be forced to purchase the hardware or spend the monthly fee on something we can do for a fraction of the cost with paper. From a business point of view, I can purchase about 3 years worth of paper logs for what I would be forced to spend monthly with elogs and that does not include the hardware. It is easier for a mega carrier to justify the costs of installing elogs. I think one reason some of these big carriers have pushed elogs for everyone is so they won't see a mass exodus of drivers to carriers who don't use elogs. When a driver (most) have a choice between working for a carrier that uses elogs and on one that uses paper, most will choose the carrier that uses paper.

Don't make me look up what proportion of 'support' by GE and Walmart goes to which party, but I can guarantee you the facts will not support your view.

As to Elogs- I do not mind them as long as the driver can edit them when he sees fit, are not linked to tracking devices nor accessible to carriers in real time to check how many hours the driver has. We all know you can run an elog on an ipad or similar device and upload that record to the carrier at legally prescribed intervals by tethering your device to a cell phone or logging onto an open wifi. So really running elogs is not highly costly, but the junk hardware carriers want us to install is.

If a driver can edit his own elogs, it defeats the purpose of installing them, even though the driver should be able to edit as needed. The carrier can edit them, but the driver can't. I think that if a carrier requires an owner operator to install elogs and they insist they install a specific brand, that they should be willing to reimburse the owner operator or pay for it themselves along with the monthly fee. If you look at how the IRS determines whether someone is an independent contractor or employee, this could be considered something that would change an owner operator from an independent contractor to an employee, due to the control issue. At this point it is not even a law or required by the feds, yet a number of carriers require elogs in order to lease to them.

Can't speak to anyone else, but I can edit my e-logs all I need to, except driving line.

Most people who have actually run electronic logs know that.. its the "experts" and conspiracy theorists who have never ran them that don't know.