Originally Posted by GMAN

I am sorry that I misunderstood, Graymist. I know you would like a concise answer, but there are still some variables. You can earn a good living as a company driver. The nice thing about being a company driver is that you can forget about the business when you go home. If you own the truck, there always seems to be something which needs to be done. On the other hand, the opportunity exists to earn more as an owner operator. Notice I said the opportunity exists? I have seen owner operators do well and others lose their shirts. If you want to become a successful owner operator, you MUST treat it as a business. Start by learning all you can about how the industry works while you are still a company driver. You won't know it all by driving a truck for someone else, but it can be a great learning experience. If you own the truck, that means that it is your responsibility to see that all maintenance is performed as needed and to pay for all expenses. It isn't cheap running a truck. The key is finding the right carrier. Personally, I could not imagine leasing to most of the mileage carriers. The rates are simply too low. However, they don't seem to have a problem finding people to lease to them. In most cases, you will earn more money leasing to a carrier who pays percentage. The majority of percentage carriers don't have forced dispatch. That gives you the opportunity to find the better paying loads. Most carriers have areas they run which have better paying freight than other areas. It takes time to learn their system and where the best freight is running. With a mileage carrier, it really doesn't matter where you run since you are paid the same rate regardless.

There are some owner operators who do well running with a percentage carrier and others who fail miserably. You can't always run only where you want to go. You need to follow the freight. That is where some owner operators get into trouble. They want to see a particular area of the country, so they take a cheap load to that area, then get stuck because freight is slow or rates are cheap. When you run on percentage you absolutely MUST have good rates. Good rates come from good freight areas.

A driver is an employee. A owner operator is a businessman. With proper planning and hard work, you should do much better as an owner operator than a company driver. The percentages and income will differ according to the segment of the industry you are involved and experience. There are company drivers who earn from $80-120M or more. Those are not the norm, but those positions do exist. There are owner operators who only net $40M or less. Those are two extremes. I don't know the average income for all drivers, but I would guess somewhere around $40-60M, on average. I would guess the average net for most owner operators would lie somewhere between $50-80M. Again, there are exceptions to every case.

I keep going back to treating this as a business. Some people are better managers than others. You can have 3 people who are owner operators and leased to the same carrier and each will have a different net. One final note. They type of freight you haul can significantly impact your income.

Originally Posted by Graymist

Is it possible to be an independant carrier, but carry only Company X's loads as if one were an o/o leased with that company ? And, from time to time, haul for different such companies....say, for eg, 1 week with company x, the next week with company y, the following week back with company x, and so on ? By company, I'm referring to companies like Crete or Superior or Knight, for eg.

Originally Posted by Graymist

2 issues here, Gman....

a) in case of percentage loads, how does one ascertain the true value of how much the load is paying ? Are companies on the up and up with this information, or are they prone to showing a lower value out of which to pay the percentage to the o/o, in order to pad their own margins ?

b) what kind of loads usually pay more ? I'm more interested in bulk hauling, as you may have gleaned from my posts and queries here....is hauling bulk lucrative ?

Originally Posted by GMAN

Boneebone, the figures you quote may have been what you paid, but they are not necessarily the norm. You made very specific statements about what owner operators pay or don't have to pay when leased to a carrier as compared to someone running their own authority. When you make specific statements and those are incorrect, you should expect those who know better to take exception. And just so you know, not everyone pays $8-9,000 for cargo and liability insurance. Some of us pay less, although others can pay more. A friend of mine just applied for his authority and I believe he told me that he is paying over $6,000 including collision or comprehensive. Those with little or no experience could pay a higher rate. He has a number of years experience but has never ran his authority. His rates will likely go down as long if he doesn't have any accidents or major claims. He will be getting his own base plates after paying for his own plates while leased to a carrier. I believe he told me that he will pay about $1,500 for his base plates. He lives in Virginia. Some costs can vary from state to state, where you run and where you base your truck.

Most of the higher paying carriers do not pay the base plates for their owner operators. They may advance the money, but will take a flat rate out of each settlement check until they are reimbursed plus interest.

It does cost more to run your own authority. Most of the higher cost is associated with cargo and liability insurance. Those costs can be more than offset with greater profits. Let's just say that your monthly gross while leased to a carrier is $10,000 and you receive 75% of the rate. If you run your authority you should automatically give yourself a $2,500 monthly raise. Even if you pay $750/month (9000/12=$750) in insurance premiums, you will still have $1,750 more in monthly income for the same number of miles. It comes down to how much you want to do and your level of expertise. There are additional responsibilities when you run your own authority. There are no guarantees. When you lease to a carrier you are actually paying for their cargo and liability insurance by being paid a smaller percentage. When you run your authority you have all the responsibilities and receive all the profit. When you lease to a carrier you receive a smaller percentage or mileage pay instead of all the profit.

Originally Posted by Joymax_Trans2

For the person who said that independents don't get detention and a whole bunch of other stuff that was not true, does not know what he's talking about. I get detention, I get paid for deadhead miles because I include those mile when I'm negotiating the rate. I have a certain amount that I will move my truck for based on my CPM. I run everyday and am home on the weekends unless something really good comes my way then I will run on a weekend. I run 18 states and pay $1,200. I get paid for detention time, I don't pay for lumper fees because I insist that the Broker pays for the lumper fee and I make them include that information in the rate confirmation sheet. If the Broker does not agree to pay for lumper fee then I do not take the load. I don't run toll lanes but do have access to Prepass, I don't pay full price for tires because I have two national accounts.

I analyze where the freight is within the states that I run and that is how I choose where to go. If you running a lane that is not a good freight area then you will sit or deadhead significantly to find a good paying load. If I don't want to work but a few days per week then it's my choice - I don't have to worry about making my dispatcher angry. It's all about the freedom and what kind of responsibility you are willing to take. You are responsible for you and how much money that you want to make and also how successful you want to be.

Originally Posted by Joymax_Trans2

Whatever, get your facts together before making blanket statements then maybe you won't get verbally beat up on. And yes, I read your long a.... post. Maybe your the one that needs to reread it. Go be a slave and leave us hard working guys alone to work as we please and live in peace.