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Fredog
Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Posts: 2131
Location: North Georgia
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| Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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Rev.Vassago wrote: Fredog wrote: ok, there are 24 hours in 24 period so the maximum number of hours you could drive in a 24 period would be 24.. I didnt say maximum allowed, I said maximum possible. Okay, Rev, let's see you dispute that
It depends what day of the year it is. On March 9 of this year, there are only 23 hours in the day, and on November 2nd, there are 25 hours. So there. :P
doesnt matter,I said a 24 hour period, not a day.. SO THERE... NANA BOO_BOO |
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mdgardner963
Joined: 16 Jan 2008
Posts: 156
Location: California
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| Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 1:55 pm Post subject: Re: logging no no? |
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repete wrote: I now run the same route 5 nights a week and am home from about 0200-1500 hrs.
this is where the question comes in. I am logging this time on line 1 off duty. An other driver said thats wrong(I know I shouldn't listen but now worry about it) he said it should be logged on line 2 or I need a hotel reciept for DOT. I start logging and end at the same time and same location so it's evident that I must be home.
Its very simple if you are out of the truck sleeping at home then your off duty and the guy is a flake,, your correct he is wrong... :evil: :twisted: |
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Skywalker
Joined: 10 Oct 2005
Posts: 2628
Location: Pulling a Tanker for Superior Carriers!!
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| Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2008 4:34 pm Post subject: Re: logging no no? |
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mdgardner963 wrote: repete wrote: I now run the same route 5 nights a week and am home from about 0200-1500 hrs.
this is where the question comes in. I am logging this time on line 1 off duty. An other driver said thats wrong(I know I shouldn't listen but now worry about it) he said it should be logged on line 2 or I need a hotel reciept for DOT. I start logging and end at the same time and same location so it's evident that I must be home.
Its very simple if you are out of the truck sleeping at home then your off duty and the guy is a flake,, your correct he is wrong... :evil: :twisted:
Thats right. If you are not in the sleeper berth.....you are to log "off duty". Its as simple as that.
While its best to have a copy of a motel bill to substantiate a stay in a motel, its not 100% necessary. I stay in motels that the company has contracts with....I just sign in and sign out. I do not necessarily get a copy of the bill. If I show more than 10 consecutive hours off duty the point is "moot". I have met the requirements according to the "Fed". http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regulations/truck/driver/hos/brochure2005.htm
The answer to a possible rebuttal: In the event a DOT officer wants proof that I stayed in a motel....I would hit the auto-dial on my cell phone calling the terminal that pays that motels bill...and have them validate the log entry to the nice officer. Push come to shove...if the officer insists on seeing the motel bill...a call to the motel with the DOT's fax number would take care of that.
But, funny thing is....I have NEVER been asked for the motel bill...
Oh, if for some reason I stay in a motel due to "breakdown" away from a terminal....and I pay the bill and send it in for re-imbursement... I do keep a copy of the bill with me....as much to compare to my pay statement as anything else.
Trucker math: A method of computing numbers that arrives at the desired results with absolutely no correlation to reality" :mrgreen: :mrgreen: |
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Rev.Vassago
Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 5183
Location: Green Bay, WI
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| Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2008 4:51 pm Post subject: Re: logging no no? |
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Skywalker wrote: The answer to a possible rebuttal: In the event a DOT officer wants proof that I stayed in a motel....
Why would a DOT officer want proof that you stayed in a motel? There's no FMCSA regulation that says you have to. |
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Markk9
Joined: 13 Jul 2005
Posts: 38
Location: PA
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| Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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Pre-trip is only required once every 24 hours.
Mark |
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mdgardner963
Joined: 16 Jan 2008
Posts: 156
Location: California
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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Markk9 wrote: Pre-trip is only required once every 24 hours.
Mark
There you go again pre trip is in your day. 1 If you change trailers 2. at anytime you stop for more then 10 hours or any change of service.. :twisted: |
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kc0iv
Joined: 03 Feb 2005
Posts: 1084
Location: Kansas City, MO
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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mdgardner963 wrote: There you go again pre trip is in your day. 1 If you change trailers 2. at anytime you stop for more then 10 hours or any change of service.. :twisted:
Quote the regulation for your statement.
kc0iv |
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Rev.Vassago
Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 5183
Location: Green Bay, WI
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:19 pm Post subject: |
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kc0iv wrote: mdgardner963 wrote: There you go again pre trip is in your day. 1 If you change trailers 2. at anytime you stop for more then 10 hours or any change of service.. :twisted:
Quote the regulation for your statement.
kc0iv
Quote: §396.13 Driver inspection.
Before driving a motor vehicle, the driver shall:
(a) Be satisfied that the motor vehicle is in safe operating condition;
(b) Review the last driver vehicle inspection report; and
(c) Sign the report, only if defects or deficiencies were noted by the driver who prepared the report, to acknowledge that the driver has reviewed it and that there is a certification that the required repairs have been performed. The signature requirement does not apply to listed defects on a towed unit which is no longer part of the vehicle combination.
A trailer is part of the vehicle, and requires an inspection prior to operating it.
Quote: §396.11 Driver Vehicle Inspection Report(s)
Question 2: Does §396.11 require that the power unit and the trailer be inspected?
Guidance: Yes. A driver must be satisfied that both the power unit and the trailer are in safe operating condition before operating the combination.
Question 3: May more than one power unit be included on the DVIR if two or more power units were used by a driver during one day's work?
Guidance: No. A separate DVIR must be prepared for each power unit operated during the day's work.
§396.13 states that before operating the motor vehicle, the driver must inspect it to make sure it is in safe operating condition. §396.11 states that every unit must be inspected before operating the combination. |
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kc0iv
Joined: 03 Feb 2005
Posts: 1084
Location: Kansas City, MO
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| Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 4:16 am Post subject: |
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Rev.Vassago wrote: kc0iv wrote: mdgardner963 wrote: There you go again pre trip is in your day. 1 If you change trailers 2. at anytime you stop for more then 10 hours or any change of service.. :twisted:
Quote the regulation for your statement.
kc0iv
Quote: §396.13 Driver inspection.
Before driving a motor vehicle, the driver shall:
(a) Be satisfied that the motor vehicle is in safe operating condition;
(b) Review the last driver vehicle inspection report; and
(c) Sign the report, only if defects or deficiencies were noted by the driver who prepared the report, to acknowledge that the driver has reviewed it and that there is a certification that the required repairs have been performed. The signature requirement does not apply to listed defects on a towed unit which is no longer part of the vehicle combination.
A trailer is part of the vehicle, and requires an inspection prior to operating it.
Quote: §396.11 Driver Vehicle Inspection Report(s)
Question 2: Does §396.11 require that the power unit and the trailer be inspected?
Guidance: Yes. A driver must be satisfied that both the power unit and the trailer are in safe operating condition before operating the combination.
Question 3: May more than one power unit be included on the DVIR if two or more power units were used by a driver during one day's work?
Guidance: No. A separate DVIR must be prepared for each power unit operated during the day's work.
§396.13 states that before operating the motor vehicle, the driver must inspect it to make sure it is in safe operating condition. §396.11 states that every unit must be inspected before operating the combination.
Rev.Vassago,
Needless to say I know those rules. However, I want to see the part that says "2. at anytime you stop for more then 10 hours or any change of service.."
kc0iv |
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Rev.Vassago
Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 5183
Location: Green Bay, WI
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| Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 4:38 am Post subject: |
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kc0iv wrote: Rev.Vassago wrote: kc0iv wrote: mdgardner963 wrote: There you go again pre trip is in your day. 1 If you change trailers 2. at anytime you stop for more then 10 hours or any change of service.. :twisted:
Quote the regulation for your statement.
kc0iv
Quote: §396.13 Driver inspection.
Before driving a motor vehicle, the driver shall:
(a) Be satisfied that the motor vehicle is in safe operating condition;
(b) Review the last driver vehicle inspection report; and
(c) Sign the report, only if defects or deficiencies were noted by the driver who prepared the report, to acknowledge that the driver has reviewed it and that there is a certification that the required repairs have been performed. The signature requirement does not apply to listed defects on a towed unit which is no longer part of the vehicle combination.
A trailer is part of the vehicle, and requires an inspection prior to operating it.
Quote: §396.11 Driver Vehicle Inspection Report(s)
Question 2: Does §396.11 require that the power unit and the trailer be inspected?
Guidance: Yes. A driver must be satisfied that both the power unit and the trailer are in safe operating condition before operating the combination.
Question 3: May more than one power unit be included on the DVIR if two or more power units were used by a driver during one day's work?
Guidance: No. A separate DVIR must be prepared for each power unit operated during the day's work.
§396.13 states that before operating the motor vehicle, the driver must inspect it to make sure it is in safe operating condition. §396.11 states that every unit must be inspected before operating the combination.
Rev.Vassago,
Needless to say I know those rules. However, I want to see the part that says "2. at anytime you stop for more then 10 hours or any change of service.."
kc0iv
Any time you start driving the vehicle, including after a 10 hour break or any other change of duty status, you are required to inspect the vehicle. Technically, mdgardner is correct, as you need to inspect the vehicle after a 10 hour break or more. What he isn't taking into account is that you also need to inspect it after a break of less than 10 hours, or any other time you are going to drive the vehicle. |
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kc0iv
Joined: 03 Feb 2005
Posts: 1084
Location: Kansas City, MO
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| Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 9:10 am Post subject: |
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Rev.Vassago wrote:
Any time you start driving the vehicle, including after a 10 hour break or any other change of duty status, you are required to inspect the vehicle. Technically, mdgardner is correct, as you need to inspect the vehicle after a 10 hour break or more. What he isn't taking into account is that you also need to inspect it after a break of less than 10 hours, or any other time you are going to drive the vehicle.
OK -- Chapter and verse please.
kc0iv |
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Skywalker
Joined: 10 Oct 2005
Posts: 2628
Location: Pulling a Tanker for Superior Carriers!!
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| Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 9:34 am Post subject: Re: logging no no? |
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Rev.Vassago wrote: Skywalker wrote: The answer to a possible rebuttal: In the event a DOT officer wants proof that I stayed in a motel....
Why would a DOT officer want proof that you stayed in a motel? There's no FMCSA regulation that says you have to.
Thank you....my point exactly. But, as said...."in the event"....its not that hard to acquire. I can only see where it would become a worthwhile issue in a truly strange situation...... 8) |
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Fredog
Joined: 23 Apr 2005
Posts: 2131
Location: North Georgia
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| Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 9:37 am Post subject: Re: logging no no? |
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Skywalker wrote: Rev.Vassago wrote: Skywalker wrote: The answer to a possible rebuttal: In the event a DOT officer wants proof that I stayed in a motel....
Why would a DOT officer want proof that you stayed in a motel? There's no FMCSA regulation that says you have to.
Thank you....my point exactly. But, as said...."in the event"....its not that hard to acquire. I can only see where it would become a worthwhile issue in a truly strange situation...... 8)
like a hooker said you beat and robbed her at 10 pm on 3rd street, but your hotel receipt shows you checked in at 10 pm on 145th street, that might come in handy |
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Skywalker
Joined: 10 Oct 2005
Posts: 2628
Location: Pulling a Tanker for Superior Carriers!!
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| Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 9:39 am Post subject: |
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Rev.Vassago wrote:
Any time you start driving the vehicle, including after a 10 hour break or any other change of duty status, you are required to inspect the vehicle. Technically, mdgardner is correct, as you need to inspect the vehicle after a 10 hour break or more. What he isn't taking into account is that you also need to inspect it after a break of less than 10 hours, or any other time you are going to drive the vehicle.
I am in agreement with you on this, because in my slightly "distrustful and paranoid" view of the world.....I think that any driver who "fails" to give his or her rig a good once over before driving it again....if they have been out of sight of it for more than a minute or three....is making a serious mistake.
I think what the real issue is, is this: How many times in a 24 hour period are you required to show the event on your logbook? I know that changing trailers/tanks....or changing tractors require logging. Pretrips do, but a postrip can be flagged. Walkarounds I flag as "Saftey Checks" as they require less than 7 minutes. |
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Rev.Vassago
Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 5183
Location: Green Bay, WI
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| Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 10:05 am Post subject: |
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kc0iv wrote: Rev.Vassago wrote:
Any time you start driving the vehicle, including after a 10 hour break or any other change of duty status, you are required to inspect the vehicle. Technically, mdgardner is correct, as you need to inspect the vehicle after a 10 hour break or more. What he isn't taking into account is that you also need to inspect it after a break of less than 10 hours, or any other time you are going to drive the vehicle.
OK -- Chapter and verse please.
kc0iv
I already posted it. Twice. :roll:
Quote: §396.13 Driver inspection.
Before driving a motor vehicle, the driver shall:
Quote: §396.11 Driver Vehicle Inspection Report(s)
Question 2: Does §396.11 require that the power unit and the trailer be inspected?
Guidance: Yes. A driver must be satisfied that both the power unit and the trailer are in safe operating condition before operating the combination.
"Before operating the vehicle", and "Before operating the combination" means exactly what it says - you inspect before you operate. Doesn't matter if you were away from the vehicle 10 minutes, 10 hours, or 10 days. You inspect before you operate. |
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