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rickstephens
Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 82
Location: dundee fl
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| Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 6:19 pm Post subject: lines 3n4 |
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| ok had a guy tell me i was logging 3n4 wrong lets say i have 9hrs to work thats what fell off nite before k i drive for 7 and drop to line 4 for fuel ptrip whatever but say i used 2 hrs thats 9 hrs but i still drive 2 more hrs to get my 9 because im still within my 14 am i doing this right he says i havt to stop at 9 ..... line 3 n 4 together was 9 |
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Malaki86
Joined: 28 Aug 2004
Posts: 1976
Location: West Virginia
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| Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 6:39 pm Post subject: Re: lines 3n4 |
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rickstephens wrote: ok had a guy tell me i was logging 3n4 wrong lets say i have 9hrs to work thats what fell off nite before k i drive for 7 and drop to line 4 for fuel ptrip whatever but say i used 2 hrs thats 9 hrs but i still drive 2 more hrs to get my 9 because im still within my 14 am i doing this right he says i havt to stop at 9 ..... line 3 n 4 together was 9
:? Huh? :? |
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tdriver1959
Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 260
Location: Washington
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| Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 6:40 pm Post subject: |
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why did you have only 9 hrs to work when you started????
were you up to your 70 hrs when you added in the 9hrs????? |
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rickstephens
Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 82
Location: dundee fl
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| Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:14 pm Post subject: |
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| just using as a ex on a resart no peoblem just saying had that one day last week had 9 drop off after midnite next am had 9 to work used 7 to drive 2 on bottom drove another 2 to get 9 hr driving whick gave me 9 line 3 and 2 on 4 for 11 total he said i was over my time to work by 2 hrs i said nope i can dr 9 hrs just dont go over the 14 was i right |
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mike3fan
Joined: 04 Aug 2006
Posts: 1655
Location: michigan
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| Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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all I can say is wow.
To anwser you're question you only have 9 hours to "drive",this INCLUDES the total from lines 3 and 4,yes you were over by 2 hours.
Your 70 hours is the total of lines 3 and 4,you could've driven 9 hours and then worked after you reached 70,but you cannot drive after 70 hrs on duty(total 3&4)
The other driver was correct. |
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tdriver1959
Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 260
Location: Washington
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| Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:24 pm Post subject: |
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| remember if you have 34 hours off then you reset the 70 hour clock and gain your full driving and work time back |
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Rev.Vassago
Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 5197
Location: Green Bay, WI
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| Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:26 pm Post subject: |
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mike3fan wrote: all I can say is wow.
To anwser you're question you only have 9 hours to "drive",this INCLUDES the total from lines 3 and 4,yes you were over by 2 hours.
Your 70 hours is the total of lines 3 and 4,you could've driven 9 hours and then worked after you reached 70,but you cannot drive after 70 hrs on duty(total 3&4)
The other driver was correct.
+1 |
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rickstephens
Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 82
Location: dundee fl
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| Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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| ok maybe im not good at putting things in type guess my ? is if iv been driving a few weeks have not dn a restart yet and i have hrs like 9 fall off one day i can only work thats drive and do line 4 for a total of 9 hrs i thought that if i had 9 hrs i could dr those 9 plus do a 15 min pti maybe a drop and hook did not know it all had to be within that 9 anyway if anyone would care to call me that would be great maybe i can ex better that way just want to be legal im here at ta in cartersvill ga 863-242=9457 thanks for all your help everyone dont want to sound stupid just brain dead i guess thank u rick |
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tdriver1959
Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 260
Location: Washington
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| Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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if you have 9 hours left to your 70 hours you can work and drive up to the 70 but once you have reached the 70th hour you can only work on line 4. You can not drive past the the 70th hour.
BOL |
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mike3fan
Joined: 04 Aug 2006
Posts: 1655
Location: michigan
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| Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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tdriver1959 wrote: if you have 9 hours left to your 70 hours you can work and drive up to the 70 but once you have reached the 70th hour you can only work on line 4. You can not drive past the the 70th hour.
BOL
Thank you that explaination is much easier to understand than mine |
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golfhobo
Joined: 16 Oct 2005
Posts: 3869
Location: the 19th hole / NC
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 6:35 am Post subject: |
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| Oh Boy!!! Another thread to "muck up!" :lol: :lol: :lol: |
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tdriver1959
Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 260
Location: Washington
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 9:20 am Post subject: |
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| lets hope not golfhobo :) |
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golfhobo
Joined: 16 Oct 2005
Posts: 3869
Location: the 19th hole / NC
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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tdriver1959 wrote: lets hope not golfhobo :)
Sorry, Tdriver! I gotta get into this.
1) I understood Rickstephens perfectly, regardless of his composition.
2) I understood both Mike3fan and Tdriver perfectly, and found both answers easy to follow.
3) I have to side with Mike3fan, and not Tdriver on this one. Because, Tdriver says you can continue to work on line 4, and Mike says no. Although, Im not sure about Mike's answer, either.)
4) Don't forget that RICK wants to drive some, then work docks some, then finish his driving.
5) MIke says you could have driven for 9 straight, THEN worked on line 4. This sounds plausible, since the regs allow you to work even PAST 14 on line 4 only.
6) Tdriver seems to agree, and says you can continue to work on line 4.
7) Either way, once your total of line 3 and 4 equals 70.... you can't drive.
Now HERE is where it gets "mucky."
the REGS say that if you violate your 70 rule, you only have to take 10 or 34 off to come into compliance.
But on the inside flap of a J.J. Kellar logbook it says this:
"If ANY number in column C (total hours for the 8 days) exceeds 70, NO DRIVING SHOULD HAVE BEEN DONE. ANY Driving that was done is a violation and should .... be reported."
I'm not SURE exactly how to interpret this (at this time.) I'm sure the Rev will be here to "instruct" me. :lol:
But, If Kellar knows what he is talking about, the mere "overance" in column C (total hours on your 70) means that you couldn't drive an INCH! And SHOULDN"T have driven that day.
This would indicate the regulations STRONG belief that you should not exceed 70 hours of "working" in 8 days, and that if you DID, even 1 hour of driving on that day would be a VIOLATION.
I believe this indicates that your "trainer" was right. Once you violated the 70 hour rule for TOTAL HOURS WORKED, you couldn't drive those additional 2 hours. Furthermore, IF you went past 70 hours TOTAL, even the 7 hours you drove.... were in violation.
I believe this means, that if you are that close to your 70, you shouldn't exceed that limit IN TOTAL on that day, or ANY driving time will get you a violation. (That is IF Kellar is right.)
The regs ONLY seem to dictate what is necessary to bring you into compliance. They don't specifically answer your question.
I make no claim that my answer is correct. I'll have to study it further. But, what I read in the Kellar logbook makes me question all other answers here. (including my own.)
It is JUST as possible that Kellar misunderstands the regs as it is that the REV does! :lol: OR.... that (heaven forbid....) "I" do!
Either way.... I don't suppose my input has helped much, except to "muck up" the thread! :lol:
I just couldn't help mucking it up, when there was evidence to suggest that the answers were wrong, or misleading. 8)
Personally, if I were down to a mere 9 hours to gain back on my 70.... I wouldn't exceed that total for lines 3 n 4!!
As someone else has said.... DOT WILL question it! :lol: (and who knows if THEY will know the correct answer??) |
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Rev.Vassago
Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 5197
Location: Green Bay, WI
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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| I just log it all on line 5. |
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mike3fan
Joined: 04 Aug 2006
Posts: 1655
Location: michigan
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| Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2007 4:17 pm Post subject: |
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How could you justify a violation for driving over the 70 hr rule,when the driving you did was under the 70 hr rule?
I think you are reading the regs too literally....... |
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