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chicago1010 · Joined: 25 Nov 2006 Posts: 16

My log is up to date and I'm within my hours up to today. I drove 10.5 hours and spent 2.5 hours on duty, not driving. I am now unloaded. I live 55 miles from this drop. My carrier says that I can drive the CMV home as I have 22 hours befor my next P/U. How do I log this as I can't drive 55 miles in an 1/2 hour?

Malaki86 · Joined: 28 Aug 2004 Posts: 2127 Location: West Virginia

Quote: My log is up to date and I'm within my hours up to today. I drove 10.5 hours and spent 2.5 hours on duty, not driving. I am now unloaded. I live 55 miles from this drop. My carrier says that I can drive the CMV home as I have 22 hours befor my next P/U. How do I log this as I can't drive 55 miles in an 1/2 hour?

Simple, you can't...

Find someplace really close to sit for the next 20 hrs, then go back on duty and pick up the load. If they tell you that you can legally do it, find a new company to drive for.

Even though you're close to home, you can't pull a trailer and log it as off duty (using it as personal vehicle). And, if you've got a load planned, technically you're already dispatched, which puts you under the load.

ben45750 · Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 1759

Malaki86 wrote: Quote: My log is up to date and I'm within my hours up to today. I drove 10.5 hours and spent 2.5 hours on duty, not driving. I am now unloaded. I live 55 miles from this drop. My carrier says that I can drive the CMV home as I have 22 hours befor my next P/U. How do I log this as I can't drive 55 miles in an 1/2 hour?

Simple, you can't...

I would call someone and have them come get me. But, if I did attempt it I would rather be fined for speeding on my logs than being out of hours.

Uturn2001 · Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 7:11 pm Post subject:

If you are bobtailed then you could go home and log the trip as off duty. In essence what you are doing is saying that you are using the tractor as your personal conveyence from work to home. The same can be done in a straight truck if you are empty since the cargo portion of the unit can not be readily detached.

Going back you would have to log it as driving, since you would be doing work under the direction of the company.

kc0iv · Joined: 03 Feb 2005 Posts: 1113 Location: Kansas City, MO

Malaki86 wrote:
Even though you're close to home, you can't pull a trailer and log it as off duty (using it as personal vehicle). And, if you've got a load planned, technically you're already dispatched, which puts you under the load.

I've heard this before "you can't pull a trailer and log it as off duty (using it as personal vehicle)" Yet I have never found this in the rules. I'd be interested where you got the information.

kc0iv

Uturn2001 · Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 7:42 pm Post subject:

kc0iv wrote: Malaki86 wrote:
Even though you're close to home, you can't pull a trailer and log it as off duty (using it as personal vehicle). And, if you've got a load planned, technically you're already dispatched, which puts you under the load.

I've heard this before "you can't pull a trailer and log it as off duty (using it as personal vehicle)" Yet I have never found this in the rules. I'd be interested where you got the information.

kc0iv

It is a culmination of several different regs, definitions, and official interpretations. Some saying you can do this and others saying that you can not do that.

Uturn2001 · Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 7:46 pm Post subject:

Driving a CMV and logging it as a personal conveyence is a tricky area to deal with. Many drivers, understandably so, will not do this ever. In addition some companies have rules prohibiting thier drivers from ever logging this way.

kc0iv · Joined: 03 Feb 2005 Posts: 1113 Location: Kansas City, MO

I don't remember the details but I do recall a driver was cited for driving over 200 miles and he had logged it as OFF-DUTY. When it went to court the judge found in the drivers favour. He said he found no law that covered such a case.

I do recall the driver had his own authority and he was returning home.

It seems I read this article a couple of years ago in Landline but I may be wrong.

To: Uturn2001

I know it is a gray area and most companies do put restrictions on this type of logging. I also sure most DOT officers would fuss.

It is no big deal one way or the other. I mainly hadn't found anything in the rules that address it.

kc0iv

Uturn2001 · Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 10:50 pm Post subject:

On 3 separate occasions, in 3 different states, I have talked to senior "DOT" officials about this subject. What I was told about the trailer issue is that if a driver is pulling a trailer, even though it is empty, that in their view it is more likely that the driver may in fact be deadheading to his next pickup even though his home may be in route.

Personally I have never logged Off Duty when bobtailing unless it was a short distance (like within 20 miles).

Anyway, I fully expect that before long this excemption will be outlawed all together. It will probably happen when EOBR's become a reality.

Rev.Vassago · Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 10:54 pm Post subject:

kc0iv wrote: It is no big deal one way or the other. I mainly hadn't found anything in the rules that address it.

kc0iv

Quote: Question 26: If a driver is permitted to use a CMV for personal reasons, how must the driving time be recorded?

Guidance: When a driver is relieved from work and all responsibility for performing work, time spent traveling from a driver's home to his/her terminal (normal work reporting location), or from a driver's terminal to his/her home, may be considered off-duty time. Similarly, time spent traveling short distances from a driver's en route lodgings (such as en route terminals or motels) to restaurants in the vicinity of such lodgings may be considered off-duty time. The type of conveyance used from the terminal to the driver's home, from the driver's home to the terminal, or to restaurants in the vicinity of en route lodgings would not alter the situation unless the vehicle is laden. A driver may not operate a laden CMV as a personal conveyance. The driver who uses a motor carrier's CMV for transportation home, and is subsequently called by the employing carrier and is then dispatched from home, would be on-duty from the time the driver leaves home.

A driver placed out of service for exceeding the requirements of the hours of service regulations may not drive a CMV to any location to obtain rest.

Dawn · Joined: 31 Oct 2006 Posts: 323 Location: Indianapolis, In

kc0iv wrote: Malaki86 wrote:
Even though you're close to home, you can't pull a trailer and log it as off duty (using it as personal vehicle). And, if you've got a load planned, technically you're already dispatched, which puts you under the load.

I've heard this before "you can't pull a trailer and log it as off duty (using it as personal vehicle)" Yet I have never found this in the rules. I'd be interested where you got the information.

kc0iv

Question 26: If a driver is permitted to use a CMV for personal reasons, how must the driving time be recorded?

Guidance: When a driver is relieved from work and all responsibility for performing work, time spent traveling from a driver's home to his/her terminal (normal work reporting location), or from a driver's terminal to his/her home, may be considered off-duty time. Similarly, time spent traveling short distances from a driver's en route lodgings (such as en route terminals or motels) to restaurants in the vicinity of such lodgings may be considered off-duty time. The type of conveyance used from the terminal to the driver's home, from the driver's home to the terminal, or to restaurants in the vicinity of en route lodgings would not alter the situation unless the vehicle is laden. A driver may not operate a laden CMV as a personal conveyance. The driver who uses a motor carrier's CMV for transportation home, and is subsequently called by the employing carrier and is then dispatched from home, would be on-duty from the time the driver leaves home.

I agree with you, although I remember seeing something in the book about not having a trailer with you, but at the moment I can not find it!
I do agree with the person who posted above me, it is a fine line, to me I would not trust this "personal use" unless you are only bob tailing to wal-mart to get your supplies while on your time off (wherever you may be) or to do laundry ect.... I do not like the USA regs because they do not specify the amount of miles/time you are allowed to use the vehicle for personal use as the Canadian regs do. I am going to send a request for DOT to answer this question a little more specific. But I would not push it more than running to wal-mart, laundry etc, don't driver from West Memphis, AR to Florida. If you are in an accident this could cause you major issue's or even stopped by DOT could cost you some big bucks Have a great nite, if I find the other part about not having a trailer I will let you know, It will be tomorrow probably :D

Rev.Vassago · Posted: Sun Nov 26, 2006 11:11 am Post subject:

Is there an echo in here? :roll:

Double R · Joined: 11 Sep 2005 Posts: 969 Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Rev.Vassago wrote: Is there an echo in here? :roll:

Echo, echo, Beep, beep

kc0iv · Joined: 03 Feb 2005 Posts: 1113 Location: Kansas City, MO

To Uturn2001 and the REV

DOT reference to question 26.

I have read this guidance. However, it really does not address the question completely. The thing it says as a postive is "A driver may not operate a laden CMV as a personal conveyance.[/color=green] and "[/color]A driver placed out of service for exceeding the requirements of the hours of service regulations may not drive a CMV to any location to obtain rest.". Such things as How many miles? Can they pull a empty trailer? These are the gray areas I have yet been able to find an answer for.

kc0iv

chicago1010 · Joined: 25 Nov 2006 Posts: 16

OK, I got some real good replies; however, I don't believe I got a right answer as of yet.
Malaki86 said that because I had been dispathched I wasconsidered under load. This could be true, but I could not find it in the Regs. Malaki86, could you give us the Reg on this?
The Rev and Dawn gave pretty much the same answer. If malaki86's is wrong, they could be right, but they could be wrong too. In my post I stated I was "unloaded" I never said I was "empty" I could still have cargo onboard which would change the answer, right? In that case I believe that I would not be able to drive home under "off duty" So, lets assume I'm emptY. If Malaki86 is correct, then I would need a 10 hour break before I could drive home, Correct?
Lets now say he's wrong. According to what the Rev and Dawn stated I believe that I could drive home under the personal use rule, but it's still a grey area in alot of your minds.
So, considering that, I think Dawn made a good suggestion
in that she stated she would call DOT and ask for a more specific answer to my question.
I think if I asked this question to 5 different LEO's I would get 5 differant interpertations; would you all agree?

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