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One · Joined: 13 Mar 2005 Posts: 953 Location: Alabama

How about instaead of ranting, blaming and raving, how about putting our heads together and having a smrt discussion on how to break our dependence on oil? No?....figures

yoopr · Joined: 01 Dec 2004 Posts: 12865

They seem to be the party of nothingness. They stand for nothing while opposing everything.

Bravo GMAN(That is until I go down to the Next thread on Fuel Costs) :P

One · Joined: 13 Mar 2005 Posts: 953 Location: Alabama

How about insteaad of ranting, blaming and raving, how about putting our heads together and having a smart discussion on how to break our dependence on oil? No?....figures

Useless · Joined: 08 Oct 2005 Posts: 3177 Location: Canyon Lake, Tx.

[quote="One"]

How about instaead of ranting, blaming and raving, how about putting our heads together and having a smrt discussion on how to break our dependence on oil? No?....figures[/quote]

I already suggested developing alternative fuel sources; that seemed to go over like a smelly fart in a crowded church !! :P

One · Joined: 13 Mar 2005 Posts: 953 Location: Alabama

YUP, its the american way, blame everyone else for your problems, throw some bombs at 'em and never do anything to actually help your situation in the long run...A lot of bitching and moaning and not doing anything about it... Blame yourself for your own screwups!

GMAN · Joined: 13 Feb 2005 Posts: 9908 Location: Tennessee

[quote="One"]How about instead of ranting, blaming and raving, how about putting our heads together and having a smart discussion on how to break our dependence on oil? No?....figures[/quote]

Well, lets discuss things that could be done. If I previously mentioned this just consider this a senior moment but may move things in a more positive direction.

A few months ago I stopped at a Love's in Midlothian, TX. I have been wanting to talk to some drivers who have been running bio-diesel. I got to talking to this driver who told me that his company has a small fleet and are refining their own fuel. According to him, it wasn't that difficult or expensive to do. A couple of years ago I read about a guy in Atlanta who had some trucks. No, they weren't class 8 but were 1/2 ton trucks with utility beds. I don't recall the business he was in or number of trucks. He is apparently refining his own fuel for his trucks in his kitchen.

Now, if these people can do this in a cost effective manner, why can't others. Imagine if some of the major trucking companies would start refining their own fuel. They might save millions. :shock: If they could just cut their fuel costs by $1/gallon they would greatly improve their bottom line and help the environment at the same time. If fuel could be refined more locally, it would not be necessary to have a huge distribution network or pipeline established. Distribution costs would be virtually eliminated. :wink: If these refineries could use corn and other renewable sources we would no longer need to worry about foreign oil supplies. If we could use some of the things we normally throw into landfills, that would solve another problem.

I read the other day that there were approximately 5MM trucks across the nation. If we could only supply 10% of these with an alternate fuel source that would save approximately 5MM gallons of fuel a day. (5MM x 10% = 500M trucks.) 500,000 trucks x 100 gallons per day = 50,000,000 gallons of fuel. At $3/gallon that is $150MM (That's million) If you could save $1/gallon on 50MM gallons of diesel you would save $50 million per day.

I could like that.......A LOT!!! :D

rjt030 · Posted: Sun Apr 30, 2006 11:25 pm Post subject:

Land+Seed+Good Growing Conditions+Fertilizer+herbicide+pesticide= Corn

large amount of energy must be spent in the process of getting seeds turned into more seeds. Then more energy must be spent getting these seeds to a facility that can turn them into biodiesel

I would like to know if biodiesel is really as efficient as diesel

One · Joined: 13 Mar 2005 Posts: 953 Location: Alabama

Biodiesel has been used in Europe successfully for a lot of years. The research has been done long ago. Biodiesel can be made out of all kinds of stuff...Think of it like 'Back to the future III' where they throw a beercan and banana-peel into a 'Mr.Fusion' :lol:
At a trucking show, I saw a Biodiesel refinery!! A functional refinery that fits into my little office- maybe 12 ft. tall and 6 ft. wide.

Why the US is the only Industrialized nation that resists alternate fuels is suspect...But things can be done. It wont be cheap, but if we spent what we spend to kidnapp suspected terrorists in Europe, we could surely build a small Bio-refinery.

GMAN · Joined: 13 Feb 2005 Posts: 9908 Location: Tennessee

[quote="rjt030"]Land+Seed+Good Growing Conditions+Fertilizer+herbicide+pesticide= Corn

large amount of energy must be spent in the process of getting seeds turned into more seeds. Then more energy must be spent getting these seeds to a facility that can turn them into biodiesel

I would like to know if biodiesel is really as efficient as diesel[/quote]

From what I understand in reading and talking to some who have used biodiesel is that it burns much more efficiently and cleaner than regular diesel. I have been cautioned a couple of times to keep a couple of extra fuel filters, because biodiesel will clean everything out of your tanks and fuel lines. I have also be told that fuel mileage is somewhat better running biodiesel. I would like to try it myself. I prefer first hand knowledge concerning this type of thing. Even if mileage is the same as we now get, it would be better to use because of the reduction in use of standard fossil fuels. The only negative I have read or heard is the fuel filter thing. :D

ben45750 · Joined: 23 Apr 2005 Posts: 1759

I had read an article about that, the amount of energy it takes to make bio-diesel. To grow and plant the seeds, harvest the product, create more seeds, then refine the product to make bio-diesel.

The article said it takes more energy to make bio-diesel than what energy can be created from the bio-diesel its self. If that is the case and demand is high on bio-diesel would'nt we see the prices just as high as standard diesel? And then what affect will that have on the price of gasoline?

Useless · Joined: 08 Oct 2005 Posts: 3177 Location: Canyon Lake, Tx.

[quote="rjt030"]Land+Seed+Good Growing Conditions+Fertilizer+herbicide+pesticide= Corn

large amount of energy must be spent in the process of getting seeds turned into more seeds. Then more energy must be spent getting these seeds to a facility that can turn them into biodiesel

And I suppose that no energy, or very little energy is required to drill for oil, transport it to a refinery, and then refine it??

I would like to know if biodiesel is really as efficient as diesel[/quote]

rjt030 · Posted: Mon May 01, 2006 9:25 am Post subject:

I agree that it does take alot of energy to produce, transport and refine oil. Anything we do takes energy.

I just wanted to see if anyone could tell me yes or no whether biodiesel was more efficient than diesel

One · Joined: 13 Mar 2005 Posts: 953 Location: Alabama

Search the internet for biodiesel! I found lots of sites just in the US that list Pros and Cons and even supply manuals on how to make it at home!!!
Biodiesel can be make from a variety of stuff that may otherwise go to a landfill...
The question is: If we need lots of acrage of farmland to grow plants that yield a good amount of vegetable oil, will that be a good thing or not? I know I would rather be a farmer than a truck driver and im sure a lot of other people including farmers that have given up their farms will be very happy to start growing such a crop!!! it will give us jobs that wont go overseas, reduce the trade deficit by reducing the amount of oil imported from overseas and remove some of the funding to shady countries! it will lower the demand for oil, lowering the price!!
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel.html
http://www.biodieselnow.com/
If you take the 5 mins to look at just those 2 sites, you will realize how many problems this will solve!!!!

MrVain · Joined: 06 Feb 2006 Posts: 146 Location: So Cal

[quote="KRWOOD"]I would personally like to thank all of the people who voted for George Bush. Thank you for the high gas prices! Hopefully they double again before he leaves office. When gas finally reachs $8 to $10 a gal maybe then the american public will wake up and have an intervention for our addiction to foreign oil.

Theres many reasons why the price of oil is rising. There are two ways to begin to solve the problem.

1. An Apollo type project spearheaded by government leadership. It's a funny thought with this administration but might be possible in 2008.

2. Gas prices of $10 a gal within the next two years. Public leverage on private business and political leadership will spawn investment in alternatives.

Again...thank you George Bush and your oil cabinet! Were 1/3 of way to our goal! Keep up the great work in the New American Century![/quote]

You are a blithering idiot!

Useless · Joined: 08 Oct 2005 Posts: 3177 Location: Canyon Lake, Tx.

[quote="rjt030"]

I agree that it does take alot of energy to produce, transport and refine oil. Anything we do takes energy.

I just wanted to see if anyone could tell me yes or no whether biodiesel was more efficient than diesel[/quote]

Efficiency is an issue, but only to a certain extent. If alternative fuels are cleaner to produce and they burn cleaner, and there is a relatively stable and plentiful supply of corn or hemp needed to produce them, and if the supply is not controlled by Cartels that are hostile to American interests, then efficiency becomes a secondary issue.

Bear in mind that oil is now above $70.00 per barrel and the price per barrel will most likely continue to rise; we have an upcoming hurricane season that meteorologists and scientists are predicting could rival last year's season in terms of numbers and severity. The troubles in the Middle East are continuing to compound and intensify, and our economy hinges upon the circumstances and events that prevail in a part of the world that has never known a days worth of peace.

Irrespective of your political views, be you conservative, moderate, or liberal, or a card carrying member of the Republican, Libertarian, Democratic, or Green Party, or a member of the Reformed Left Handed Dyslexic Druid Movementarian Party(BTW, that is MY Party of Choice!! 8) ), the problems and events that unfold over in The Middle East have a tremendous impact upon the stability of our economy. The ability of ANY U.S. President, Republican or Democrat, to control our economy is in reality, rather limited. That is not to suggest that a President's economic policy can not have an effect upon our economy as a whole; clearly, it can, but the external events that affect our economic stability are frequently out of the hands of any President..

But NO President of ANY political party can keep the problems in the Middle East from escalating, nor can any President keep a hurricane from striking, nor can any President keep China's demands for fossil fuels from growing exponentially.

As difficult as it may be for many people to understand, the price of energy is not nearly as big of a problem for our economy as is the lack of stability in pricing. In economic terms, whatever the price of oil reaches, our economy has the ability to adjust to it as long as prices remain stable. If this premise was not valid, then the housing market would have collapsed a decade ago!! It is the unstable nature of the politics and economics of fossil fuel availability, sources, and prices that are hurting us more than anything else, and America is woefully behind the curve when it comes to developing alternative fuel sources.

This is where battles are needlessly being waged in the political realm. The objectives of economic concerns, stability of supplies, the breaking up of the control that The Oil Cartels have over oil prices, the effects of the political instability of The Middle East, China's ever increasing energy demands, and protection of our environment, as well as water quality and air quality issues can all be successfully addressed through the development of alternative fuels and energy sources. The objectives of both political parties (excluding selfish economic interests) can be met without being at odds or in conflict with one another. In the end, The American People would be the ultimate winners!!

Just My Thoughts,
Useless

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