I.S.X. OR CAT ?

[allan5oh]

I had a 2000 ISX and for the first two years (starting with the first trip) it was in a Cummins shop every week for one thing or another.Lost a small fortune in down time every week.Oh yea 2 inframes and a crate motor they would only back up for a year no more.A friend of mine has an EGR version and his is no better,I would not recomend this motor to anyone.
My '05 Cat. has had the head crack at 161,000 and I was down for a couple days out of almost two years I would say I am way ahead of the Cum'apart.

What went wrong with the engine? Who rebuilt it?

[solo379]

You guys are confusing "reflashing" with "reading codes".

No, we are not! By "reflashing" we mean the updating the engine ECM, exactly as Bobh explained.
I do the "codes reading" too, regulary, but, it's a different story! :P

[bob h]

I had a 2000 ISX and for the first two years (starting with the first trip) it was in a Cummins shop every week for one thing or another.Lost a small fortune in down time every week.Oh yea 2 inframes and a crate motor they would only back up for a year no more.A friend of mine has an EGR version and his is no better,I would not recomend this motor to anyone.
My '05 Cat. has had the head crack at 161,000 and I was down for a couple days out of almost two years I would say I am way ahead of the Cum'apart.

Engine manufacturers do not give away powerplants for no reason; what failed that required 2 inframes... and then a short block?

Go into any truck/engine store and you will find engines apart in the shop. You getting a lemon is just luck of the draw... oh yeah, be aware that there are such thing as lemon laws in many states.

[bob h]

You guys are confusing "reflashing" with "reading codes". The two are totally different.

CAT had to go in and redo some fuel maps, due to not complying with NOX standards.

I'm not confusing anything.

Flashing an ecm involves uploading a factory pre-built software package to the ecm... it's used to correct many different issues with a previously installed program version; it may be performance related, emissions related, etc..

Pulling codes is a totally different process that is usually done to diagnose a driveability complaint, or because the engine warning lamp is on.

[Zandalli Moon]

If I'm not mistaken, OTR trucks are probably victims of the same thing as most agricultural engines. The more fuel/emmissions effecient that you make them the poorer the fuel mileage/gph and it just adds a whole slew of things to complicate the intention for the engine.....burn fuel...makem' big power!!

[bob h]

If I'm not mistaken, OTR trucks are probably victims of the same thing as most agricultural engines. The more fuel/emmissions effecient that you make them the poorer the fuel mileage/gph and it just adds a whole slew of things to complicate the intention for the engine.....burn fuel...makem' big power!!

Agricultural engines are about a decade behind OTR truck emissions...

They're just settling in to electronic fuel control... OTR diesels started into electronic fuel control in 1985.

Ag equipment implemented electronic transmissions before their fuel system had electronic controls.

[Justruckin]

I am on my 2nd ISX, and I really like this motor. It is an 06 530hp. It out pulls my friends Detroit's and my other buddies CAT, and we all have 13 speed manual trannies. We have done our unscientific tests on a few hills while running together with the same loads at different times.

But the best thing about the ISX, is the 6 stage Jake Brake. Man, it is incredible. Put here in sixth gear, on a 6% grade with gross weight of 79,900 lbs, and you will never touch the brakes the whole way done the hill. I did this on I-24 the other day just south of Nashville. I forget the name of the hill, but most of you know where I am talking. You pull off and stop at the Truck Inspection site and wait your turn for the light. Sailed right down to the bottom, never hit the brakes once. And the RPM's never went over 1500. Just incredible.

I had the same experience on the other 6% grades in the Carolinas, NM, NV, WY, CA, etc...

Now, I like the CAT's, but my buddy, who owns a small fleet, just sold off the last of his 03 KW's and Pete's with the CAT's. He had nothing but problems with the 5 that he owned. These were 475's and 550's hooked to 13 speeds. Three were rebuilt by CAT at no charge. These trucks were all well under 500,000 miles.

And my other buddy, has an 03 Pete with the 550 CAT, again, nothing but trouble.

I don't know what CAT is doing, but I have been hearing allot of stories like this.

And let me say this, I don't care what is under my hood, as long as it gets the job done. I just know, first hand that the CAT's are having problems. But this Cummins is sure growing on me in this 07 Volvo 780.

[COLT]

Nothing but problems w/ C15s ? maybe it's not what CAT is doing, maybe it's what your buddy is not doing? .02

[Justruckin]

Nothing but problems w/ C15s ? maybe it's not what CAT is doing, maybe it's what your buddy is not doing? .02

No, I don't think so. I used to work for him as a company driver, and his daughter still dispatches me. And he is just as strict now as he was then regarding maint.

But, you never know.

[mudawg]

I will give the ISX did get pretty good fuel milage and the engine brake is second to none but,all that does not matter if it won't stay together.Mine started out with little gremlins at first {computer glitches etc...} then went into major hard parts breaking,heads,crank,water pumps etc...All my repairs were done by Cummins themselves and what really got me up tight with them was almost every time I had a part fail I was told that there was an update for that particular item because there had been some issue with it.With Cat if there is some kind of design flaw they send me a notice in the mail about it and I bring them the truck when I'm not under a load trying to make a living and they fix it on thier time not mine.
There got to be a group of us that had these red toilets that would get together very often at the local Cumapart shop and we would all suffer the same part breaking at the same time because of a design flaw and if we were lucky we would see one there that was a few weeks older than ours getting the next problem we were going to have getting fixed.You see Cummins has never heard of the United States Post Office and how it works so they will not make you aware of issues to look out for that will leave you stuck on the side of the road.
The cost I had in down time was a lot more than the loss in fuel milage I have now.I now feel when I turn the key my truck will get the job done without being towed to a shop for repairs,that's a feeling I lost on my first trip with my Cummins Feb.10th 2000 Farminton,Me. 3 feet of snow freezing temp.and a motor that wouldn't run in a 2 day old truck but,they had an updated electric fuel pump to fix the problem I was told.Never again

[Birken Vogt]

I have heard similar issues on both sides. Cat of course likes to drink the fuel and they both break electronically and with hard parts. Very frustrating but from my perspective the "best motor" still falls to Cummins. I know it sounds terrible but my opinion is, when you buy a new motor you have to expect that it will spend several weeks in the shop in its first 6 months and plan your business accordingly.

Birken

[bob h]

I have heard similar issues on both sides. Cat of course likes to drink the fuel and they both break electronically and with hard parts. Very frustrating but from my perspective the "best motor" still falls to Cummins. I know it sounds terrible but my opinion is, when you buy a new motor you have to expect that it will spend several weeks in the shop in its first 6 months and plan your business accordingly.

Birken

... several WEEKS in the first 6 months?!? your expectations aren't too high ;0)

""motors"" are electric ........ internal combustion powerplants are ENGINES, or so the old boy down in the engine bay has told me....

[Birken Vogt]

... several WEEKS in the first 6 months?!? your expectations aren't too high ;0)

No they are not. And most of those were around 01 or 02 Cummins, right now I have an 05 Cat that is getting rebuilt though. (Under warranty)

""motors"" are electric ........ internal combustion powerplants are ENGINES, or so the old boy down in the engine bay has told me....

Yeah yeah

I am a mechanic too...I feel entitled to call them what I call them

A motor is something that imparts motion...hence a MOTor...it can be electric, fuel burning, or otherwise...think of a rocket motor or a motorboat.

An engine is something that is a complicated piece of machinery that does some sort of work. Think of a fire engine, a search engine, Engine No. 9 that pulls a train.

A diesel engine is a complicated machine that costs lots of money to keep running. A diesel motor is a thing that imparts a twisting motion to a transmission to move a truck down the road. Both are equally correct

Birken

[bob h]

... several WEEKS in the first 6 months?!? your expectations aren't too high ;0)

No they are not. And most of those were around 01 or 02 Cummins, right now I have an 05 Cat that is getting rebuilt though. (Under warranty)

""motors"" are electric ........ internal combustion powerplants are ENGINES, or so the old boy down in the engine bay has told me....

Yeah yeah

I am a mechanic too...I feel entitled to call them what I call them

A motor is something that imparts motion...hence a MOTor...it can be electric, fuel burning, or otherwise...think of a rocket motor or a motorboat.

An engine is something that is a complicated piece of machinery that does some sort of work. Think of a fire engine, a search engine, Engine No. 9 that pulls a train.

A diesel engine is a complicated machine that costs lots of money to keep running. A diesel motor is a thing that imparts a twisting motion to a transmission to move a truck down the road. Both are equally correct

Birken

Motor is too broad a term for me... engine is more specific.

Cummins motors, Caterpillar motors........ doesn't ring too well does it? Sorry, but I gotta side with the old boy down in the engine bay, he's never steered me wrong yet!!!


the wik doesn't even list internal combustions under a motor search... they do however state that "it may also refer to..."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor


JMHO

[Birken Vogt]

Or we could simply call them a "prime mover"

Birken

[heavyhaulerss]

the long steep grade refered to earler just south of nashville on i-24 is called monteagle

[BanditsCousin]

I have an ISX in mine that was recalled for the reprogramming. My dad reported no change in fuel consumption or performance.

My buddy had his Cat w/ 120K let go a few months ago, so I agree about getting a lemon, and the luck of the draw

[Ironturkey]

I run an 03' ISX 470, and since I've been in it I've put more than 300,000 miles on it in 2 1/2 yrs and had no problems it has 650,000 on it now and I'm gettin 6.25 and 6.5 mpg per trip.

[ToxicWaste]

Cat of course likes to drink the fuel

Everyone says cats drink fuel...ever notice what type of trucks have cats in them...most long nose conventions 379s and W9s. Of course fuel econ is not going to be the best and that has to do with aerodynamics not the engine. Freightliner, volvo and most internationals dont use cat engines. My 9400 has a C15 435 and I'm getting close to 7 mpg.

[scythe08]

My carrier has a bunch of the 07 Cat engines and we can't keep the damn things running! We have already had several that are on rebuild status and nearly all of them are blowing the oil plugs off the engines, the most recent one being a month old kw with only 7000 miles on it.

one of the few Kw's out of my terminal has 90,000 on it, has been rebuilt once, has to be towed or limped to a shop once a week. My company runs KW,International,and F/L, all with Cats. Are Cats really that finniky?

I like how they pull and all but geez,only when they work :sad: