Traffic stoppage and logbooks

[Castanea_d.]

The other night, I had the pleasure of sitting for about an hour and a quarter on U.S. 41 within sight of the Ohio River bridge into Evansville IN, while construction crews did their thing on the bridge and shut down the road. I am not a truck driver, so it was no more than an aggravation to me, but I was thinking about the truckers all around me. Many drivers had shut down their engines as it was obvious it was going to be a long wait.

How does such a delay for an accident or construction, when it is sufficient to shut down, maybe get out of the truck and stretch, etc., go into your logbook? If you were running close on your 11 hours of driving, losing an hour like this could be a big problem. Could you log it as line 4, on-duty not driving?

That wouldn't help with the 14-hour clock if that was the problem instead of the 11 hours of driving. What if your 14 hours expired while you were in a tie-up and when the traffic rolled again, you drove on to the first place where you could stop for the night? Somehow, I doubt that Officialdom would cut you much slack, especially if it is the lawyers looking at your logbook in a court case down the road.

What would be the Right Thing to Do?

[golfhobo]

If the road is "shut down," you may drive UP TO an additional 2 hours (over your 11) to get to your destination or a safe place to shut down AS LONG AS it does not violate your 14 hour clock.

I'm sure someone will come along and quote the reg. And then there will be the expected arguments!

Thank you (as a 4wheeler) for even CONSIDERING us truckers! Now.... quit cutting us off, riding off our tandems, and parking in DOCK areas.... and we'll be good friends!

If the road is "shut down," you may drive UP TO an additional 2 hours (over your 11) to get to your destination or a safe place to shut down AS LONG AS it does not violate your 14 hour clock.

I'm sure someone will come along and quote the reg. And then there will be the expected arguments!

Thank you (as a 4wheeler) for even CONSIDERING us truckers! Now.... quit cutting us off, riding off our tandems, and parking in DOCK areas.... and we'll be good friends!

Thats a fact Jack !!

[Uturn2001]

Adverse driving conditions means snow, sleet, fog, other adverse weather conditions, a highway covered with snow or ice, or unusual road and traffic conditions, none of which were apparent on the basis of information known to the person dispatching the run at the time it was begun.

(b) Adverse driving conditions. (1) Except as provided in paragraph (h)(2) of this section, a driver who encounters adverse driving conditions, as defined in § 395.2, and cannot, because of those conditions, safely complete the run within the maximum driving time permitted by §§ 395.3(a) or 395.5(a) may drive and be permitted or required to drive a commercial motor vehicle for not more than 2 additional hours in order to complete that run or to reach a place offering safety for the occupants of the commercial motor vehicle and security for the commercial motor vehicle and its cargo. However, that driver may not drive or be permitted to drive-

(b)(1)(i) For more than 13 hours in the aggregate following 10 consecutive hours off duty for drivers of property-carrying commercial motor vehicles;

(b)(1)(ii) After the end of the 14th hour since coming on duty following 10 consecutive hours off duty for drivers of property-carrying commercial motor vehicles;

(b)(1)(iii) For more than 12 hours in the aggregate following 8 consecutive hours off duty for drivers of passenger-carrying commercial motor vehicles; or

(b)(1)(iv) After he/she has been on duty 15 hours following 8 consecutive hours off duty for drivers of passenger-carrying commercial motor vehicles.

[got mud?]

The other night, I had the pleasure of sitting for about an hour and a quarter on U.S. 41 within sight of the Ohio River bridge into Evansville IN, while construction crews did their thing on the bridge and shut down the road. I am not a truck driver, so it was no more than an aggravation to me, but I was thinking about the truckers all around me. Many drivers had shut down their engines as it was obvious it was going to be a long wait.

How does such a delay for an accident or construction, when it is sufficient to shut down, maybe get out of the truck and stretch, etc., go into your logbook? If you were running close on your 11 hours of driving, losing an hour like this could be a big problem. Could you log it as line 4, on-duty not driving?

That wouldn't help with the 14-hour clock if that was the problem instead of the 11 hours of driving. What if your 14 hours expired while you were in a tie-up and when the traffic rolled again, you drove on to the first place where you could stop for the night? Somehow, I doubt that Officialdom would cut you much slack, especially if it is the lawyers looking at your logbook in a court case down the road.

What would be the Right Thing to Do?

if you look at a lot of log books there is no such thing as traffic and it always takes 2 hours to drive 120 miles in a 65 mph zone.

[Double R]

if you look at a lot of log books there is no such thing as traffic and it always takes 2 hours to drive 120 miles in a 65 mph zone.

Average speed of 60 mph which is what most companies allow a driver to log with out flagging a logging violation. Traffic? What traffic, never seen any.

[yoopr]

if you look at a lot of log books there is no such thing as traffic and it always takes 2 hours to drive 120 miles in a 65 mph zone.

Average speed of 60 mph which is what most companies allow a driver to log with out flagging a logging violation. Traffic? What traffic, never seen any.

all depends on what part of the country you're in

[Double R]

if you look at a lot of log books there is no such thing as traffic and it always takes 2 hours to drive 120 miles in a 65 mph zone.

Average speed of 60 mph which is what most companies allow a driver to log with out flagging a logging violation. Traffic? What traffic, never seen any.

all depends on what part of the country you're in

True. In the NE it is very hard to keep an average of 60mph.

[Rev.Vassago]

If the road is "shut down," you may drive UP TO an additional 2 hours (over your 11) to get to your destination or a safe place to shut down AS LONG AS it does not violate your 14 hour clock.

This exemption can only be used for unforseen delays. Road construction is not considered an unforseen delay, as it is possible to know about it before being dispatched. So no, a shut down for road construction would not apply, and you cannot drive an additional 2 hours.

[golfhobo]

If the road is "shut down," you may drive UP TO an additional 2 hours (over your 11) to get to your destination or a safe place to shut down AS LONG AS it does not violate your 14 hour clock.

This exemption can only be used for unforseen delays. Road construction is not considered an unforseen delay, as it is possible to know about it before being dispatched. So no, a shut down for road construction would not apply, and you cannot drive an additional 2 hours.

I didn't read anything in the original post saying that the construction "shutdown" was advertised in advance. IF and ONLY IF the dispatcher and/or the driver is aware of the planned shutdown would it NOT be allowed.

I don't know what world you live or drive in, Rev. But I drive east coast to west coast. There is little chance that my dispatcher CAN know about every construction "shutdown" over a 3500 mile stretch of interstate.

The FACT is, that if I come across a "shutdown" road.... for ANY reason.... and I was not aware of it when I planned my trip, the FMCSA will allow me the exemption.

[Uturn2001]

Using the adverse conditons provision is a crap shoot in this day and age. With all the different forms of mass media, from radio to the internet, it really is difficult to run into conditons that there was no way of knowing about in advance if one simply takes the time to look.

If a driver feels they have a legit reason to use it, then go for it, myself I never used it, nor would I if I was still on the road for anything other than a road shut down due a traffic accident.

[Rev.Vassago]

I didn't read anything in the original post saying that the construction "shutdown" was advertised in advance. IF and ONLY IF the dispatcher and/or the driver is aware of the planned shutdown would it NOT be allowed.

Every state in the union has a number that you can call to get information on road construction. Every state in the union has a website that you can get information on road construction. Every dispatcher has a phone, and I'm willing to bet 99% of them have a computer with internet access.

I don't know what world you live or drive in, Rev. But I drive east coast to west coast. There is little chance that my dispatcher CAN know about every construction "shutdown" over a 3500 mile stretch of interstate.

Just because they fail to get the information, doesn't mean the information was not available to them. If they have a phone, then they COULD have gotten the information.

The FACT is, that if I come across a "shutdown" road.... for ANY reason.... and I was not aware of it when I planned my trip, the FMCSA will allow me the exemption.

Good luck with that. I'm sure that DOT is gonna love that "ignorance" excuse.

[continental]

3500 miles coast to coast? Call me, I know a shortcut through the forest. :wink:

[Rev.Vassago]

3500 miles coast to coast? Call me, I know a shortcut through the forest. :wink:

He takes the scenic route.

[Uturn2001]

Seattle to Key West is about 3500 miles.

[Rev.Vassago]

Seattle to Key West is about 3500 miles.

But it isn't 3500.

[kc0iv]

Seattle to Key West is about 3500 miles.

But it isn't 3500.

Seattle, WA to Key West, Fl air miles = 2725

Seattle, WA to Key West, FL Road miles
= 3629 per Yahoo maps
= 3519 miles per Mapquest
= 3,481 miles per Google
= 3818 miles per Mappoint by Msn

Take your pick

kc0iv

[golfhobo]

3500 miles coast to coast? Call me, I know a shortcut through the forest. :wink:

He takes the scenic route.

Well.... THAT I do, when I can.....

But, they're called "stop offs" usually slightly out of direct route. You DO know what they are, don't you?

[Rev.Vassago]

But, they're called "stop offs" usually slightly out of direct route. You DO know what they are, don't you?

Nope. No idea at all. I don't get paid to "stop off".

[golfhobo]

I didn't read anything in the original post saying that the construction "shutdown" was advertised in advance. IF and ONLY IF the dispatcher and/or the driver is aware of the planned shutdown would it NOT be allowed.

Every state in the union has a number that you can call to get information on road construction. Every state in the union has a website that you can get information on road construction. Every dispatcher has a phone, and I'm willing to bet 99% of them have a computer with internet access.

All valid, interesting, and accurate points. However.... totally immaterial to the discussion, and NOT REQUIRED of a dispatcher.

Just because they [dispatcher] fail to get the information, doesn't mean the information was not available to them. If they have a phone, then they COULD have gotten the information.

Part 395.2 Definitions

Adverse driving conditions means (snow etc., paraphrased) or UNUSUAL road and traffic conditions, none of which were apparent on the basis of information KNOWN to the person dispatching the run at the time it was begun.

This says absolutely NOTHING about a requirement for a dispatcher to check every weather forecast or state construction report (using phones, computers or anything else,) before dispatching a run, and certainly wouldn't apply to a temporary shutdown in a construction zone that could not POSSIBLY have been known about hours if not DAYS before I even got there.

The fact that there were 4wheelers caught in this shutdown, indicates it was not advertised even locally before it happened. Regardless, as long as my dispatcher didn't KNOW about it BEFORE he dispatched me, it DOES IN FACT qualify for the exemption, and I WILL be allowed to use said exemption.

Sorry, Rev. But once again, your desire to correct everyone on everything has led you into an indefensible position. Sometimes, it is best just to agree with people who are giving accurate and useful information, or say nothing at all.