How many chains would you put on this 33,600 lb wheeled grader?

[tracer]

http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...210101024a.jpg

This is a pic of the grader I moved from Montreal QC to Stoney Creek, ON (close to Buffalo, NY and US border). I used 2 chains in the front, 2 in the middle, and 3 in the back. I know most guys use only 4 chains for something like this (plus one more chain over the blade, right?) but I wanted to comply with the DOT requirement of 0.4 G for the forward movement and 0.5 g for the rearward movement. Which means the chains in the back of the machine must be able to withstand roughly 40% of its weight. And to add to confusion, there's an "aggregate work load limit" requirement, where all chain WLL together must be equal to at least 50% of the machine weight BUT - get this - only chains that go from one side of the trailer to the other side through or over the load are awarded the full WLL (4,700 lbs in my case). If a chain's one end is hooked to the trailer and the other - to the machine, for the purpose of the "aggregate work load" requirement it only counts as 50% or 2,350 lbs with my 4,700 lb WLL chains.

Could they have made it more complicated?

So, I put a bunch of chains on the rear of the grader (especially since it had wheels) and made sure chains were going from one side of the trailer to the other - through the 'eyes' on the frame of the machine. If you looked at the grader from the back, it looked like I had 20 chains in there

So, ow do you calculate how many chains to put on a machine like this? Weight: 33,600 lbs. Length: 28 ft. Height: close to 10 ft.1210101024a.jpg

[rank]

I remember before you got your step you were talking about pulling a grader. Looks like you found one. Below is a cut and paste from the FMCSA rule book.

Minimum Working Load Limit for Cargo Securement Devices and Systems
The aggregate working load limit of any securement system used to secure an article or group of articles against movement must be at least one-half the weight of the article or group of articles. The aggregate working load limit is the sum of: One-half the working load limit of each tiedown that goes from an anchor point on the vehicle to an attachment point on an article of cargo; and The working load limit for each tiedown that goes from an anchor point on the vehicle, through, over or around the cargo and then attaches to another anchor point on the vehicle.

[tracer]

I remember before you got your step you were talking about pulling a grader. Looks like you found one. Below is a cut and paste from the FMCSA rule book.

Minimum Working Load Limit for Cargo Securement Devices and Systems
The aggregate working load limit of any securement system used to secure an article or group of articles against movement must be at least one-half the weight of the article or group of articles. The aggregate working load limit is the sum of: One-half the working load limit of each tiedown that goes from an anchor point on the vehicle to an attachment point on an article of cargo; and The working load limit for each tiedown that goes from an anchor point on the vehicle, through, over or around the cargo and then attaches to another anchor point on the vehicle.

Didn't I say the same in my post? So, for the machine weighing 33,600 lbs you'd need 4 chains, provided they go from one side of the trailer to the other via a hole/eyelet on the grader. But with only 4 chains you'll be in violation of Rule #2: 0.4 G restraint in the rear from the forward movement.

[rank]

Didn't I say the same in my post? So, for the machine weighing 33,600 lbs you'd need 4 chains, provided they go from one side of the trailer to the other via a hole/eyelet on the grader. But with only 4 chains you'll be in violation of Rule #2: 0.4 G restraint in the rear from the forward movement.

I guess you did. I really only had time to skim it. Depends on how long your chains are. If they are long enough to go from trailer through the ties down lugs and back to trailer yes, you can get away with 4 chains.

If the chains are shorter and you need to run them from tie down lugs to the trailer, you would need 7 chains.

As far as the g force requirements are concerned, I can tell you the DOT guys don't go into it that deep. We've moved literally hundreds of pieces of equipment and we've been ticketed once. The driver drove the 10,000 lb tractor fwd until it touched the drop of the step deck, then set the parking brake and secured it with one chain across the hitch at the rear of the tractor. DOT cop pulled him over on the 401 in Whitby and fined him.

[tracer]

Depends on how long your chains are. If they are long enough to go from trailer through the ties down lugs and back to trailer yes, you can get away with 4 chains. If the chains are shorter and you need to run them from tie down lugs to the trailer, you would need 7 chains.

As far as the g force requirements are concerned, I can tell you the DOT guys don't go into it that deep. We've moved literally hundreds of pieces of equipment and we've been ticketed once. The driver drove the 10,000 lb tractor fwd until it touched the drop of the step deck, then set the parking brake and secured it with one chain across the hitch at the rear of the tractor. DOT cop pulled him over on the 401 in Whitby and fined him.

So as long as I have enough chains to cover 50% of the weight and these chains go from one side of the trailer THROUGH or OVER the machine and terminate at the other side of the trailer, I should be okay. I guess it wouldn't hurt to block the wheels somehow too... Plus add one more chain to secure the blade, if there's one.

[allan5oh]

It's not a matter of how many chains, it's a matter of do you have chains that are properly sized.

(a)(2) Working Load Limit. Tiedown assemblies (including chains, wire rope, steel strapping, synthetic webbing, and cordage) and other attachment or fastening devices used to secure articles of cargo to, or in, commercial motor vehicles must be designed, installed, and maintained to ensure that the forces acting on the devices or systems do not exceed the working load limit for the devices under the following conditions, applied separately:

(a)(2)(i) 0.435 g deceleration in the forward direction;

(a)(2)(ii) 0.5 g acceleration in the rearward direction; and

(a)(2)(iii) 0.25 g acceleration in a lateral direction.

(d) Aggregate working load limit for tiedowns. The aggregate working load limit of tiedowns used to secure an article or group of articles against movement must be at least one-half times the weight of the article or group of articles. The aggregate working load limit is the sum of:

(d)(1) One-half the working load limit of each tiedown that goes from an anchor point on the vehicle to an anchor point on an article of cargo;

(d)(2) One-half the working load limit of each tiedown that is attached to an anchor point on the vehicle, passes through, over, or around the article of cargo, and is then attached to an anchor point on the same side of the vehicle.

(d)(3) The working load limit for each tiedown that goes from an anchor point on the vehicle, through, over, or around the article of cargo, and then attaches to another anchor point on the other side of the vehicle.

With any heavy wheeled vehicle you should only use direct tiedowns, and these tiedown WLL's must add up to the cargo weight. When you use indirect tiedowns, you actually get double the WLL. The way they wrote the law is silly. They should've said the aggregate has to equal the weight of the cargo, you get 1X for direct tiedowns, but 2X for indirect (passing through) instead of this half baloney. For a quick example a 40,000 lb load can be secured by 4 5,000 WLL straps. As long as it's not over 30 feet(not prevented from forward movement) or 40 feet (prevented from forward movement).

So to calculate your grader:

Weight of 33,600
Four tiedowns using direct method

33,600 / 4 = 8400 WLL

Would be legal if you used four tiedowns of 7/16" or 1/2" chain. Or double each corner with 3/8" chain. Of course your securement points and binders have to be rated above this as well. In Canada you cannot use 5/16 chain for any heavy wheeled vehicle, the WLL must be above 5000 lbs for any tiedown(5/16 is rated for only 4700 lbs). That's why I say it's the size of the chain that matters, not how many.

On my trailer the tiedowns are only rated for 6600 lbs, even though it isn't stated on the trailer. So I'd need to use 8 3/8" chains minimum for that grader.

[allan5oh]

Rank do you ever use the indirect tiedown method with heavy wheeled/tracked vehicles? I don't think I've ever seen that. All the RGN stuff we do it's always 4 big chains one at each corner using direct method.

[allan5oh]

Have at it tracer:

USA:

Part 393.100: Which types of commercial motor vehicles are subject to the cargo securement standards of this subpart, and what general requirements apply? - Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration

393.100 through 393.136

Canada:

http://www.ccmta.ca/english/committe...2010_Final.pdf

[rank]

Rank do you ever use the indirect tiedown method with heavy wheeled/tracked vehicles? I don't think I've ever seen that. All the RGN stuff we do it's always 4 big chains one at each corner using direct method.

Not often, but I have. Mostly I use that method when I don't have enough shorter chains to make it legal so I'll hook the other end to a different point and voila! My chain just magically doubled in strength. Or sometimes I'll do it if I'm nearing the end of the chaining and I don't feel like lugging another chain out LOL. Usually tho, my chains are too short to use that pass through method.

From reading his post (properly, the 2nd time) I gather Tracer has 5/16" chain.

[allan5oh]

Mostly I use that method when I don't have enough shorter chains to make it legal so I'll hook the other end to a different point and voila! My chain just magically doubled in strength.

I've often wondered why don't guys do the X at the back, but with just one chain. Go from passenger side on the trailer to drivers side hook on the cargo, over to the passenger side hook on cargo, back to the drivers side of the trailer. That way you could get away with just 2 chains. But you may not satisfy the x amount of tiedowns every x feet. Like this:

________
\      /
 \    /
  \  / 
   \/
   /\
  /  \ 
 /    \
/      \

From reading his post (properly, the 2nd time) I gather Tracer has 5/16" chain.

Then he's not legal in Canada regardless of how many he has.

I need some 3/8 chain as well.

[tracer]

Then he's not legal in Canada regardless of how many he has..

I guess you're right!

....................
Heavy vehicles shall be transported in accordance with this section.
(2) Accessory equipment on a heavy vehicle, including a hydraulic shovel, shall be completely lowered and secured to the vehicle unless:
(a) the accessory equipment can only move vertically;
(b) accessory equipment that can pivot, tilt or move sideways is blocked or immobilized by the
transporting vehicle’s structure or by a blocking or securement mechanism built into the
transported vehicle.
(3) Articulated vehicles shall be restrained in a manner that prevents articulation while the vehicle is on a highway.
(4) Despite section 22, a heavy vehicle with crawler tracks or wheels shall be restrained against moving sideways, forward, rearward and vertically by at least 4 tiedowns,
(a) each with a working load limit of at least 2 268 kilograms, and
(b) each attached, as close as practical, at the front and rear of the vehicle or to mounting points on the vehicle that are specifically designed for that purpose.
.......................................

I wonder why US DOT 'experts' couldn't come up with the same WLL recommendation of 2,268 KG or 5,000 lb per chain. It makes sense. BTW, this is the first time I see this Canadian document. Thanks, Alan. Now I'll know. I'll keep my 5/16 chains but will get at least 4 heavy duty ones for corner tiedowns. Then I should be okay both in Canada and US. But I think my stake pockets are only rated for 5,500. I usually use them with heavy stuff (wrap the chain around all the way from one side, then under the pocket and hook on the other side of the pocket). I feel better when a chain goes from one side of the trailer via an eyelet on the machine to the OTHER side of my trailer. I don't have in-floor tiedowns.

[tracer]

So that all the good info is in one place, in case someone else besides me needs it

WLL
Grade 70 transport chains

1/4" - 3,150 lbs
5/16" - 4,700 lbs
3/8" - 6,600 lbs
7/16" - 8,750 lbs
1/2" - 11,300 lbs
5/8" - 15,800 lbs

[specialkay]

Typical Ontario. Make a rule so that convoluted that no one does it and then don't enforce it anyways. 3 of my neighbours are in construction and they all have 5/16 chain. They will put a binder on each corner but will usually use a short length of chain to fasten it to the trailer. So they are in violation right there. I would have been nailed multiple times over the years. Good thing I don't haul wheeled equipment. I would have just put two binders on the front pulling ahead and two on the back pulling back and two in the middle pulling down and be on my way.BTW Tracer I think you are supposed to have the straps crossed on both of the skids on the upper deck. Isn't trucking fun!

[tracer]

Tracer I think you are supposed to have the straps crossed on both of the skids on the upper deck. Isn't trucking fun!

Is there a rule about that too? I put a regular 3" strap on Skid #2 with 3 tires and I tightened it so hard that 1 half of the top tire was inside Tire #2 It was rock solid. The reason I used 2 straps on Skid #1 (and crossed them) was because these were hand ratchet straps with lower WLL (3,300 lb?).

I have been playing with numbers regarding the big machine I just hauled and it seems I"d still need 6 chains, even if they are rated for 6,600 lb each: the stake pockets on the trailer where I'd connect them are rated for 5,500 lb only. 33,600 lb x 0.43 = appr. 14,500 lb withholding force required to keep the machine from moving forward. 5,500 times 2 is only 11,000. So I'd need 2 chains going from one side of the trailer to the other (through an eye on the grader) and then one more long chain somewhere in the middle pulling back. That's 3 chains with 5,500 lb capacity: 5,500 lb + 5,500 lb + 5,500 lb = 16,500 lb. Same thing in the front but holding the grader from rolling back (must be enough chains to hold 50% of 33,600 lbs or 16,800 lbs).

All right, gotta stop - my calculator is getting hot

[specialkay]

I haul skidded coils and a few of our customers have diagrams on the walls of tie down techniques. The general consensus is that the skid must be restrained in any direction. Meaning 1 over the top is no good because it could slide out from under the strap. They'll show them crossed or a chain at the base pulling back on the skid to keep it from sliding forward. I generally cross the front and back skids and 1 over the top of the ones in between. I load mine together with no gaps. If the there is a gap then the front and rear would be crossed again. I've been checked a few times over the years in Ontario and I've never been questioned . I try to keep the piles under 9,000lb in the middle as I use 5/16 chain.

[tracer]

I haul skidded coils .

The skids in my picture had TIRES on them, not steel coils that probably weigh 10 times more. I think it's important to use common sense and to tie things down so that they don't move. My two skids haven't moved an inch and the front skid had 2 straps crossing over each other. I believe I did a good job and all was legal.

[rank]

... 33,600 lb x 0.43 = appr. 14,500 lb withholding force required to keep the machine from moving forward.

Are you sure you're interpreting that requirement to restrict .4g movement in the forward direction properly? I've never been able to make any sense of it. To me, a "G" is the force due to gravity. If I remember my college physics correctly, then Force = mass x accelleration and accelleration due to gravity is 9.8 M/s^2.

your machine weighs 15,000 Kg and if Force = Mass x Accelleration due to gravity, then;

F=MA
F = 15,000 Kg x 9.8 m/s^2 x .4
F = 58,800 kgm/s^2

So it would seem that the securement system needs to withstand a force of 59,000 kgm/s^2 in the forward direction. I believe that 3/8" Gr 70 chain has an ultimate tensile strength of 12,000 kg, therefore;

58,800 kgm/s^2 / 12,000 kg = 4.9 chains restricting forward movement. Seems like alot. Like I said, I've never been able to make sense of the "G" requirements so I go with their WLL rules instead.

[Steel Horse Cowboy]

As my grandfather taught me when I first started driving......

"Don't use LESS chains than they require you too, but don't run with LESS than you comfortable with either. Both will cost you a lot if something goes wrong and the DOT won't take it easy on the pocketbook either"

I would have ran the same amout you did Tracer.... no harm-no foul

[specialkay]

Tracer I wasn't implying you did anything wrong just what the regs seem to say. I would probably just run one over over the top also. It doesn't really matter what it is just the length and weight. I'd imagine those those tires aren't exactly light. They've made these rules so confusing you could probably get a ticket regardless of how it was chained. lol

[LBF]

This book does a great job of helping. Lots of pictures and written inplainer english.

https://member.ontruck.org/OTAWebsto...ement+Handbook

Grandfathers usually got it figured out, no harm in putting on too many... too few? oh dear...