I talked to a friend of mine at CHR today...

[chris1]

It is often more a cost of labor rather than out of pocket expenses. The real costs to the broker is minimal compared to the owner of a truck. The owner of the truck can spend thousands of dollars before he makes a nickel.

Labor has no cost? With that reasoning your "labor" for driving also has no cost. I'm sure you expect to be compensated for that the same as any salesperson would.

I also have trucks so i am fully aware of the costs. A new customer can run 1.3-1.5 ratio in the first 60 days. That is a far higher cost than a truck.

[Kranky]

There will always be those who place a low value on their services.

Sounds like that "performance based pay" thing you've been espousing may not be working too well for some.

Evidently the "performance" is there, but their pay is not commensurate with it.

.

[chris1]

Isn't it time for you to go to work? Maybe it will snow and you'll be busy for awhile.

[allan5oh]

chris I think he was talking about his own labor, there are no true "out of pocket" expenses for his own labor.

[chris1]

chris I think he was talking about his own labor, there are no true "out of pocket" expenses for his own labor.

I understand the theory but cash or not if you "donate" your time and don't "pay" yourself for it you're only fooling yourself.

I know some O/O's that "donate" 2-3 days a week waiting for that good load of a few hundred dollars more. If you would not accept it working for someone else why you not want it from yourself?

Time is finite,you can't get it back. Your time spent on something should be compensated(or at least allowed for) in your final pricing. What i was referring to was if you spend say 20 hours to get a customer and only to make a minimum amount your time spent was for nothing.

[Les2]

I understand the theory but cash or not if you "donate" your time and don't "pay" yourself for it you're only fooling yourself.

I know some O/O's that "donate" 2-3 days a week waiting for that good load of a few hundred dollars more. If you would not accept it working for someone else why you not want it from yourself?

Time is finite,you can't get it back. Your time spent on something should be compensated(or at least allowed for) in your final pricing. What i was referring to was if you spend say 20 hours to get a customer and only to make a minimum amount your time spent was for nothing.

Please tell me your not one of those guys who believes... A load on my trailer and wheels turning I'm making money, regardless of what it pays as long as you don't have to lay over types?

[dobry4u]

chris I think he was talking about his own labor, there are no true "out of pocket" expenses for his own labor.

Your own labor does not effect your cash flow, but looking at it realistically you have to give it value and determine if doing what you do is really worth your time. Everything has a trade off, so accounting for your time and putting it into perspective helps you to realize where you stand.

[Kranky]

Isn't it time for you to go to work? Maybe it will snow and you'll be busy for awhile.

Just got home again & saw this.

I'm always busy, it's just a matter of what I'm busy with.

As for the snow, I think you're well aware it's been too warm for that in our neighborhood lately.

Most of our equipment is ready for it now though.

.

[chris1]

Please tell me your not one of those guys who believes... A load on my trailer and wheels turning I'm making money, regardless of what it pays as long as you don't have to lay over types?

No i don't believe that. But if your costs,including your labor exceed the additional moneys gained by waiting you didn't accomplish anything but a loss.

[chris1]

Your own labor does not effect your cash flow, but looking at it realistically you have to give it value and determine if doing what you do is really worth your time. Everything has a trade off, so accounting for your time and putting it into perspective helps you to realize where you stand.

It's far easier to understand the monetary value of time when you have employee's. Unless you're the type that doesn't pay for sitting waiting for that good load. I'm sure that these type's would scream if they worked for someone else and were told to sit a few days for nothing.

[chris1]

Just got home again & saw this.

I'm always busy, it's just a matter of what I'm busy with.

As for the snow, I think you're well aware it's been too warm for that in our neighborhood lately.

Most of our equipment is ready for it now though.

.

I'm betting on global warming.

[GMAN]

Labor has no cost? With that reasoning your "labor" for driving also has no cost. I'm sure you expect to be compensated for that the same as any salesperson would.

I also have trucks so i am fully aware of the costs. A new customer can run 1.3-1.5 ratio in the first 60 days. That is a far higher cost than a truck.

I never stated that labor has no costs. If you are compensated by performance then there is no out of pocket labor costs until something is sold. In other words, you have no actual out of pocket expenses until you pay your salesman. If you are the salesman then you only receive compensation when you sell a load of freight.

[Kranky]

I never stated that labor has no costs. If you are compensated by performance then there is no out of pocket labor costs until something is sold. In other words, you have no actual out of pocket expenses until you pay your salesman. If you are the salesman then you only receive compensation when you sell a load of freight.

Most "salesmen" receive a base salary for compensation in addition to the commission they receive for each sale they make, unlike some OTR drivers who receive nothing for sitting waiting.

The driver is "on the job", responsible for company equipment, not at liberty to do as he or she wishes, yet receives no compensation for that time.

.

[chris1]

The driver is "on the job", responsible for company equipment, not at liberty to do as he or she wishes, yet receives no compensation for that time.

.

That is how some convince themselves that they are making a profit. They only cost their time when they are loaded. If they sit 3-4 days,no performance so no cost.

[GMAN]

Most "salesmen" receive a base salary for compensation in addition to the commission they receive for each sale they make, unlike some OTR drivers who receive nothing for sitting waiting.

The driver is "on the job", responsible for company equipment, not at liberty to do as he or she wishes, yet receives no compensation for that time.

.

Most of the higher paying sales positions are commission only. Some offer a draw against their commission. The draw is usually paid weekly and charged against the commissions on sales at the end of the month. If a draw is given is is typically around $250/week.

[chris1]

Most of the higher paying sales positions are commission only. Some offer a draw against their commission. The draw is usually paid weekly and charged against the commissions on sales at the end of the month. If a draw is given is is typically around $250/week.

250.00 week draw is on pretty low end sales positions. We gave car salespeople that much of a draw in the 80's. Most straight commission sales are captive accounts.(or true independent sales)

[GMAN]

The idea of a draw is not to be enough to earn a living but to help the salesman get along until his commissions begin to come in. Some people have the mistaken believe that a draw is a salary. It isn't. It is only used to bridge the gap between starting a new position and getting your commissions coming in. There are some who continue giving a draw no matter how long the salesman is with the company. Car sales, media and advertising sales are a few who regularly pay a weekly draw against commission. There are other types of sales jobs where a based salary is paid and a smaller commission or bonus is paid on sales. This is the way pharmaceutical sales used to be set up. I am not sure if that is still the case or not. I think more sales positions have moved toward commission only or a draw against commission in recent years.

[GMAN]

Most "salesmen" receive a base salary for compensation in addition to the commission they receive for each sale they make, unlike some OTR drivers who receive nothing for sitting waiting.

The driver is "on the job", responsible for company equipment, not at liberty to do as he or she wishes, yet receives no compensation for that time.

.

A driver who works by the mile is paid on performance for the miles he drives. He isn't nor should he be paid extra for being responsible for his equipment. It is part of his job. There is no one else who should or could be responsible for his equipment. His equipment makes it possible for him to earn a living. If he fails to take care of his equipment then he is out of a job. I suppose that I am a bit out of the loop with the way some people think these days. So many people don't want to take responsibility for themselves or their assigned equipment. When I was growing up and in my early days of adulthood most people accepted responsibility for themselves and their families. We didn't mind being responsible for our equipment. It never occured to us that we should be paid extra for that. We considered it part of the job. Perhaps that is why so many carriers opt for these fleece purchase programs, to make drivers more responsible for their equipment.

[chris1]

I employ both captive and independent salespeople in this and other businesses. Have for many years. Don't know where you get your information from but it certainly is not the typical structure of pay.

[chris1]

A driver who works by the mile is paid on performance for the miles he drives. He isn't nor should he be paid extra for being responsible for his equipment. It is part of his job. There is no one else who should or could be responsible for his equipment. His equipment makes it possible for him to earn a living. If he fails to take care of his equipment then he is out of a job.

I see nothing wrong with that. Remember though that when we the"carrier"can't provide the ability(loads) and require the driver to wait for us he needs to be compensated for that.