A strike - the worst thing we can do, and what we SHOULD do.

[allan5oh]

Two main reasons:

1) The economy is teetering on recession mode. If we went on "strike" this would definitely push the economy over the edge. Just look at those axle union workers, how many people had to be laid off because those people were striking. The trickle down effect was huge, imagine what it would do if we went on strike, boycotted, whatever. This effect would further punish us. It would be counterproductive.

2) Our image would further erode. We already have image problems.

What should we do? Well that depends on our goals.

High fuel prices

Everyone is talking about fuel prices. Fuel cost is now by far #1 the biggest expense, and in some cases is more then all other expenses combined.

My solution is for everyone to slow down to no faster then 60 mph. Also, ensure your equipment is in good shape, and do not idle. Ever. Idling costs are about $5 an hour right now, almost twice as much as picking up a phone and making a long distance call, and leaving it off the hook! Anyone wanting to buy a "classic" truck right now is INSANE.

Should we get congress or the president to slow down all trucks to less then 60 mph? Absolutely NOT. This should be an individual business decision. I do NOT want the government running my business.

So now we've done something amazing, reduced our fuel cost, but if everyone did this, something else amazing would happen. The price of fuel would go down. Why? Because there's less consumption.

Cheap loads

Many people are talking about the cheap loads. Simply refuse to haul them. If you cannot stay afloat with the rate given, why do you haul it? The most important thing is to know your cost, and your expected profit. I know what loads work for me, and I try to stick to them. I do not deal with brokers, so I cannot comment further.

Racking up the miles

This is also part of the problem. You heroes out there doing 14,000+ miles solo are contributing to the excess capacity problem. What we need to do is cut back our miles, try to get more per mile, and to reduce our costs per mile. The end result will be the same money, but with less miles. Slowing down helps.

Anyone agree/disagree?

[SoCal79]

I agree. The other day I had a plumber out to my house and I told him what to charge and he left. I am in dump trucking and am absolutely dumbfounded by people lowering the hourly rates lower now than it was 10 years ago. You are correct, slow down,and start refusing the cheap stuff. But unfortunatly every broker that calls me with a job at a cut rate has no problem finding someone to do it after I refuse.

[Evinrude]

I agree. The other day I had a plumber out to my house and I told him what to charge and he left. I am in dump trucking and am absolutely dumbfounded by people lowering the hourly rates lower now than it was 10 years ago. You are correct, slow down,and start refusing the cheap stuff. But unfortunatly every broker that calls me with a job at a cut rate has no problem finding someone to do it after I refuse.

My suggestion is to get all the driver trainers to drive solo. Eventually the supply of cheap drivers will dry up and rates will rise also.

[ICS]

My suggestion is to get all the driver trainers to drive solo. Eventually the supply of cheap drivers will dry up and rates will rise also.

This is crazy... so there are two things here. Have the driver trainers not train? so you are complaining about wages for a company driver are low because of the "cheep" labor. if that is the case why would a trainer give up half his pay to work harder? so he could better the industry wages? you really think someone is going to do that?

also the point about lowering your miles and go for higher prices is a good idea... only if every owner operator would do it, and if EVERY company fleet goes out of business. The great pumpkin now has got a fuel fleet and other companies are brokering their freight because they don't have enough trucks to deliver all their loads they have so much business.

I am sorry to say but when the economy suffers the small business owner is the first to go.

I think the only way to survive a small recession as an owner operator is to specialize. why compete in what everything everyone else is doing? The only ones that will survive are the small business owners that separate themselves from the pack. Now if that means extremely better service or specialized service? or anything else that would help keep a shipper using you and you alone. how about placing their ad on the side of your trailer? something? you just can't do the same thing over and over and expect things to be different

as far as getting O/O and company drivers to try and have a uniform front There is NO WAY. everyone has separate situations and when it comes down to it they are going to do what is best for them and their family.

Lets start really thinking about what can be done... I mean seriously thinking about. not just throwing stuff off the top of our heads.

[Evinrude]

My suggestion is to get all the driver trainers to drive solo. Eventually the supply of cheap drivers will dry up and rates will rise also.

This is crazy... so there are two things here. Have the driver trainers not train? so you are complaining about wages for a company driver are low because of the "cheep" labor. if that is the case why would a trainer give up half his pay to work harder? so he could better the industry wages? you really think someone is going to do that?

also the point about lowering your miles and go for higher prices is a good idea... only if every owner operator would do it, and if EVERY company fleet goes out of business. The great pumpkin now has got a fuel fleet and other companies are brokering their freight because they don't have enough trucks to deliver all their loads they have so much business.

I am sorry to say but when the economy suffers the small business owner is the first to go.

I think the only way to survive a small recession as an owner operator is to specialize. why compete in what everything everyone else is doing? The only ones that will survive are the small business owners that separate themselves from the pack. Now if that means extremely better service or specialized service? or anything else that would help keep a shipper using you and you alone. how about placing their ad on the side of your trailer? something? you just can't do the same thing over and over and expect things to be different

as far as getting O/O and company drivers to try and have a uniform front There is NO WAY. everyone has separate situations and when it comes down to it they are going to do what is best for them and their family.

Lets start really thinking about what can be done... I mean seriously thinking about. not just throwing stuff off the top of our heads.

I work for a small company we had 2 trainers they booth stop training. The Company keep trying to get more drivers to train drivers, not gonna happen.
What a difference, we are getting respect.
Work for us.

[ICS]

I'll give you that I could see how it would work in your particular situation. Did your wages increase?

[allan5oh]

Schneider can still do well in this cheap freight world, because they all run cheap centurys with pure fuel mileage specs(2.64, direct drive 10 speed, 12.7 detroit). I'll bet their fleet averages around 7.5.

They've been prepared for this for 6-7 years now. Their older trucks weren't specced this good.

Try to find an orange truck that idles. Just try.

They had the foresight many years ago.

[Mandilon]

Anyone wanting to buy a "classic" truck right now is INSANE.

Who wants to bet "classics" prices are gradually heading SOUTH? Anyone keeping tab on prices?

I pitty the hoods.

Soon enough the mucho machos will trade-in their 'get-out-of-my-way' fuel hogs and opt for "a sissy" (-sissy, mentioned somewhere by a mucho macho in another thread) rig.

Even one percent fuel improvements are starting to look good enough.

Hang on to your hats, it's a long ways DOWN!

God Bless all

[RostyC]

Schneider can still do well in this cheap freight world, because they all run cheap centurys with pure fuel mileage specs(2.64, direct drive 10 speed, 12.7 detroit). I'll bet their fleet averages around 7.5.

They've been prepared for this for 6-7 years now. Their older trucks weren't specced this good.

Try to find an orange truck that idles. Just try.

They had the foresight many years ago.

Funny you mention that Allan, because I was thinking about that the other day. Is there a way to find out what their fleet average is? or any company fleet mpg for that matter.

The reason I was curious was because the driver is a huge mpg factor as well, and let's face it, most company drivers aren't going to worry about it as much as a truck owner would. So I wonder how it all washes out.

[RostyC]

Anyone wanting to buy a "classic" truck right now is INSANE.

Who wants to bet "classics" prices are gradually heading SOUTH? Anyone keeping tab on prices?

I pitty the hoods.

Soon enough the mucho machos will trade-in their 'get-out-of-my-way' fuel hogs and opt for "a sissy" (-sissy, mentioned somewhere by a mucho macho in another thread) rig.

Even one percent fuel improvements are starting to look good enough.

Hang on to your hats, it's a long ways DOWN!

God Bless all

Yes, I looked the other day at prices and it doesn't looked liked they've dropped for the new "hood" trucks.
Looks like fuel might be starting a downward trend along with the rest of the commodities so we'll see.

[allan5oh]

I think mandolin is talking more about resale prices, and he's right. Classics and aeros now depreciate about the same rate.

[Mandilon]

I think mandolin is talking more about resale prices, and he's right. Classics and aeros now depreciate about the same rate.

Yes sir!

Looks like fuel might be starting a downward trend along with the rest of the commodities so we'll see.

No sir!

The ADDED demand for fuel from China is neutralizing any surplus or diminished demands from us (though I doubt we're using less fuel because of the escalating fuel prices).

The federal government ANNOUNCED (about three months ago) that ALL oil company SUBSIDIES would gradually be removed within a ten year period.

Guess what? THEN we'll B paying WORLD fuel prices! Do U know the price for fuel in England, Japan? --hold on 2 UR socks 'cause U ain't seen 'noting YET!

Obviously there's lower price SPIKES! Now figure the HIGH spikes AFTER a lower one......prices keep GRADUALLY heading NORTH!

There's TOO MANY trucks 4 too FEW loads that's why rates are what they are.

God Bless all!

[RostyC]

I think mandolin is talking more about resale prices, and he's right. Classics and aeros now depreciate about the same rate.

Yes sir!

Looks like fuel might be starting a downward trend along with the rest of the commodities so we'll see.

No sir!

The ADDED demand for fuel from China is neutralizing any surplus or diminished demands from us (though I doubt we're using less fuel because of the escalating fuel prices).

The federal government ANNOUNCED (about three months ago) that ALL oil company SUBSIDIES would gradually be removed within a ten year period.

Guess what? THEN we'll B paying WORLD fuel prices! Do U know the price for fuel in England, Japan? --hold on 2 UR socks 'cause U ain't seen 'noting YET!

Obviously there's lower price SPIKES! Now figure the HIGH spikes AFTER a lower one......prices keep GRADUALLY heading NORTH!

There's TOO MANY trucks 4 too FEW loads that's why rates are what they are.

God Bless all!

I disagree with pretty much all that but we'll see. China's economy is showing signs of slipping. We consume 25 percent of oil, China cannot magically use our surplus, if that were the case our inventories wouldn't be rising. Remember no economy booms forever. The recent spike in fuel was from speculation. Now you're seeing a de-leveraging in the commodities. Look at gold for instance, it was over a thousand dollars, now in two or three days we're at 920. Was there a shortage of gold? no. Like I said we'll see.

I do agree with too many trucks too little freight.

Here read this.

I'm going to put a few of the paragraphs below.

`Commodities were a bubble'' that is now bursting, Kaplan said. ``Prices will go lower than you can believe.''

What?? that can't be with all the "hoods" still driving around. (I'm sorry I couldn't resist Mandilon)

``Global-recession fears are causing selling pressure in all commodities,'' said James Mound, head analyst for MoundReport.com, a commodities newsletter, in Palm Coast, Florida. ``The markets are focusing on want-based items instead of need-based items.''

Global Recession Fears...........that means China as well.

Read the article though it's pretty interesting.

[Mandilon]

THX RostyC 4 the link, good info.

Now you're seeing a de-leveraging in the commodities. Look at gold for instance, it was over a thousand dollars, now in two or three days we're at 920. Was there a shortage of gold? no. Like I said we'll see.

Remember WHEN gold was $3? How much did fuel cost 'then?'

Are they on a similar trend UP 'TIL NOW?

Who wants 2 bet AGAINST me that fuel prices will not follow the SAME trend (upwards) within the next year as it has done for THE LAST year?

And I'll even take a similar bet on gold.

God Bless all truckers!

[rottne]

alan i agree with your conservation approach to the fuel price crisis.If the trucking industry and the driving public changed their driving habits to the goal of reducing comsumption, we could easily reduce our nation wide fuel use by 15 to 35%!
Oil would drop like a rock! The oil companies would be taking a bath in red ink for a change instead of the little guy!All it would take is every body on the same page.

[rank]

Who wants 2 bet AGAINST me that fuel prices will not follow the SAME trend (upwards) within the next year as it has done for THE LAST year?

I will bet that diesel is cheaper in 3-6 months than it is now. For future reference, it's currently $1.185/L at the Napanee Flying Hook.

[BigDiesel]

Relax.... Another month or so of high fuel prices will be good for the industry.... It rids us profitable O/O's of the buck a mile so called O/O's.

BBR's and CH 19 morons are strike supporters....


Oh BTW what happened to my post on another subject, it vanished ala TN style.

[RostyC]

THX RostyC 4 the link, good info.

Now you're seeing a de-leveraging in the commodities. Look at gold for instance, it was over a thousand dollars, now in two or three days we're at 920. Was there a shortage of gold? no. Like I said we'll see.

Remember WHEN gold was $3? How much did fuel cost 'then?'

Are they on a similar trend UP 'TIL NOW?

Who wants 2 bet AGAINST me that fuel prices will not follow the SAME trend (upwards) within the next year as it has done for THE LAST year?

And I'll even take a similar bet on gold.

God Bless all truckers!

I wouldn't bet on anything right now, it's just too volatile. However, I would be tempted to take you up on the gold prices over the next year. Look at thisChart.
Now if the bet is 30 years out, then no, I won't take it.

Notice when the last run up on gold was? right at 1979-80(economic turmoil). Then back to sustainable levels. Also note the recent sharp climb started around 2002. That's when the dollar started it's decent. Now the dollar is trying to start climbing and gold is retreating as well as commodities.

I was trying to find a chart on fuel so we could look at a comparison but I can't find one that goes back that far. I can only find one going back six years.

[RostyC]

Relax.... Another month or so of high fuel prices will be good for the industry.... It rids us profitable O/O's of the buck a mile so called O/O's.

BBR's and CH 19 morons are strike supporters....


Oh BTW what happened to my post on another subject, it vanished ala TN style.

I agree it is healthy for the industry and the ones that run a sound business should get through.

Same thing is happening in construction right now, which started this whole mess, housing that is.

Once the economy sh*ts out this massive turd that was created we'll start to see improvement.

[Mandilon]

If the trucking industry and the driving public changed their driving habits to the goal of reducing comsumption, we could easily reduce our nation wide fuel use by 15 to 35%!
Oil would drop like a rock! The oil companies would be taking a bath in red ink for a change instead of the little guy!All it would take is every body on the same page.

No, oil will NEVER drop like a rock. OUR expenses WILL.

OPEC (and the rest of the germs, including OUR domestic terrorist-like oil companies) will C-U-T production to HOLD current prices (these terrorist arabs LOVE $100+/barrell figures!).

No, we will NEVER B on 'the same page,' too many of us R 2 dumb to know what we're doing.

It is estimated that if ALL the money in the world were gathered and spread out evenly, the ones who have it now would eventually get it back and the ones that don't have any 'now' would eventually have none.

Basic economics.

God Bless