K...what am I missing?

[pepe4158]

Hmmm let me start by mentioning I am very new to this own authority thing, I am very shocked to see the only two loads I have booked have been thru major carriers, Steven's and Schneider....so if I can book decent loads thru them at 1.50-1.60 dry van....why the hell would I want to lease to them for 90c plus feul surcharge, and then get stuck with heavy ***** loads not going where I choose?
Now I quess if you get a good dispatcher (driver mgr or whatever they call it) I quess things could be ok. But never been my luck as a Co. driver, just always got some clown waiting till it was friday and putting in his hours and couldnt give a ***** bout me.
Just occurs to me when I see so many peps here asking...should I lease here or there?

[solo379]

Well, it's seems to me, that you are missing your unpaid DH miles, increased operation costs(own trailer...) longer times to get paid(if ever)

At the end of your first year, get your average rate, for all miles run, and you might see, that it's not much different(if any), than $0.90+FSC(currently, probably about $1.20 a mile) And their costs, is probably $0.15-20cpm lower than yours, with a lot less headache!

Don't get me wrong, I'm not criticizing you, or anybody. You just asked, what you are missing, and i just trying to give you my perception on that.

Eventually, it doesn't really matter, what your official status is.
It's all come down to money, whether you are making it, or not! :wink: 8)

[Cam]

Well, it's seems to me, that you are missing your unpaid DH miles, increased operation costs(own trailer...) longer times to get paid(if ever)

At the end of your first year, get your average rate, for all miles run, and you might see, that it's not much different(if any), than $0.90+FSC(currently, probably about $1.20 a mile) And their costs, is probably $0.15-20cpm lower than yours, with a lot less headache!

Don't get me wrong, I'm not criticizing you, or anybody. You just asked, what you are missing, and i just trying to give you my perception on that.

Eventually, it doesn't really matter, what your official status is.
It's all come down to money, whether you are making it, or not! :wink: 8)

That's good, that's the side of the story you don't hear around here very much. I was listening to this guru on XM today and he said that when it's all said and done, 19 out of 20 guys he deals with could do as well or better being leased on someplace. I'm not saying there aren't two sides to the story it's just that there are two sides to the story.

The freedom of booking your own loads is huge. But, the headache of booking your own loads is huge, too.

[Cam]

BTW, dispatchers work for the company, not the driver. The company has needs, the load planners have needs, these needs are as important to the dispatcher as the needs and desires of the driver. It's his job to balance them, not just give the driver anything he asks.

[coastie]

Well, it's seems to me, that you are missing your unpaid DH miles, increased operation costs(own trailer...) longer times to get paid(if ever)

At the end of your first year, get your average rate, for all miles run, and you might see, that it's not much different(if any), than $0.90+FSC(currently, probably about $1.20 a mile) And their costs, is probably $0.15-20cpm lower than yours, with a lot less headache!

Don't get me wrong, I'm not criticizing you, or anybody. You just asked, what you are missing, and i just trying to give you my perception on that.

Eventually, it doesn't really matter, what your official status is.
It's all come down to money, whether you are making it, or not! :wink: 8)

I feel Pepe is smart enough to find loads with less deadhead. Unload on one side of the state, and reload on the other, I think he smarter than that.

Last week or so, I did a dry run on paper. DId it as I was pulling a Reefer, Flatbed and Dry Van. Each time, I was able to come up with over 3500 Loaded miles, and only 60 miles deadhead for the entire week. And the dead head was to intial pickup, and to pick up last load.

But other than the money side of things, I feel and personal feeling, it's worth the lost of the few deadhead mile pay than putting up with the BS of any company out there. There are still some of us who do not see life with Dollar Signs all over it. There are some of us that realizes that you have to spend money to make money. Spend on deadheading to pick up that 1.60 per mile rather than hauling it for 90 cents per mile. More miles at 1.60 tens time better than the 90 for the little deadhead in the long run.

Takes a little planning, and a little thought, and if you deadhead you deadhead. I'm sure pepe not going across state to pick up the next load. so the deadhead will not be that painful of miles.

[solo379]

I feel Pepe is smart enough to find loads with less deadhead.

You didn't get it! :sad: It's not about being "smart", or "stupid", it's just nature of business! :wink:
And what do you mean,-"who do not see life with Dollar Signs all over it."?
What the hell in my post, made you say that!?

Yes, i make a living in a trucking, but money is merely a tool for me, not a purpose. It also true measure of your success, unless you do it for fun! :P

[no_worries]

Coastie, those "dry runs" you modeled...I'm assuming you had no idea what those loads paid. I guarantee that you will not touch those kind of miles unless you plan on running for anything that's offered, and even then I'm dubious. By the way, you do know that you could make a delivery then a pickup in the same city and still have 50 miles deadhead, right? As far as what you're saying about rates, you've got a lot to learn.

Pepe, don't count on being able to get those rates from those guys too often. You got those kind of rates because you're going to bad freight areas. You did well coming out of TX at that rate especially if you didn't have to deadhead. We'll see how you do out of FL. I'm bringing a dry load, 18,000 lbs, from TX to FL for $1675 on 885 miles and I wouldn't have touched that except that it's prime time for reefers there right now. I'm looking to head back to CA and it's not pretty.

[coastie]

Solo; I did not mean to upset you, just wanted to point out some facts. Maybe I worded it wrong, but sorry for upsetting you.

What the hell in my post, made you say that!?

At the end of your first year, get your average rate, for all miles run, and you might see, that it's not much different(if any), than $0.90+FSC(currently, probably about $1.20 a mile) And their costs, is probably $0.15-20cpm lower than yours, with a lot less headache!

To me hauling for any company would be a Bigger headach than the slight loss of deadheading loss. If you sit down and plan out your trips, using the information you have before you at the time, you can avoid alot of the unnessary deadheading. As I said I did do a dry run on paper, out of 3500 miles it had me deadheading 60 Miles the entire rounds. 35 to pick up the first load, and 25 to pick up last load. I know when I get out there doing it, it will not be the same as I did it on paper. But I was also doing it at worst case senerio Worst pay, that I'll accept, which is like Pepe, 1.50per mile.

You use all tools out there you can do well and not have the headach your talking about. Least to a company your running at their mercy. That a headach in it's self.

[coastie]

Coastie, those "dry runs" you modeled...I'm assuming you had no idea what those loads paid. I guarantee that you will not touch those kind of miles unless you plan on running for anything that's offered, and even then I'm dubious. By the way, you do know that you could make a delivery then a pickup in the same city and still have 50 miles deadhead, right? As far as what you're saying about rates, you've got a lot to learn.
.

I am using the smallest amout I would accept. Some loads have their rates posted, and most do not. Yes but the deahead I am using are for having to travle to a different city. But still my point is the small amount of deadhead verse the amount of load miles, still better than depending on another company. Unload in one side of town and reload on the other yes, you can add up, but on average it will not be over 10 to 20 miles the most. To drive the full circle around Atlanta, is less than 20 miles. Then if you running no less than a certain amount of miles, the lower pay average is decreased where it not that big of a deal. You'll not be down 20 cents or such per mile.. As I just said use all the tools you'll make it.

You do have to avoid the bad areas. Florida and Calif. for my self. I look and see what offered in the areas before I would pick the load in the first place. If not much offered, then I would not look at a load going there.

Yes I do have a lot to learn, that why I am here on these forum to learn. It's going to be a while before I can get out there. But I am also stating from my previous experences also. How I seen companies run, and operated. Some things has changed, some has not. Most that change is the HOS. But as it is I have nothing else to do besides sit here and learn. Go out to eat now and then, but nothing to take me away that is very important. Being retired sux for me. So I want to go back to work, in a fields I enjoy. One is shut out for me now, and this leaves me the trucking. But it not like I am coming off the streets into a truck. Even when I started back in 96, I had some knowledge of trucking then, I grew up around it. But as long as I am driving, there will be something to learn, for I am a believer, if I think I know it all, I better park the truck.

[no_worries]

What load boards are you looking at to find loads paying $1.50/mile average for 3500 miles a week and 60 miles of deadhead?

Oh, and you might want to take another look at your atlas, 20 miles won't get you all the way around the loop.

[solo379]

Solo; I did not mean to upset you,

And you did not, no need to apologize! 8)

But if you really want to learn, you better think again. I'm not saying, that you shouldn't do it, only that "paper runs", didn't work, in reality
You may learn it an easy, or hard way, the fact is stay the same! :wink:

[GMAN]

Deadhead is relative. If rates are high enough, the deadhead won't make as much difference. Another think to keep in mind is that most brokers will be off on their mileage by at least 5-10%.

[DD60]

The extra costs of having your own authority are roughly around 20-25k more a year than leasing with a megacarrier paying 1.20 a mile. Even if you average 1.60 a mile for all miles you will still be 15-20k ahead,will you not? Another thing to keep in mind is that you don't use as much fuel when you deadhead,which makes a difference at the pump. If having your own authority isn't much different than leasing with a megacarrier paying .90cpm+fuel surcharge than all O/Os would be broke. 1.20 a mile in today's economy with high fuel and maintenance costs is simply far from enough to operate on. Sure,you might make money in the beginning until the operating costs catch up with you. Been there,done that.NO THANKS.

[coastie]

Solo, just my Military experence coming into play. We did not set the ship on fire to learn how to put it out, Though they do certain ones for certain schools, you do not shot at others or have missiles fired at you to learn to battle them, yet we had fired dumby Torps at and been fired at by submarines, but It's mostly done in drills (paper runs). And I had to put these paper runs into realtime events. Fire at Sea May 8, 1985, Cuban hositilties (Never made the News) in the mid 80's and again in 95, and Central American Country attacking a US Flag Sailing Vessel.

I always try to Plan ahead. Seeing how things go. I do know it would not be the same. I do know that there more to it than writing it down. But I do know if I can make it from that. I do know I can find loads going to and from. So it not a wasit of time. It is a learning tool. And all it is a tool. On Paper and out doing it, is 2 different things. But I am taking what you and others are saying, and put it down in trail runs such as I did to learn to do it so I can do it with less problems.

Sure,you might make money in the beginning until the operating costs catch up with you. Been there,done that.NO THANKS.

Guess you don't know how to manage money then... also have you heard of a maintenance escrow? I just started 3 months ago and have $1900 saved.


I take 1 week off minimum every month.
I'm doing fine with my megacarrier. Despite many people on here telling me that I'd be just another number. solo379 was talking sht when I started a thread saying I was going o/o

You can have your own authority and make 25-35 cpm more then me, but you have to find a good honest broker(s). You don't mention also time spent finding loads if your broker don't have one... Have fun sitting at the DAT board LOL. Meanwhile I'm rolling on down the road.

The unpaid deadhead miles take their toll GMAN, you know this. I'm at least paid for those.

[DD60]

Sure,you might make money in the beginning until the operating costs catch up with you. Been there,done that.NO THANKS.

Guess you don't know how to manage money then... also have you heard of a maintenance escrow? I just started 3 months ago and have $1900 saved.


I take 1 week off minimum every month.
I'm doing fine with my megacarrier. Despite many people on here telling me that I'd be just another number. solo379 was talking sht when I started a thread saying I was going o/o

You can have your own authority and make 25-35 cpm more then me, but you have to find a good honest broker(s). You don't mention also time spent finding loads if your broker don't have one... Have fun sitting at the DAT board LOL. Meanwhile I'm rolling on down the road.

The unpaid deadhead miles take their toll GMAN, you know this. I'm at least paid for those.

The issue isn't managing money. The issue is 1.20cpm is NOT enough to operate on in the long run. When leasing with a megacarrier you are merely a glorified company driver. Some find out the hard way. Maintenance escrow? Most carriers only require what,1k? On a used truck you will end up spending FAR more than that and it is merely just a low-reserve savings account on a new one. There is no point in rolling down the road if you are not making a profit. 1900.00 saved in 3 months,lol? That is only 7600.00 a year and won't even cover an overhaul. You are just subsidizing the company.Like I said before everyone does fine in the beginning until operating costs start catching up,which is one reason why you see a full repo lot.

[solo379]

There is no point in rolling down the road if you are not making a profit.

Funny that you've mention it!
I just want to add, that it applies to any O/O, weather leased, or with own authority.

All i wanted to say, is that authority is not necessarily makes you success, and profitable, and in a lot of cases, they are making the same, if not less, than those "will work for food" $0.90+FSC O/O.

At the same time, leasing to a good company, could work quiet well! :wink:

[rank]

Coastie,

I must agree with no_worries and solo.....I think you're numbers are off a bit. I don't know much about vans, but from what I read, I think $1.50 is high. Also, 60 dead miles might be achievable if you're pulling a van to and from a good area, but I can tell you that you will have many, many more dead miles than that with a flat.

It almost seems that you're taking the best from each scenario...i.e dead miles from vans and higher rates from flats.

We run steps and double drops in the northeast and I feel lucky to get a 60-100 mile deadhead to pickup (in NY, PA, CT back to ON) on a 400-500 mile load. That's 20%-25% and it would be higher in less populated areas. Also, unless you live in Ohio or Pittsburgh, being home every weekend will cause your DH miles to skyrocket.

I think Steve is running about $1.60 loaded with about 10% DH (that's probably low). Using those numbers, that's $1.45 for all miles. If we put costs at $1.10 (no driver pay), you'll have a pretax profit of $35,000 on 100,000 miles.

Budgeting for $1.30 loaded and 20% DH "should" provide some breathing room for an economic downturn.

Not trying to be an accountant...just trying to provide a viewpoint. Hope it helps.

[DD60]

There is no point in rolling down the road if you are not making a profit.

Funny that you've mention it!
I just want to add, that it applies to any O/O, weather leased, or with own authority.

All i wanted to say, is that authority is not necessarily makes you success, and profitable, and in a lot of cases, they are making the same, if not less, than those "will work for food" $0.90+FSC O/O.

At the same time, leasing to a good company, could work quiet well! :wink:

Agreed. It all comes out to what you average per mile and what your costs are. The problem with leasing to a carrier is that most are paying .90cpm plus fuel surcharge and the few percentage-paying companies that are left average out to the same thing. Finding good customers and/or brokers is the key.Unfortunately it is not done easily.

[solo379]

The problem with leasing to a carrier is that most are paying .90cpm plus fuel surcharge and the few percentage-paying companies that are left average out to the same thing. Finding good customers and/or brokers is the key.Unfortunately it is not done easily.

The same thing, is about finding a good(very subjective) company to lease to. And if you'll find such a company, you'll find all in one;-customers, brokers+some cost reduction, on top of that! 8)