Slip, sliddin' away

[Mr. Ford95]

Dad had a friend running with Wal-Mart up in Maine empty who had a truck behind him call on the CB to check his trailer. When he looked out his left mirror he saw nothing, he looked out his right and saw the big Wal-Mart logo. The wind had blown the trailer out from behind him in the left lane clean onto the shoulder on the right while on a snow covered highway. He said he just kept going at the same pace and hoped nothing solid got in the way until the wind dropped off and allowed him to pull it back straight.

[MichiganDriver]

That's the thing. If the trailer swinging to the side loses sideways momentum somehow it should settle back in behind the trailer nicely. Too bad that's about all you can do in a truck. In a car you could speed up and coerce a trailer to get back in line.

[Mr. Ford95]

Obviously the worst thing you can do is hit your brakes in that situation, trailer blown out from behind you, but that is exactly what a lot of people would do out of instinct. Even seasoned drivers who have never experienced that would fall for hitting the brakes, not all of them but some would.

[golfhobo]

Wow... so many misconceptions.

The voices DO sound Slavic to me, but aren't there MANY of those in this country? MANY of them driving our trucks?

The oncoming cars all looked American (or foreign but bought in America) to me... including the last one with the emergency lights on. (and none of THEM slowed for the snowplow.)

I saw no evidence of WIND. No snow blowing across the road.

The camera vehicle DID "peak" his nose out and retreat to his lane. And he was at a pretty safe distance behind the truck in front of him... which didn't appear to have its LIGHTS on!

The snowplow was STOPPED on the side of the road, but next to a guardrail... meaning he hadn't enough shoulder to BE stopped on.

The roads weren't ALL that slick, cuz the box truck was able to pull right and stop without "losing it." And the camera vehicle stopped in his lane without skidding.

The oncoming truck apparently had to make a quick maneuver around the stopped salt truck. Notice how his wagon slid to the right BEFORE he went around the salt truck, then slid to the left. He was able to "recover" it because he kept accelerating thru the "situation." I doubt he was expecting the situation to happen.

I do believe that the oncoming truck was probably travelling too fast for conditions (and contingencies.) Typical for "local" drivers.

But, I'm not sure that he could have done better by trying to STOP behind the snowplow. Applying the tractor brakes would have made the "box" come completely around taking out the box truck while the tractor was pushed into the snowplow.

If he had a "Johnny bar," applying short bursts of braking to the rear tandems would have brought the trailer in line sooner! (but, of course, RockyMtnPro disagrees with me.)

The important thing is... this can happen in front of ANY of us at any time during the winter months. I didn't see ANYONE put their flashers on to warn other drivers of a situation.

The camera car had the BEST chance to slow down sooner, but didn't. EVERYONE was driving too fast for conditions... the most prevalent of those conditions being the presence of a snowplow.

The only reason the oncoming truck "lost" his trailer, was that he let off the gas and decelerated his rig from the POWER source. Given that mistake, and the situation as it was, I believe HE controlled the situation better than anyone else BUT the straight truck.

[Mr. Ford95]

Hobo, watch it again man. First off, it was in Europe, that van the camera vehicle was passing is commonly seen in Britain. The other clue that it wasn't anywhere near the US, the speed all the vehicles were moving.

Second, the snowplow did nothing wrong. It only stopped because the idiot in the semi was overtaking him and lost control which forced him towards the guardrail on the right and to a stop. Nobody said anything about wind being involved, just discussing other ways for something like that to happen due to wind.

[MichiganDriver]

Stopping the video at the 20 second mark shows the oncoming truck's trailer is behind the snowplow and slides all the way across the road until it hits the guardrail. It looks like the roads were at least a little slick. I can't tell how fast the vehicles were moving.

Note to self - don't stop being lucky.

[GrandCountyColoradoBoy]

According to my wife, they were definitely Russian. From what she said, the drivers were basically calling the other driver an "a**hole", and they were also saying something to the effect of, "It's a wonder". Also Hobo to answer your question/ statement, I know the two guys that delivered my four wheeler to Virginia were both Russian. No, I don't know how many there are around, but they're there.

[golfhobo]

that van the camera vehicle was passing is commonly seen in Britain.

Maybe... but, not on THAT side of the road.

[golfhobo]

After further review:

I can see the snow spray coming from the plow just before the incident. He was, in fact, plowing the shoulder. Probably came to a stop to allow the bucket truck room to pass given the situation.

The powdery nature of the snow left after the truck passes the camera, shows that the temp was well below freezing. The road was "clear," but some residual water in the grainy surface would have been ice. But, the road was not "icy" or the van and the camera vehicle couldn't have stopped without sliding.

Obviously, the truck shouldn't have tried to pass the plow, but I don't think he intended to. Had he "planned" to pass the plow, he would have edged around him to his left, and no reason to initially lose the trailer to the right. I believe he was probably TEXTING (or otherwise distracted) and ran up on the plow without totally realizing it. His first impulse would be to decelerate and swerve to the left. This would cause the trailer to slide to the right as it did. Knowing he couldn't stop... he chose to complete the pass and hope for the best. Once he got out there, he saw the van and tried to get back in front of the plow quickly. This "overcorrection" snapped the trailer to the left and across the road. He was definitely accelerating as he tried to pull it back onto the right side of the road in time.

I even think I see evidence that the trailer may have struck the back of the plow as it stopped (which would have helped "kick" it to the left side of the road.)

I don't know where this happened (other than it was not in Britain.) But, I don't see even the representation of a small "european" style vehicle in all the oncoming cars that passed the camera. The VAN cab looks more American than the "mitsubishi" types commonly seen in Europe. [Sure do miss ole WOT!]

I do believe the trucker was able to "save" his trailer. But... I think that SUV with the flashing lights was on his way to give him a ticket. Probably for speeding (too fast for conditions.)

Anyway.... none of my comments are important. I just like trying to analyze these kinds of videos. I don't claim to be right! I just claim that my theory is plausible.

[MichiganDriver]

Good observations Hobo but... hehe There's always a but.

Is North America the only place on the planet where we drive on the right side of the road? I'm too lazy to do searches like "What side of the road do they drive on in Russia?". Is the whole rest of the world driving on the wrong side of the road? Also, I gave up trying to guess how fast vehicles were traveling in vids years ago. I can't tell, I simply can't tell by watching a video. A case in point is Ice Road Truckers. During the in-cab shots it looks like the truck is moving along quite nicely. But then they pan out and the truck is barely moving.

[Mr. Ford95]

It really depends on the country Michigan. Actually, very few countries drive on the left like the Brits. Here's a map: File:Countries driving on the left or right.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

To answer your question, yes Russia does drive on the right like us.

[MichiganDriver]

It really depends on the country Michigan. Actually, very few countries drive on the left like the Brits. Here's a map: File:Countries driving on the left or right.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

To answer your question, yes Russia does drive on the right like us.

Wtg MrFord! Good researching.

[golfhobo]

MichiganDriver said:

Good observations Hobo but... hehe There's always a but.

Not in MY world.

Is North America the only place on the planet where we drive on the right side of the road?

No... but, I thought you KNEW that. I also would have thought that you AND Mr. Ford would know that in Britain... they DON'T. I didn't mean to imply, or contest, that this happened in the U.S. But, I did... correctly... point out that it could NOT have happened in Britain where the "box truck" was so often seen.

I'm too lazy to do searches like "What side of the road do they drive on in Russia?". Is the whole rest of the world driving on the wrong side of the road?

What searches? Watch MOVIES! And "pay attention" to details. Hell... I don't know all the countries that still live by British Imperialistic rules... but, (and there's always a but,) SOME do! European Automakers [and even American ones] make their vehicles with either "right" or "left" controls depending on the country they're being shipped to. I see someone posted a list. Haven't checked it yet. Don't really care. Surely... Britain is not the ONLY backsided country in the world! But, I KNOW that those vehicles are NOT on the "correct" side of the road to be in Britain.

Also, I gave up trying to guess how fast vehicles were traveling in vids years ago. I can't tell, I simply can't tell by watching a video.

I never guessed at the speed of the other vehicles. What I noticed was, that they did not ALTER their speed by much if any during the event. This is most easily observed/measured by the fact that there was no major "slowing down" or stacking up of the vehicles. They maintained there "spacing" throughout the event. There was ONE car who slowed to a near stop behind the plow, letting all the others go by, but not ONE of the others exhibited brakelights (which would have been visible in those conditions,) nor did the distance between ANY two of them change dramatically as they "passed thru" the situation without too much concern.

If they were all going slowly, then so was the "trucker." That wasn't the impression I got as HE and all the others passed by the nearly "stationary" camera vehicle. I DID notice a slight acceleration by the vehicle with the flashing lights.

A case in point is Ice Road Truckers. During the in-cab shots it looks like the truck is moving along quite nicely. But then they pan out and the truck is barely moving.

It's a phenomena known as "focal length." To get "clarity" up close, you have to use a focal point with only a two foot (for example) length... or depth. That makes everything coming INTO that field of focus look like it is "rushing." From "outside," or a distance... you use a longer focal length, giving you a DEEPER or (wider) range of things in focus, and things outside that foci are not so far out of the picture that their movements are so exaggerated.

See me after class! ... no really... think about hitting a deer! The guy in the truck says it all happened so fast! But... (and there's always a but...) the guy on the mountain with a long range lens can fire off a whole roll of film showing the approaching truck, and the deer bolting into it's path, and the resulting collision. And then take his second sip of coffee! Perspective. Distance. Focal length.

Don't get me started talking about photography! You might derail me from my mission of political debate!

[Mr. Ford95]

Here's a Target load finding the wrong target in Minnesota: Target Truck Skids Into Icy Pond Instead Of Parking Lot (VIDEO)

It skid 100-200 ft on the ice before breaking thru..........that's beyond pucker factor.

[Windwalker]

Here's a Target load finding the wrong target in Minnesota: Target Truck Skids Into Icy Pond Instead Of Parking Lot (VIDEO)

It skid 100-200 ft on the ice before breaking thru..........that's beyond pucker factor.

Sure don't know what caused it, but I'm sure he gets inducted into the POLAR BEAR CLUB HALL of FAME...
Just a little too chilly to be on that recovery crew.

[Mr. Ford95]

Sounds like he may have hit a patch of ice on the road. It said he lost control while traveling along I-94, crossed the median and the oncoming lanes before heading out to sea. Maybe the truck is a former Ice Road one.........

Sure fire lock for Polar Bear HOF, first ballot inductee.

[golfhobo]

Hobo...

Slick roads still give you the "shakes", I see.....

In a way, you are right. Snow doesn't bother me so much cuz I can SEE it, but ICE? I don't like it! It can be invisible.

This past week, I was westbound on I-40 through New Mexico and Arizona (late at night.) There was no snow falling or any moisture in the air. Just east of the continental divide, the temp started falling by one degree PER MILE! I couldn't believe it. 20, then 19...18...17... down to 12 degrees, one degree every mile! I've never seen it fall so fast. Then up again for a bit, and then back down. None of this really mattered, as there was no moisture on the roads.

I crossed the border into Arizona doing about 70 mph. (My truck does 75 and that was the speed limit, but I drive slower at night.) Immediately, I noticed that the right lane had been "resurfaced" with a different kind of asphault. And, all of a sudden, the truck felt "wobbly." You know what I mean? Not so immediately respondent to the steering. I slowed down and started "testing" the road surface. As I said earlier, the more "grainy" the surface, the more likely that ice has formed in the cracks and "pores" of the surface.

Yes, Windy, when I had the speed under control (still over 65) I started "jerking" the wheel a little. I'm only talking about maybe 5-10% or so deviation. Experience on DRY roads has taught me to expect the cab to sway a little in response, and then to "recover" to the initial track. But, it was SLOW to respond to my command. I changed lanes (carefully) and did the same on the more "concrete" road surface. Nearly the same response. I returned to the darker asphault lane and continued the experiment. The slow response continued, and I over-rode what my eyes were telling me.... and slowed down even further! I ended up doing about 60 mph in a 75 zone... cuz, I didn't like the FEEL of it! I never DID see anything like a "sheen" on the road, I just slowed down until I felt like I was in control.

On the return trip over the same roads two days later, I did the same experiment, and the truck responded quickly and decisively as I would expect it to. I was able to maintain 70-75 mph in the same area.

I LIKE to drive fast when conditions permit. But... I am NOT going to be one of those who create those "tracks" through the median caused by a driver who either fell asleep OR slid off the road going too fast in a curve when the road was somewhat "icy" on (or under) the surface. [and I lost COUNT of the number of such tracks in the median that were "fresh" on this trip!]

I guess everyone has their own way of finding out if a road is slick. MANY of them find out by plowing thru the median. But, I don't think that will EVER be me! I have my own method, and it has NEVER failed me. And that is to "shake" the wheel a bit if I don't like the "feel" of the rubber on the road!

There was absolutely NO evidence I could see that would explain that road being slick. Five miles earlier, I rounded a curve doing 70+ mph with no problem. The ONLY thing that tipped me off was the "response" of my truck as I continually "checked" the surface as I drove along and my awareness of the difference in the type of road surface.

You can warn against my method all you want. Maybe it will be helpful to newbies who drive 60mph trucks. But, you will NEVER change my mind about my methods (which MAY only apply to drivers of faster trucks.) After all... there ARE "kinetics" involved. But, I am here today to bear witness that having the "shakes" on icy roads can be a good thing.

[Windwalker]

Hobo, I'm sure you remember one mid-December trip across Texas. I came out of NM on I-40, and while NM had salt shakers out and the road was damp, the state line was like drawing a curtain. No less than 4 accidents within one mile of the state line. By the time I got 36 miles into Texas, there were more than 40 accidents I went by. Guys were chaining up to run flat ground.

So, one of the things that might also help new drivers would be to keep in mind that different states treat their roads differently. One might have salt on the road, and just across the state line, you need ice skates. It could be a very intelligent choice to slow down at a state line and spend some time to determine just what the surface is in the new state. Then, drive accordingly.

[belpre122]

Hobo...

Slick roads still give you the "shakes", I see.....

Heh heh. I caught that one...................LMFAO!!!

Slick roads are just for starters WW.

A whole lotta shakin goin on in that Hobo ride.