Kind of Grizzly . .

[ilikeike]

Yellow meets England on I-65 nw of Indy. Interstate Reopens Hours After Fatal Crash - Indiana News Story - WRTV Indianapolis

England says he had been on and then came off the shoulder with his flashers on, then accelerated to 40 when Yellow hit him. The Cops don't yet know but I'd guess Yellow was on the high side of 55-65 and who knows why he didn't see and/or couldn't slow/move over for England.

Look at the pictures. I'm having a hard time accepting that England and Yellow doubles would have all stopped straight as an arrow under those circumstances. I'm not disagreeing but it doesn't compute with me.

Any theories from our panel of experts?

Noobs need to know:

Shoulders are marked "EMERGENCY STOPPING ONLY" and map reading does not constitute an emergency. It's very likely the England driver will be ticketed for this.

My employer would fire me for any incident arising out of a non-emergency shoulder stop.

There'll be a lawsuit as a result of this. The Yellow driver has already lost everything and I doubt the England driver will fare much better.

[Malaki86]

There's no way that England truck was doing 40mph. From the damage to the Yellow tractor, who was probably doing 65, England MAY have been doing 5-10mph.

RIP driver

[Skywalker]

I'd almost be tempted to speculate that the England driver was new, or it was a trainer talking to a student...not paying attention to what the heck he was doing.... He probably didn't get up to 40.... More than likely he whipped the truck off the shoulder into the slow lane without accelerating on the shoulder then "safely merging" into traffic. If he had, then it is highly likely that the accident would have never happened.

I've had people in cars and trucks who were sitting on the shoulder just up and whip out into the lane in front of me without so much as care in the world. Not a look in the mirror, no turn signal, nothing...just whip it out there and then take their sweet time getting up to speed. That's why I always change lanes when there is a vehicle on the shoulder...

[Steel Horse Cowboy]

Living by CRE's training center, and being an ex-MCI myself, England is at fault. Unless he was on the shoulder for a failure/emergency such as tire, engine or fire, this accident would never have occured if he had properly stopped at an approved location and not on the shoulder. Judging by the pic, CRE was traveling at maybe 15mph at most, and YRC probably didnt have time to move over. Sad story

Now being bias since I live just a few miles from CRE training center (it's a nightmare) I also would speculate he DID NOT have his emergency flashers on, more likely his turn-signals. The YRC driver had over 35yrs driving experience (I'm speculatiing but shince he was 60 and they are union) and the CRE driver was prob a trainee or less than 1yr experience.

[ilikeike]

There's no way that England truck was doing 40mph. From the damage to the Yellow tractor, who was probably doing 65, England MAY have been doing 5-10mph.

RIP driver

I'm inclined to agree with you and the 2 posts that follow yours . . but I'm still having the same problem. The Yellow truck says a lot of speed regardless of how fast England was going. The fact that they stopped in line, laser straight is the part I'm having trouble with. Why didn't at least one Yellow trailer jackknife or roll? Do you think the England trailer "caught him" like a mitt and then pulled him to a straight stop?

[Sealord]

It does look like YRC was "caught like in a mitt". Does the back of the England trailer say "training driver"? So sad. BOL

[Mr. Ford95]

Yea, that England truck was not moving at no 40 mph, if it had been then it wouldn't have been fatal. Why didn't Yellow see him? May have been that he had another truck in front of him who moved over at the last second when they realized what was going on and Yellow was left hanging with no place to go and no time to react.

[golfhobo]

Couple of questions and observations.

The story never said it was a C R England driver. That tractor doesn't look like the normal cheap England power unit. An O/O team hauling an England load maybe? [Not saying it wasn't an England O/O team. Owner was probably the one in the bunk.]

Yellow driver MUST have seen him with some amount of warning. He appears to have been trying to either "ditch it" or pass him on the shoulder. If you look at the pictures in the slideshow.... BOTH trucks are in line ON THE SHOULDER. (Two lane interstate..... cones on middle dividing line, left tires of both trucks "just" left of fogline and "maybe" slightly angling to the right! Did England see him and try to get BACK to the shoulder just as Yellow was trying for the shoulder?

They say there was a hill. Yellow probably wasn't doing over 55, especially if HE had intended to take the upcoming exit. England should have known his route BEFORE he got to that interchange! And should NEVER stop "just over a hill!"

[Steel Horse Cowboy]

Yes, YRC deff drove "into" the rear of the truck and they were joined from that point on, so as CRE drove to the shoulder, he just pulled the YRC truck as if it was a set of pups explaining why they are in a line.

The CRE driver will most likely be found at fault as you are not legally allowed to stop on the shoulder, plus I am going to guess he was in violation somehow (the DOT will find SOMETHING) and I can gurrantee YRC will file a BIG lawsuit against CRE, and hopefully it will be so large the company will go out of business (doubt we would get so lucky tho)

[Chunker]

Yea, that England truck was not moving at no 40 mph, if it had been then it wouldn't have been fatal. Why didn't Yellow see him? May have been that he had another truck in front of him who moved over at the last second when they realized what was going on and Yellow was left hanging with no place to go and no time to react.

I always wonder how some drivers can run 60mph 30ft off the bumper in front of them.

[golfhobo]

I always wonder how some drivers can run 60mph 30ft off the bumper in front of them.

I agree Clunker. And I almost mentioned this. I call it the "Elephant Train." But, I don't see that this was definitively the answer to this situation. "IF" another driver had been involved, he would have stopped or been "mentioned" by now. I don't know WHY the Yellow driver didn't go LEFT. Maybe, there were cars there that didn't even realize what was happening. But, we should have heard from them by now.

I suspect there are DOT cams that will show what actually happened. IF we ever get to see them.

You will NEVER hear of the Hobo being involved in an accident like this. I don't run "right lane" unless I'm holding up traffic (I can DO 70) and I don't sniff elephant farts!

[Mr. Ford95]

You will NEVER hear of the Hobo being involved in an accident like this. I don't run "right lane" unless I'm holding up traffic (I can DO 70) and I don't sniff elephant farts!

Hobo, knock on wood man. Just when you think this will never happen to you, something crazy can happen and you get caught up in something like this in several different ways.

[golfhobo]

Hobo, knock on wood man. Just when you think this will never happen to you, something crazy can happen and you get caught up in something like this in several different ways.

I KNOW what you are saying, my friend, and I DO think about it ALL the time. I've said before, I get PAID to be "on the job" 10 - 14 hours a day! I stay OFF the phone. I check my mirrors constantly. I listen to my truck. I keep my distance. But, that doesn't mean I follow RIGHT BEHIND another truck JUST because we are both doing the SAME mph.... or because there is traffic in the lane to my left. I ALWAYS keep an out! I stay BACK if I can't be in the middle lane by myself! I move right ONLY for faster trucks or LOTS of faster traffic. One or two cars? They can pass me left or right... I don't care! I am WATCHING them! Usually, I am going faster than them.

IF.... and that would never happen.... I had to drive a truck governed at the "usual" speed of 62 -65.... I would find a place to "settle in" and follow... but NOT SO CLOSE that I can't see what is ahead! I CANNOT drive that way! TOO dangerous.... and TOO boring! I believe that these "boring" speed limits and governors lead to MANY if not most of the "truck related" accidents. I don't plan to EVER be part of that problem!

I cross bridges over water in the LEFT lane, because a right steer "blowout" could take me OVER THE EDGE if I were in the RIGHT lane! I don't CARE what some 4wheeler behind me THINKS.... he doesn't KNOW what I know!

He's on his way to the mall, or grandma's. I'm ON THE JOB.

Knock on wood? If I thought that would help, I'd do it EVERY day before driving! This is not a "crapshoot." This is not a game. This is our lives.... and those around us.

People can think what they want of me but, I am the most careful, conscientious, respectful, and "attentive" driver I know of.... who isn't scared to death of the machine he is in control of! I can drive a RIG like some people drive a CAR. And yes.... I KNOW it takes longer to STOP one if you find yourself in that position! I just try to stay OUT of those "positions."

Thanks for your concern, though. And I return it to you with sincerety. I hope I NEVER hear of someone on CAD being involved in such an accident. Sabine remains on my mind and my heart forever. As do ALL of you!

[Malaki86]

I'm in one of the slowpoke governed trucks. I'm at the same speed as a huge majority of other trucks on the road now. But, as stated before, I don't tailgate anyone, ever. I like to see 2-3 trucklength between me and the vehicle in front of me. I also move out of the right lane if there's ANYTHING on the shoulder. I've had too many idiots pull out in front of me. The same goes for entrance ramps. I don't care if it causes someone else to have to slow down for a few seconds - I'm not going to put my wife and myself at risk because some moron is trying to remember if they got everything they needed to pick up at Wal Mart. When it comes to bad weather, I drive what I feel comfortable with. As soon as it "doesn't feel right", I park - no questions asked. The load will get there late, but it will get there in one piece.

[Steel Horse Cowboy]

Golfhobo, no offense but your way of thinking is deff not professional.

[golfhobo]

Golfhobo, no offense but your way of thinking is deff not professional.

No offense taken. And just WHAT part of what I said brings you to that conclusion?

[ilikeike]

I believe that these "boring" speed limits and governors lead to MANY if not most of the "truck related" accidents.

I can't argue that point . . but I will if I can find some statistics to back it up. Speed absolutely makes for more severe accidents but you're postulating frequency, correct?

For now, I'll say your observation is as much a matter of perception as anything else. My perception is completely the opposite. I'd say the vast majority of wrecks I've encountered involve companies I don't recognize, FEDEX and UPS excepted. My prejudice is probably based on my assumption that, if I don't recognize the company, the truck isn't governed, at least not as slow as mine. Conversely, I almost always recognize the trucks I pass.

You've said yourself that when you encounter a Swift, for example, you pretty well know what you have to contend with. I agree with that. I'm a lot more concerned with the containers and fuel yankers and especially the seasonal rock, trash and farm haulers who clearly have little experience yet drive some of the fastest trucks on the road. I like the slow lane and the fact that I'm out of the race before it ever gets started. I see more, I relax more and by default or not, I always have more time to react.

Back to the wreck at hand; does anyone know how England (the Company) would treat these guys? I think it's fair to assume it's a fleeced with a student but have no idea who was driving. Would England fire a student or terminate a fleece in a situation like this? I'm guessing that, under these circumstances, the driver drives no more. While that may be his just desserts, if the Yellow driver had lived, he'd have a lot of explaining to do. I'm judging him a.) severely distracted b.) medically incapacitated c.) sound asleep or d.) dead before he hit England. There is simply no excuse for not seeing, braking and/or avoiding England.

[Mr. Ford95]

I think we're missing that this took place just before 5 am, which means it's still dark out...........could the England trucks lights been out? Nothing in the article states whether or not he had his flashers or turn signals on or any lights for that matter.

[Mackman]

I don't run "right lane" unless I'm holding up traffic (I can DO 70) and I don't sniff elephant farts!

Well if you see me get out of the left lane. Cuz there are still some trucks out there that can do well past 70. You slow poke. lol

[bigjoel]

Couple of points to ponder:

The driver that pulled off the shoulder can always say that he "thought" something was wrong with his truck. The truck was sputtering, or he heard a noise and thought a tire blew out. That would clear him for pulling off the road.

In every type of rear end collision, it is the driver's fault who hit the vehicle. The law states you must have "total control" of your vehicle at all times. Heck, the vehicle in front of you might slam on his brakes. If you rear-end him, it is your fault. Failure to maintain control of the vehicle.

I know there are other variables that can be thrown in, but speaking from a legal, and insurance point of view, the driver who hits the vehicle in the rear is always at fault.

Always maintain proper following distance. Try to give yourself an "out". If you can change lanes safely, avoid vehicles on the shoulder.