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Senior Board Member
Originally Posted by DaveP
Cops aren't under paid infact state patrol or a county in a county that isn't PO' dunk make more than drivers...Plus most cops aren't out saving the world or doing anything heroic or self sacraficing in nature...
Teachers are not under-paid they make from 40k-100k depending on where/what they teach and have 50% of the year off ...no real sacrafice there .
Senior Board Member
You are so blind. The median STARTING wage for a police officer is $35-40k, unless you've been on the force for 10s of years, you're not making $100k a year. Kinda like pilots. You start out making $30-35k. and only after you put some time in, does it go up.
Teachers get half the year off? If you think that, then either you were a high school drop out, or home schooled, which explains alot. Teachers start preparing for the school year weeks ahead of 'first day of class'. which is normally late August, so teachers are 'working' 2nd week of August. And the school year isnt over till late May? and if they teach summer school, (granted an extra bonus to their salary) they only get a month or two off. So from Mid-August to lets say mid-May. they are working 9 months. that is more than 50% my friend. if you want me to send it to you outside of this 'story problem' format, i will.
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And, in many cases, teachers are required to take summer courses at a university to keep their certification. Sure blows the summer away.
Destroy the cities...and they will rebuild them.Destroy the farms...and grass will grow in the streets of the cities.
Destroy the economy of the blue-collar worker...and grass will grow in the executive offices.
The bill has come due.
( R E T I R E D , and glad of it)
Member
"I'm looking for a long-haul job. I want to run coast-to-coast and none of that short haul crap."
Most companies are moving toward eliminating long haul runs and going more to the short to medium haul freight. That's where the money is. Technically, it's been where the money has been for a long time. It's just that in today's market with fuel being what it is, the profit margin for long hauls has completely vanished.
(All well and good but a 200 mile run almost everyday dont make me no $$$ even if the load pays $5000 I still only get CPM)
"My truck must have an APU."
Granted, it would be nice for all trucks to eventually have APUs and perhaps someday we'll be there as an industry. But APU's are still a wild card. Several states have banned them and/or considering banning them. Most of the larger companies are taking a wait and see approach until they know what the eventual standard is going to be. By the same token, though, if a company doesn't have APU's on their truck, their idling policy needs to be along the lines of "use common sense."
( All I say is no sub. ie apu idleair home or its nice out dont cry about idle time)
"I need to take my dog Scooter with me."
Pet policies will soon be a thing of the past. Most companies are getting rid of pet policies due to the excessive idling that is needed to maintain a safe and comfortable environment for said 4-legger when you are not in the truck... ie. showering, eating, playing video poker, etc.
(amazing they find maintaining a safe and comfortable environment a bad thing, I know more then a few that took pets so they could stay in such environment )
"I must be able to use an inverter. I can't afford to eat out all the time."
Inverters are another animal. A few companies still accept them, but that is a dwindling list. The fire hazard that inverters create have pushed a lot of companies to banning them outright. On top of that, there is a pretty big liability involved, too. If a company still allows them and has their shop install them, there is still that human element. If a shop-installed inverter malfunctions and burns the truck to the ground with the driver in it, they might as well hand over a blank check to the family of the dead driver.
As to the issue of not being able to afford to eat out all the time, go buy a 12V cooler. I know a lot of guys that go that route, pack it with the basics every week and then eat healthy and well the entire time they are out on the road. If you want an inverter for your microwave, George Foreman grill, coffee-maker, Belgian waffle maker, and espresso machine, go buy your own truck.
( cooler works great if your going to be home every week and during said wk. But wks away from home and I would like to heat something up
Senior Board Member
Put up and Shut Up
It’s really this simple:
If you are a newbie, shut up, sit down, drive the truck and get experience. As long as you are not being forced to violate the law, you deserve absolutely zero consideration in what goes on. I was just happy to have a job years ago when I got into this business. Your first year or two, your number one job besides doing what your company asks you to do is to learn this business. It’s unfortunate that very few anymore ever do actually learn how to be a good driver or how this industry works.
If you pay attention and learn a few things and get a couple of years of good experience, have no accidents or tickets, then you have the right and the option of shopping for a company that meets your “standards”. Otherwise, why would a company go out of its way to accommodate your needy, whining butt when you are the run of the mill, know nothing, don’t care to know anything steering wheel holder?
"The Breakfast of Champions isn't cereal, it's the competition!" - "Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom." - "An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last."
Administrator
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"I'm looking for a long-haul job. I want to run coast-to-coast and none of that short haul crap."
Most companies are moving toward eliminating long haul runs and going more to the short to medium haul freight. That's where the money is. Technically, it's been where the money has been for a long time. It's just that in today's market with fuel being what it is, the profit margin for long hauls has completely vanished.
(All well and good but a 200 mile run almost everyday dont make me no $$$ even if the load pays $5000 I still only get CPM)
"My truck must have an APU."
Granted, it would be nice for all trucks to eventually have APUs and perhaps someday we'll be there as an industry. But APU's are still a wild card. Several states have banned them and/or considering banning them. Most of the larger companies are taking a wait and see approach until they know what the eventual standard is going to be. By the same token, though, if a company doesn't have APU's on their truck, their idling policy needs to be along the lines of "use common sense."
( All I say is no sub. ie apu idleair home or its nice out dont cry about idle time
"I need to take my dog Scooter with me."
Pet policies will soon be a thing of the past. Most companies are getting rid of pet policies due to the excessive idling that is needed to maintain a safe and comfortable environment for said 4-legger when you are not in the truck... ie. showering, eating, playing video poker, etc.
(amazing they find maintaining a safe and comfortable environment a bad thing, I know more then a few that took pets so they could stay in such environment )
"I must be able to use an inverter. I can't afford to eat out all the time."
Inverters are another animal. A few companies still accept them, but that is a dwindling list. The fire hazard that inverters create have pushed a lot of companies to banning them outright. On top of that, there is a pretty big liability involved, too. If a company still allows them and has their shop install them, there is still that human element. If a shop-installed inverter malfunctions and burns the truck to the ground with the driver in it, they might as well hand over a blank check to the family of the dead driver.
As to the issue of not being able to afford to eat out all the time, go buy a 12V cooler. I know a lot of guys that go that route, pack it with the basics every week and then eat healthy and well the entire time they are out on the road. If you want an inverter for your microwave, George Foreman grill, coffee-maker, Belgian waffle maker, and espresso machine, go buy your own truck.
( cooler works great if your going to be home every week and during said wk. But wks away from home and I would like to heat something up
I suggest you save your money and buy your own truck. That way you can do whatever you want with it. You can get your own authority and take any animal with you that you want. When you work for a company it is not up to you to dictate to them how to run their business. A truck is a place of business and is no place for pets. There are a number of reasons why people need to keep their pets out of a truck, but the bottom line is that when you drive someone else's truck or lease to a carrier you either follow their rules or go find something else to do. Some states are looking at restricting idling even when pets are in the truck. I think that if you need to take a pet with you that you are not ready for the independence of the road. You should stay at home with your pet and find a job you can do where you can be home every day to take care of your animal. It is not fair for the animal to be couped up in a truck 24/7. It isn't fair for the employer to have do deal with the aftermath of having a pet living in their truck. As someone new to this industry you will find that carriers are not so willing to bow to an inexperienced driver's demands. Most companies will lay out their rules in the beginning. I don't think you will find ANY carrier's who are willing to accept rules or demands from new employees.
Rookie
I'd be hard pressed to think of any employer, of any kind that would accept demands short of some perks for a big $$$$ executive gig.
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BOT:
I don't see the big deal.
All you have to do is your homework and find a good fit.
Keep moving on till you find the right one.
I'm with a carrier that lets me have:
An inverter (installed by our shop), an APU (on most of the trucks), pets and most importantly to me, no driver trainer when starting out.
Newbies sink or swim.
If I had been trapped in a truck for weeks with a DT, he would have committed suicide.
Whether he wanted to or not.
That would have been my story and I'd have stuck to it.
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Twilight Flyer:
The excuse that an inverter will start a fire is weak.
Many trucks have a wabesco heater and they are a much bigger fire hazard.
Of course the heater saves the company lots of fuel over idling, whereas a driver that drops dead early from clogged arteries after eating a lifetime of fast food never collects a pension.
And who cares if it costs more to eat out when you are the one who goes home every night from the
front office?
Company bean counters have to keep their priorities straight.
Senior Board Member
All I want is to use a Qualcomm again.
I only like to keep my cell-phone for minimal use, not the life-line for work.
Senior Board Member
No one said a cop made 100k...learn to read !...And most cops make about 40k 1st year= plenty of money for the profession of driving around in a county vehicle handing out traffic tickets...most cops are in less danger than than the aveage truck driver making a delivery in bad area...And far less than C-store attendants ...Teachers once again not underpaid...they still get the time off you listed plus the holidays,So...MY FRIEND...teachers are not underpaid heroes.
Senior Board Member
I know this is not a Teacher Board but Big Jeep i don't know how long you have been out of school but as me being only a few years removed teachers are really UNDERPAID.. Trying to get a young man who doesn't give a damn about school to pass a simple ass test and if you can't do that you lose your job?? Trust me you do not no how much stressful a teacher job is.. Especially High School.. Elementary School teachers might get what they earn but when you get to middle school and high school teachers are way unappreciated and underpaid... Especially teachers that teach in bad city schools!! you just dont know man.. but hey if thats your opinion oh well
Administrator
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Some teachers are well paid. Most of them have a lot of down time. If you consider the time off it isn't such a bad pay check. On the other hand, I don't see how some teachers do what they do with all the things they need to deal. They are buried in paperwork, much of it to prevent them from being sued by parents of the children they are supposed to teach. We need good teachers. I think the quality of teachers would be much better if we got the government out of teaching our children. Parents also need to become more involved in the process.
Member
"I suggest you save your money and buy your own truck. That way you can do whatever you want with it. You can get your own authority and take any animal with you that you want. When you work for a company it is not up to you to dictate to them how to run their business. A truck is a place of business and is no place for pets. There are a number of reasons why people need to keep their pets out of a truck, but the bottom line is that when you drive someone else's truck or lease to a carrier you either follow their rules or go find something else to do. Some states are looking at restricting idling even when pets are in the truck. I think that if you need to take a pet with you that you are not ready for the independence of the road. You should stay at home with your pet and find a job you can do where you can be home every day to take care of your animal. It is not fair for the animal to be couped up in a truck 24/7. It isn't fair for the employer to have do deal with the aftermath of having a pet living in their truck. As someone new to this industry you will find that carriers are not so willing to bow to an inexperienced driver's demands. Most companies will lay out their rules in the beginning. I don't think you will find ANY carrier's who are willing to accept rules or demands from new employees."
I didnt say I have a pet I said some ppl did it to get around the dumb laws/rules. I take it you have had a bad exp with pets in your trucks
The rest still stands tho, what alt. is there to idling? Why are companys/ owner ops putting APUs on their trucks? cause it saves them money and pays for itself in about a yr. I dont care if they put apu on or not thats as you say a company choice but my apu turns on everytime I turn the key
I work for a company that allows inverters
Short hauls come on man simple math 1400-1800 mi a wk x.38 532-684 a wk before taxes/med thats not worth being out here 24/7 when i can make more being home everyday. thats not to say i dont take the short stuff but I would have to have a talk with someone if it was everyday like some ppl are having to do.
I dont demand nothing but I also dont app at companys that dont fit for me. Its a give and take game just like any other job they tell you what they are willing either you can live within those guidelines or you cant but dont take a job for ex that dont allow inverters then complain when they wont let you have one.
Administrator
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The trend of late has been more toward regional or shorter runs. Some long haul still pays fairly well, but rates are down and some carriers are simply fed up with the cheap rates and states like California dictating what we can do with our own equipment. A driver should be able to be comfortable in their truck. It seems like every time we turn around California and a few other states want to thrust more ridiculous laws on us that can cost thousands of dollars with little or not return on that expenditure. Most of those laws are useless except to generate revenue for the state. Those are the reasons carriers are changing the way we do business. You either adapt to changes or go out of business. If you want to work in this industry you will need to change your way of thinking.
Member
"If you want to work in this industry you will need to change your way of thinking."
What do I have wrong?
I understand that right now the rates blow thus where the shorter hauls are making the most bang for the buck. But how long do you think a driver will stay out here for crap pay that they can do better working else where and make the same or more and not have to be away? I myself am still doing good out here but I hear about the 300mi or less runs every day.
I have almost 2yrs in jan out otr and i still rate myself as a newbie I dont know everything nor claim too but if you think my logic is flawed please explain. It wouldnt be the first time I thought I had something down only to be showed i was wrong
As for the new reg/ the land of CA laws I understand that what they are asking is stupid until ppl band together to fight back as a grp others will continue to make rules without ever understanding the our side.
Administrator
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I don't expect enough to stick together in this industry to have an impact on anything. It hasn't happened since around 1980. But the Teamsters were strong back then. The only thing that I see that will have some impact is when enough owner operators and carrier who hauling the cheap freight finally run out of credit and money. At that point we should start to see a turnaround in our rates and availability of freight.
Senior Board Member
I am already seeing some carriers that where working on very thin margins going out of business.
They could make it in good times because they could run on their lines of credit.
There is a water plant in town where all of the water is exported to one of the big chains. They don't even pay enough to run 48,000 lbs of product to cover the fuel from here to destination.
What they count on, is someone who is empty and just wants any amount of money to offset some of the cost between here and there.
One of the local companies that went out of business, was a main hauler for this company.
Who is the culprit here.
The water bottling company for low-balling the carriers?
The carriers for hauling the freight?
The superstore for trying to sell a bottle of water for $1.79 as opposed to $1.89?
Nope, none of them.
The real culprit is the consumer who will not pay what it takes to keep our industries alive and profitable.
Recently, all of the highways between Cranbrook and the coast where closed for about five days. I went into the local grocery store to get a few things just as the roads opened. There where many, many displays of the produce department that had nothing in them.
I wanted to stand on top of the orange boxes and yell, "See, this is what happens when trucks don't move!" I didn't, but i did tell the produce manager, who I know, that it did my heart good to see it.
I am buying a couple of chairs and a table for my deck, Adirondacks to be precise. I see them down at the local hardware store for about $400. I am going to get them from a guy in Calgary and the total cost is over $700. Almost twice as much. But they are made locally by locals.
We need to shop as local as we can and stop worrying about the pennies we save. All that is doing is exporting jobs.
Administrator
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There was a time in this country when we bought quality rather than price. Furniture was made from real wood rather than particle board or plastic. We still have furniture in our family that dates back more than a century. It is still in great shape. The cheap furniture that is so prevalent in places such as Walmart will do good to last a few years. People started demanding cheap and that is exactly what is available. Textiles and other industries have moved abroad taking millions of jobs with them. The U.S. used to produce the highest quality goods in the world. That is still true in some areas. Until we once again start to demand quality over price we will continue to see our jobs from across the border.
Rookie
I quit driving OTR last July. I made the decision to quit after being laid over in Las Vegas in 100 plus degree heat after which management got on my case for idling the truck. Now I understand that fuel isn't cheap...however why should I roast in a truck because there was no freight.
I'm not a bad driver that expects something for nothing. When presented with a load I would take it if it could be run legal. If I ran into circumstances beyond my control I would let dispatch know immdiately. The only time I was late was due to weather or break down..at which time the appointment was changed or the load was reassigned..I guess technically I wasn't late. I ran legal and passed several safety department audits. I swept out the trailer after each load even if I was dropping the trailer at the yard. I can't count how many dirty trailers I picked up.
Another reason I came off the road is being laid over for 2-3 days after being on home time and told I couldn't take an extra day off even if I was out long enough on the previous trip to entitle me to that day off per company policy.
I'm not making as much money as I used to however I am happier being with my family more. If you break it down to pay per hour I probably make more now then I did on the road. Along with the paid holidays, sick time, personal time, 2 weeks paid vacation. And no I am not in a union.
So when the economy recovers and you are short of decent drivers you might think about paying a driver for what he actually does instead of just the miles.
I started OTR back in 1999.
Rookie
this was a good post.
very informative
Rookie
Driving is one of the most exciting thing to do for some but for others it's the way to earn money.There are still competitions and a person must have the best qquality and training to to be qualified as a driver.
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