Mexican drivers

[scania]

How worried should the American truck driver be about cheap Mexican drivers,I heard Celadon is seriously looking at outsourcing their drivers
Mexican Drivers
Arguments against opening the border to Mexican trucks (and drivers) includes the fear that Mexican drivers will take American jobs.
Celadon to Utilize Mexican Drives to Save Money
(Indianapolis-November 22, 2004) -- Like many Hoosier manufacturers that go outside the country looking for cheaper labor, a local trucking company is about to utilize Mexican truck drivers to save money and boost its earnings in the future.

The move could increase Celadon Trucking's profits by as much as 80 cents a share within the next two years, according to President Thomas Glaser.

Glaser said the U.S. Dept. of Transportation is about to lift regulations that have previously restricted Mexican truckers from driving farther than 20 miles into the U.S. The rule has forced truckers to switch loads coming from Mexico with Mexican drivers, to trucks driven by American drivers, adding significantly to their expenses.

Celedon just comes out and says it, we're going to use them and we're going to make money because of the cheaper labor costs. The fear that Mexican drivers will take American jobs I think is a valid fear and not just propaganda put out by the union. American drivers that now haul stuff either directly from Mexico or from just across the border to it's final destination in the US will be replaced if Celedon gets it's wish.
Trucking firms like Celadon say they will save money and operate more efficiently with the restriction gone.[/url]

[Orangetxguy]

Si` Habla espanole`????

No speekie da unglesh!!


LOL...can not wait to see all them Celadon trucks, left parked in the grungiest areas of Houston, Dallas, Atlanta, Hell A, Hoboken..which ever, et al! Door's wide open...merchandise gone...driver disappeared. :!: :!: :!:

Think Celadon stock will be worth a bunch then :?: :?: !!!!! Yea buddy..chase that share holder value, you miscreant ____ ____ ___.

[Cluggy619]

How worried should the American truck driver be about cheap Mexican drivers,I heard Celadon is seriously looking at outsourcing their drivers
Mexican Drivers
Arguments against opening the border to Mexican trucks (and drivers) includes the fear that Mexican drivers will take American jobs.
Celadon to Utilize Mexican Drives to Save Money
(Indianapolis-November 22, 2004) -- Like many Hoosier manufacturers that go outside the country looking for cheaper labor, a local trucking company is about to utilize Mexican truck drivers to save money and boost its earnings in the future.

The move could increase Celadon Trucking's profits by as much as 80 cents a share within the next two years, according to President Thomas Glaser.

Glaser said the U.S. Dept. of Transportation is about to lift regulations that have previously restricted Mexican truckers from driving farther than 20 miles into the U.S. The rule has forced truckers to switch loads coming from Mexico with Mexican drivers, to trucks driven by American drivers, adding significantly to their expenses.

Celedon just comes out and says it, we're going to use them and we're going to make money because of the cheaper labor costs. The fear that Mexican drivers will take American jobs I think is a valid fear and not just propaganda put out by the union. American drivers that now haul stuff either directly from Mexico or from just across the border to it's final destination in the US will be replaced if Celedon gets it's wish.
Trucking firms like Celadon say they will save money and operate more efficiently with the restriction gone.[/url]

Like I said in another post.....it is nice to know what companies are doing this....Any others?

[semma]

I think this is a terrible mistake by the Department of Transportation. But then again most laws and regulations nowadays cater towards large corporations.

American companies are moving manufacturing facilities to Mexico and paying peanuts to the workers there and are bringing back the parts to America to assemble somewhere in the south for a low wage.

Now these same pieces will be transported by Mexicans at a dirt cheap rate leaving the American trucker unable to compete because our cost of living doesn't even compare with a Mexican driver.

I don't know where I'm going with this post other than to say I think American truckers have a real concern here if this happens.

It's good that our government wants to do what is in the best interest of our American companies but it's not acceptable to allow these same companies to screw over the American worker.

[Orangetxguy]

BUSH.... $$$$$ 4 MORE YEARS !!! 4 MORE YEARS !!!!!


:rock: :party:

[BanditsCousin]

Read Landline from a month or two ago-

Freighliner shutting down plants in N. America...but a new plant is being built in Mexico :roll:

Reminds of a time recently when a mexican driver couldn't even order with a waitress at the Flying Hook and had to have his 10 year old boy translate it :roll:

[Cluggy619]

Well, all I have to say is this.

It's war. They have invaded our land, and now our profession. It has to stop, and the government is NOT going to do it, so it's up to us.

So do what you can to any Mexican trucking companies, and any American trucking companies who will take advantage of this to make a buck at our expence.

Or suffer the lower checks as your Mexican buddies take your pay away.

Up to you.

[Orangetxguy]

Ya know...Patton is on AMC right now..he did that " Americans love WAR" thing....We need another Patton!!!



BUSH $$$$$ 4 MORE YEARS !!!! 4 MORE YEARS !!!!

:rock: :party: :alien:

[bonzo]

wait till those drivers from across the border have to chain up. they do not even no what snow is . i wonder how many people they will kill before some one figures that out?

[ALKELE]

Before those companies can get the DOT to approve the Mexican drivers, the companies have to get the DOT to get rid of the requirement for the driver to speak and read English. Actually, they are trying to get that requirement lifted now. They are also wanting the Mexican's Mexico CDLs to be good for here in the USA.

Yes, the American companies will hire the Mexican drivers. They will cut their freight rates and put the independents and small companies out of business. It all comes back to paying the drivers as little as possible and making as big a profit as possible.

Downside: even bigger than the amount of American drivers this will put into the unemployment line is this. Imagine all these Mexican drivers (unable to read English) trying to negotiate our highways and construction zones while not being able to read the English signs. Imagine a Mexican driver, who after killing someone in an accident and runs away from the accident scene and back to Mexico, who can then go to another Mexican state and change his name and get a new CDL. Then he can get back on the American highways. Imagine the absolute slaughter of American lives on our roads.

At least the Canadians use pretty much the same system of logs, CDL licensing, the inability to just go to another state to get a new CDL when your old state revokes your CDL issued through them, the requirement to be able to read and speak English (although some of the French Canadians can be hard to understand due to accents).

These American trucking companies want these cheap labor Mexican drivers, but they had better be prepared to spend hundreds of millions of dollars settling all the wrongful death lawsuits coming from all of the accidents that will occur.

[mikey4069]

Ive got the fix for our problem . http://bestsmileys.com/shooting2/4.gif

[ALKELE]

Almost forgot.

Let's not forget that the big companies wanting this also include the companies that hire a driver with no experience, place him/her in a truck with a "trainer", have them run team operation with most of the emphasis on keeping that truck running instead of training, and after 28-30 days of "training", put that new driver on the road by himself/herself.

That is how I started driving with PAM Transport. I got out of training and thought to myself, "THAT was training?" Now, I would not of gotten hired by most companies because most companies want 1 year experience to start. And without the "training" companies, most of would be in the position of "you want a year experience, but how do I get that year unless someone hires me?"

If we cannot trust these companies to properly train the American truck drivers coming into the industry (speaking and reading English), how can we expect them to properly train Mexican truck drivers who cannot speak or read English?

[mikey4069]

i say we take them over first http://bestsmileys.com/army/10.gif http://bestsmileys.com/army/2.gif

[sweepwing]

I invite and encourage EVERYONE to call up their representatives and senators TOMORROW to tell them what you think of this issue. It is about the ONLY thing we can do at this point.

A group that is interested in this and other illegal immigration issues is www.numbersusa.com. It is free and they can fax off protest letters directly to your reps and senators. Did I remember to say that it was FREE?

[merrick4]

This is very frustrating to say the least. When you have these big companies not only pushing for this but lying as well, and when you are just a citizen with no voice really, well like I said it's frustrating.

It's funny that the American Trucking Association, the same one that has been propigating the driver shortage myth, is actually for this.

One thing I think is important to remember. Let's not blame the Mexicans. I haven't been there, but I did travel to South America once and if I had to live like that, I'd be the first one to cross the Rio Grande. The poverty I saw was amazing, yet I ended up in this neighborhood with homes like you wouldn't believe and I started asking who lives in these houses and was told the politicians.

It's not some Mexican looking for a better life doing this to us, it's the US companies and politicians.

Honestly, in spite of the fact that me losing my job to a mexican is obviously not good for me, I could understand that companies are in business to make a profit. But why lie and scheme in order to do that? Also this all needs to be done for the prosperity of all. That is if this was good for our economy as well as mexico ok, but what it seems they are doing is instead of bringing Mexico up to our standards, they are bringing us down to theirs. It should be noted that the people I was with in South America were all educated. How about a nuerosurgeon earning $400 a month. Again, why can't we bring their countries up instead of bringing us down?

Anyway this will come back to bite them in the end one way or another although this isn't any consolation to us while we look for another job.

I read an article recently, I don't remember where, that the Wall Street fat cats are complaining because a lot of companies are now choosing to list on foreign exchanges as they are cheaper and have a lot less regulatory burdens. That is they are having their jobs now outsourced and they don't like it too much. Now they want to complain.

Anyway, sorry if this is rambling, I think I have the flu. First time sick while I'm out here on the road. Hasn't been pleasant.

[Shebear]

http://www.washtimes.com/business/20070223-100828-5481r.htm

[Goin Fer It]

Merrick4

The biggest problem is that the immigration is not legal and controlled. The new immigrants are getting government handouts which cost the taxpayers and they are undercutting American jobs. They have refused to learn our language or meld which has never been done. Once we were known as a melding pot, where immigrants came and learned and became proud Americans. This is not happening at all. The loyalty is not to America and the aim of these immigrants is not to become part of this once great nation.

Sure Nana came from Germany after WWII but she and her husband learned our language and became patriotic Americans. They worked hard they did not come for free medical, food stamps, housing. They came for a better life but were willing to work hard and not burden the taxpayers by being here. And the immigrants of the past that came legally and wanted to meld into America do not like what they see happening to our country. Is it fair that they followed the rules and others that come in and break our laws are granted hand outs and amnesty?

Now I fear that with the latest kidnapping ploy for money of the 13 year old that many others are coming up from further south than Mexico. They do this very often in Costa Rica and many other countries.

By the way many in other countries south of Mexico look at Mexico as rich and would like to go there but Mexico will not allow them to work or migrate to their country. Read some of the laws in Mexico and see how their immigration and their policy is.

As far as our politicians if this was the day of our founders of this country they would either be shot or hung for sedition.

Now I have rambled and I am not sick :wink: I hope you feel better soon.

Goin Fer It's Wife

[Cluggy619]

I copied this from another post....

I know what you are saying now.

As far as celedon and the mexican national thing. I personally dont know enough about it to comment. However let me take the devils advocate side for debate purposes. Say Celedon does use mexican drivers bringing stuff across the border and delivery in the states at 13 cpm.
All in the good name of profit. Personally, I dont see that taking away from the american driver. This would be a new source of freight. Now say this happens and Celedon doesnt cut the pay of american drivers. And say the company makes record profits and the stock price goes up big time. Any Celedon driver who was smart enough to invest in the company would also benefit greatly by this. So everyone wins.
A good employee stock purchase plan at a very profitable company can end up in the long run making the driver more money than he was paid for driving a truck.

When you lower the pay of what a driver is worth, it hurts the industry. Right now, it is limited to products coming to and from Mexico. So far, with as much business we do from that boarder, all of the American drivers who use to pick up and deliver to that boarder are now out of a job.

Anybody knows what the percentage this is in relation to the US trucking industry?

And once this starts, who to say it won't continue? Expand to other companies? But who cares, right?

If your a owner/operator, you should. Once this foothold get in, you will be the first to feel the effects.

Lease/operators....bad for you too.

The last one to feel will be the company drivers, but they will soon find that the very company they spent time, driving hard, working their butts off for, is now going to lower their PAY......and it will happen, where will everyone go? Screaming to Congress? By that time, it's too late.

Right now, your thinking about Chicken Little...."the sky is falling, the sky is falling......" hehehe

I hope that soon, people will start to post how this effected them.....

Good luck to us all.....we will need it.

[Orangetxguy]

Well...Congress is whom you SHOULD be writting NOW !!!![/b] Nobody should wait to see the "effects" of this.

[NevadaJim]

Well...Congress is whom you SHOULD be writting NOW !!!![/b] Nobody should wait to see the "effects" of this.

Congress is the ones pushing this...why call them? One of the reasons for outsourcing, not just in trucking, is that we Americans are spoiled. We don't want the manual labor jobs. We want to sit in nice cumfy airconditioned offices, doing nothing, and expecting the big paycheck. We live beyond our means using credit and then blame the economy. Of course, companies are going to find the cheapest labor pool, and hire them. Everyone on this board, if running his own company of any substantial size, would do exactly the same thing, and don't deny it. Now, I don't approve of outsourcing but we have brought some of this on ourselves. We have some folks who refuse to work for low wages because our government has such lenient welfare guidelines. Jobs are there but some think they are above working for minimum wage. Easier to stand in line at the welfare office and get the handout...why work? Outsourcing is just of the prices we pay for living in such a materialistic society.

[Cluggy619]

After hours of writing on this board, I have finally come to a solution.

I'm moving to Mexico. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Goin Fer It]

Well...Congress is whom you SHOULD be writting NOW !!!![/b] Nobody should wait to see the "effects" of this.

Congress is the ones pushing this...why call them? One of the reasons for outsourcing, not just in trucking, is that we Americans are spoiled. We don't want the manual labor jobs. We want to sit in nice cumfy airconditioned offices, doing nothing, and expecting the big paycheck. We live beyond our means using credit and then blame the economy. Of course, companies are going to find the cheapest labor pool, and hire them. Everyone on this board, if running his own company of any substantial size, would do exactly the same thing, and don't deny it. Now, I don't approve of outsourcing but we have brought some of this on ourselves. We have some folks who refuse to work for low wages because our government has such lenient welfare guidelines. Jobs are there but some think they are above working for minimum wage. Easier to stand in line at the welfare office and get the handout...why work? Outsourcing is just of the prices we pay for living in such a materialistic society.

You know Jim maybe it is that way in Nevada but there are allot of kids that would be willing to work for minimum wage but no longer have the opportunity. Now if you think that a man can support himself and a family living on minimum wage ....try it and let me know how it works out.

As far as the welfare line that is exactly what the wives of these people who are taking the low labor jobs are doing and claiming their umpteen children. I once saw with my own eyes years ago in a check cashing place in Canoga Park California a woman sent her entire welfare check to Mexico. Free housing....free medical...welfare and a husband to work under the table hey they are doing a heck of allot better than many young Americans. Please do not tell me you have not seen them with their food stamps in Nevada...I know better.

Goin Fer It's Wife

[Fozzy]

Well...Congress is whom you SHOULD be writting NOW !!!![/b] Nobody should wait to see the "effects" of this.

Congress is the ones pushing this...why call them? One of the reasons for outsourcing, not just in trucking, is that we Americans are spoiled. We don't want the manual labor jobs. We want to sit in nice cumfy airconditioned offices, doing nothing, and expecting the big paycheck. We live beyond our means using credit and then blame the economy. Of course, companies are going to find the cheapest labor pool, and hire them. Everyone on this board, if running his own company of any substantial size, would do exactly the same thing, and don't deny it. Now, I don't approve of outsourcing but we have brought some of this on ourselves. We have some folks who refuse to work for low wages because our government has such lenient welfare guidelines. Jobs are there but some think they are above working for minimum wage. Easier to stand in line at the welfare office and get the handout...why work? Outsourcing is just of the prices we pay for living in such a materialistic society.

You know Jim maybe it is that way in Nevada but there are allot of kids that would be willing to work for minimum wage but no longer have the opportunity. Now if you think that a man can support himself and a family living on minimum wage ....try it and let me know how it works out.

As far as the welfare line that is exactly what the wives of these people who are taking the low labor jobs are doing and claiming their umpteen children. I once saw with my own eyes years ago in a check cashing place in Canoga Park California a woman sent her entire welfare check to Mexico. Free housing....free medical...welfare and a husband to work under the table hey they are doing a heck of allot better than many young Americans. Please do not tell me you have not seen them with their food stamps in Nevada...I know better.

Goin Fer It's Wife

I think you're completely full of it....

[NevadaJim]

Well...Congress is whom you SHOULD be writting NOW !!!![/b] Nobody should wait to see the "effects" of this.

Congress is the ones pushing this...why call them? One of the reasons for outsourcing, not just in trucking, is that we Americans are spoiled. We don't want the manual labor jobs. We want to sit in nice cumfy airconditioned offices, doing nothing, and expecting the big paycheck. We live beyond our means using credit and then blame the economy. Of course, companies are going to find the cheapest labor pool, and hire them. Everyone on this board, if running his own company of any substantial size, would do exactly the same thing, and don't deny it. Now, I don't approve of outsourcing but we have brought some of this on ourselves. We have some folks who refuse to work for low wages because our government has such lenient welfare guidelines. Jobs are there but some think they are above working for minimum wage. Easier to stand in line at the welfare office and get the handout...why work? Outsourcing is just of the prices we pay for living in such a materialistic society.

You know Jim maybe it is that way in Nevada but there are allot of kids that would be willing to work for minimum wage but no longer have the opportunity. Now if you think that a man can support himself and a family living on minimum wage ....try it and let me know how it works out.

As far as the welfare line that is exactly what the wives of these people who are taking the low labor jobs are doing and claiming their umpteen children. I once saw with my own eyes years ago in a check cashing place in Canoga Park California a woman sent her entire welfare check to Mexico. Free housing....free medical...welfare and a husband to work under the table hey they are doing a heck of allot better than many young Americans. Please do not tell me you have not seen them with their food stamps in Nevada...I know better.

Goin Fer It's Wife

You can put a hundred different spins on the problem to make it seem however you want. But, the fact still remains that we have systems in place that make it more profitable for some folks to NOT work. That is undeniable. When a big majority of the unemployed refuse to work for minimum wage how do these jobs get done? The companies look elsewhere for its labor pool. Of course, they are doing this for profit as well. There is little loyalty and patriotism left in this country. The materialistic mindset is all about money. Now, couple that with the fact that we have a government that enables people to not work and this is one result. The business world is not just in the US, it's international. People seem to overlook this fact. I guess my point is it's not just about Mexicans driving trucks. The problem goes much deeper and has been ignored by politicians for decades. None of this should be a big surprise to anyone.

[OK]

I guess my point is it's not just about Mexicans driving trucks. The problem goes much deeper and has been ignored by politicians for decades. None of this should be a big surprise to anyone.

Well you might be right about that this problem goes much deeper. However, much IS about Mexicans Driving Trucks in America. My company and many others have full inte tions of replacing 70% of the American driver workforce with Mexicans! Think I'm guessing? Read this article it will open everyone's eyes: Page 8.

http://tombstonetumbleweed.com/PDF_Archives/TumbleSep0105.pdf

And just because we have a global economy doesn't mean drivers (or anyone else) should have to compete with labor IN THIS COUNTRY from all over the world!

Remember it is AGINST THE LAW for foreignors to work in the US unless the job has been properly advertised and no American applied. Then and only then can the Foreignor apply for a H1B Visa. And if you think truck driving is a job Americans refuse to do you might want to mention that to the 300,000 Americans that call Driving their livelehood!

Driver Shortage, gotta have Mexicans because there is a driver shortage? HAH! Any industry that has 138% turnover rate has NO DRIVER SHORTAGE but an unwilliness to pay an appropiate wage. And that IS what this is all about.... the Major Carriers realized they need to pay the drivers more if they want to keep them... or... Bring in the Mexicans. They choose the Mexicans.

This NAFTA thin has got to be overturned as it relates to Mexico!

[Fozzy]

Right now there are trucking jobs that are advertised endlessly and the "Americans" dont want them. They are OTR trucking jobs. Ever hear of them?

[BanditsCousin]

Goin Fer It is right. Anyone who thinks differently is either living in a cardboard box or ignorant, because its happening right in front of me in Chicago. they pile 20 people in a 3 bedroom house, to the point where chicago PD does random house checks.

20 BILLINOIN dollars got sent over the border last year 9forgot where I got that quote from) all of American money. Now, if they kept the money in our economy, it would be all good.

$20 Billion is 25% of the funds congress had to generate a while back to fund Iraq ($80 billion).

If you want to come here, do it legally. Whats so hard about it?

[Fozzy]

After they get soaked for the taxes that they pay working in these jobs, it's really none of anyone's business where they send the money. Should we be worried about where everyone else spends their money? The great story of the "illegal alien" sending her whole welfare check to mexico is also laughable and of course completely bigoted. The person who sent THEIR check to Mexico may in fact be an American. Of course that really doesnt matter to some busy body with an agenda now does it? We have allowed too many Good ole American leeches spend how much on boob jobs, Big Screen TV's and lap dances that I at least think its a bit refreshing that the money sent to mexico was probably a bit more well spend than the FEMA cash was.

[RoadKing2525]

The great story of the "illegal alien" sending her whole welfare check to mexico is also laughable and of course completely bigoted.

Isn't this just typical Mexican hatred? Anytime any AMERICAN says anything about Mexicans taking their jobs or diverting their ill gotten gain back to Mexico THEY are bigoted? I think the mirror might help this poster understand that word a little better! And I thought this thread was suppossed to refrain from childish name calling?

Mexicans have NO BUSINESS being in the United States, they need to be back in Mexico, that's why it's called Meixico cause Mexicans live there! (or are supposed too!) If they want a better Job or better life they need to EFFORT IT IN MEXICO!

It is AGAISNT THE LAW, AGAINT THE LAW, for Mexicans to be working in the US, including their Drivers, unless they acquire a specific work Visa! Of course 25 million of them broke that law and are now criminals stealing jobs from AMERICANS.

Enough is enough, these Mexican trucks WILL NOT roll on American Highways!

Repeal NAFTA NOW! (The Mexican part anyway!)

[Fozzy]

The great story of the "illegal alien" sending her whole welfare check to mexico is also laughable and of course completely bigoted.

Isn't this just typical Mexican hatred? Anytime any AMERICAN says anything about Mexicans taking their jobs or diverting their ill gotten gain back to Mexico THEY are bigoted? I think the mirror might help this poster understand that word a little better! And I thought this thread was suppossed to refrain from childish name calling?

Mexicans have NO BUSINESS being in the United States, they need to be back in Mexico, that's why it's called Meixico cause Mexicans live there! (or are supposed too!) If they want a better Job or better life they need to EFFORT IT IN MEXICO!

It is AGAISNT THE LAW, AGAINT THE LAW, for Mexicans to be working in the US, including their Drivers, unless they acquire a specific work Visa! Of course 25 million of them broke that law and are now criminals stealing jobs from AMERICANS.

Enough is enough, these Mexican trucks WILL NOT roll on American Highways!

Repeal NAFTA NOW! (The Mexican part anyway!)

Mexicans? What does an "illegal Mexican" look like? How about illegal Italians? illegal Japanese? What do illegal Kenyans look like? The problem with the "story" I was referring too was where based on looks alone, someone was deemed to be "illegal". How many people that look like "Mexicans" are and always have been just as if not more "American" than you are. The terroristic threats on this and the other threads about sabotaging Mexican based trucks is just cowardly and childish. I think any "american" convicted of sabotaging equipment of a Mexican national should be sentenced and serve their jail time in a Mexican prison...

[RoadKing2525]

The terroristic threats on this and the other threads about sabotaging Mexican based trucks is just cowardly and childish. I think any "american" convicted of sabotaging equipment of a Mexican national should be sentenced and serve their jail time in a Mexican prison...

Again, This is what I'm talking about. We have 10 of millions of illegal Mexicans in this country and many of their Decendants that HATE America. Anytime an AMERICAN complains of their criminal behaviour and their desire to overrun our country they lash out! Americans have a RIGHT to be angry at this Mexican Invasion, after all it's our country, not the Mexicans!

Mexicans have NO RIGHT and NO BUSINESS to be in America! We have 700 thousand LEGAL Immigrants coming in from all over the world every year and 2 million criminal Mexican Aliens stealing into the country EVERY YEAR! I'm all for A FEW Mexicans immigrating LEGALLY as a small part of the 700 thouand from around the world... but that's it!

As for Americans sabotaging Mexcan trucks, I would never condone such behaviour But just as our Govt. turns a blind eye to the 25 million ILLEGAL Criminal Mexican Aliens here, maybe if it happened often enough they will treat it the same way? "It's just happens to often", the FBI spoken said, "it's just too much, we can't be bothered prosecuting all these cases". What's good for the Goose is good for the Gander! <grin>

America has HAD ENOUGH of these Mexicans INVADING OUR country! They must return to their own CORRUPT Nation and EARN their own freedom and economic prosperity and stop coming into the US and stealing it from Americans! (I think I read that somewhere?) <grin>

Thee Mexican trucks WILL be stopped, they MUST be stopped, we MUST do whaterver it takes to save this nation from this Mexcan Invasion!

Say NO to NAFTA (The Mexican Part) It must be repealed!

[Fozzy]

Two different topics entirely.. The Professional Drivers from Mexican trucking companies are doing legal business here, the illegals who are living here are a completely different topic. For someone to subject anyone to sabotage and overt threats of violence upon them for simply doing their job as defined by the laws of this country is cowardly. If you don't like illegals thats fine. The conservative right seems to love them for the cheap labor and the extreme left loves them to keep their social programs alive and to build a voting base. To tamper with another driver's equipment is nothing short of evil and the shoe could be on the other foot quicker than you think. Again, if an "american" driver gets caught illegally tampering with a foreign companies equipment or causes an accident that injures or kills the driver and/ or anyone else, they should be extradited to face the crimes in that other country.

P.S. You still have yet to tell me how you specifically tell the difference in an "illegal", a national doing proper business here and a Latino who happens to be an American. Should we bar ALL Latinos from American Citizenship? Should he revoke all Latino's who look like sterotypical "Mexicans" rights to make you happy?

[Twilight Flyer]

I feel I need to say a couple things, too.

In the first place, I hate the whole NAFTA thing and the idea that Mexican trucks will be on the road in this country. I have very serious concerns regarding the direction of the country and the strength of the constitution in light of this. That said, though, regardless of how I view the whole thing, it is still the law of the land. They will be here legally, doing their jobs legally. If they break those laws, then they should be subject to whatever fines and penalites are associated with the breaking of those laws.

So, you know where I stand on things.

What is disturbing...no, extremely disturbing, is reading some posts on here from people that are against the whole thing, too, but coming off sounding like members of the KKK. I'm not kidding...some of these posts look like they could come right out of their propoganda book.

If you don't like the laws, great. If you don't want them here, that's fine. Let your vote be heard. That's the greatest tool we have against stuff like this. Vote them out.

But we've got people on here that are very clearly racist in their posts and in doing so, you undermine the legitimate arguments that you might have. Wetbacks? I mean, come on! You can't get much more racist than that. It's the equivalent of the N-word when speaking of blacks.

Then we have people on here that are advocating violence and sabotage. :shock:: When the hell did we become a terrorist organization of insurgents? You follow that route, you're no better than the insurgents in Iraq...the are doing the exact same thing you are advocating.

This board is a trucking board and the arguments about Mexican trucks being on the road are certainly legitimate and valid arguments. Be passionate about your stance, but be adult about it. And keep in mind that threats of sabotage and violence are not only against posting rules, but are against the law. Authorities take those threats seriously and can very easily track down the poster. So ask yourself a question. Do you want to go to jail for those threats and accomplish nothing? Or would you rather add to the growing voice of reason and actually maybe make a difference?

Should be an easy choice to make.

[Fozzy]

Well stated...

[Shebear]

By definition, ANY Civil War is against the law of the land.

In 1776, there was a Civil War in America, although the history books gloss over the truth that thousands of British sympathizers who lived in America were either killed or booted up to Canada.

At the same time, most of the signers of the Declaration of Independence were imprisoned, lost their property, and died before their time.

The "Revolutionary War" WAS a Civil War within the territory of the Thirteen Colonies.

We're sometimes not too good at putting ourselves into other peoples' shoes. Someone in this thread mentioned "insurgents" in Iraq.

There is a Civil War going on in Iraq. Yes, the one Cheney and Rumsfeld said would never happen a couple of years ago. I'm not sure what side we're fighting for in this Civil War. What side are we on, anyway? Maybe someone on this thread can read King George's mind - I refer to the King George who is related to the British royal family and who rules us from the White House. Not King George III of 1776. Sorry for any confusion there.

And I must add that MOST of the U.S. Presidents, both Republicans and Democrats, Whigs and Tories, from the last 200-plus years, have ALSO BEEN RELATED TO THE BRITISH ROYAL FAMILY. The documentation is available. Yes, let's give the Academy Award to Queen Liz.

Anyway, writing and calling your Congressman is a waste of time, considering these are the men and women who started outsourcing American manufacturing jobs to Mexico over 20 years ago.

I saw a documentary about all this, and it was an old documentary even then, around 1990.

There are traitors within the U.S. government who have been working for more than a generation to destroy the United States of America as a major industrial power.

Anybody ever see the 1986 TV movie entitled "AMERIKA" with Kris Kristofferson? It was one of those multi-episode extravaganzas. It was the FIRST time the word "Heartland" was used to describe America's Midwest, and it sounded really corny and over-the-top at the time.

No more. "Heartland" is one of the buzz words all over the media and advertising. Today, the public can't see how they are being made fools of.

The film "AMERIKA" shows thousands of formerly middle-class Americans standing in line at detention camps, waiting to "show their papers" and get a voucher for something to eat -- since there are no jobs for anyone any longer. It shows factories mothballed. It shows foreign troops occupying the country to keep order.

I'm sure some truckers reading this KNOW that new detention centers have been built across America and are now standing empty.
WAITING FOR US.

Trucks brought all the building materials. Drivers also know about the underground cities the lucky ones will live in if our politicians' calculations are off and the whole place ends up getting nuked. Are these drivers still around to 'fess up'? Things happen.

Sorry, I don't have the info right at hand, but I think there's a radio program about all this at 8 pm tonight (EST) on something called American Voice Radio - an interview with an independent journalist named Pamela Schuffert. She's been trying, along with many others, to get the word out for decades.

OOPS! I checked my email just now. HER SHOW TONIGHT HAS BEEN CANCELLED. Read:

SCHUFFERT RADIO INTERVIEW MYSTERIOUSLY CANCELLED OUT BY STRANGE EVENTS-
(SHOULD WE BE SURPRISED?????)-

Wonderful radio show hostess, Dr. Gianni
Hayes, was looking forward to interviewing me live on the air
tonight...UNTIL A STRANGE SERIES OF EVENTS CUT MY INTERVIEW OUT
ALTOGETHER!!! Here is my reply to Dr. Gianni Hayes:
************************************************** *******************************

Heh-heh-heh, ...I indeed smell a very well organized RAT...typical of the
FEDS in this kind of situation!

NOT TO WORRY...nothing surprises me anymore! And why should it??? I just
stumbled on some dark and obvious classified information that ENDANGERED
AMERICANS DESERVE TO KNOW, and BANG! Strings are pulled to KEEP THIS
BROADCAST OFF THE AIR!

But THEN, look what Amerika is becoming and where it is GOING!!!

Don't worry:I am fine. I just chill and move on in my work.
And of course I realize this is NOT YOUR FAULT: you are a wonderful and
brave person, Dr. Hayes.

Can't you just SMELL "covert conspiracy to keep the truth offa the air"
written ALL OVER THIS SLICK "INCONVENIENT" move on "their" part???? I am
chucklng over all this and just fine...it's not YOUR fault.

But I have a personal request.

When you reschedule me NEXT time, and I pray soon, please do me the kindness
of putting me on 2 full hours, because I have SO MUCH NEW INFORMATION FOR
YOUR LISTENERS that is very pertinent to the critical hour in which we all
live. Believe me, I am use to these strange kinds of "interruptions in
plans" in MY line of work! All is well.

Have a nice day anyhow......and don't let "them" get under your skin.
Pardon my somewhat sarcastic humor...I gotta vent now and then......"their"
antics keep me quite entertained and usually NEVER SURPRISED. But ALWAYS
WONDERING, "WHAT NEXT...???"

I have learned to suspect everything in my line of work, and to consider
NOTHING like WHAT JUST HAPPENED (TO BLOCK A BROADCAST OF THIS NATURE OF
MINE)as being "accidental" or "unexpected" or "inintentional" on "their"
part.

"Their" networks and players are far and wide and deep and reaching into
every strata of society..and who they don't have under "their" control
TODAY, can be compromised or bought or intimidated into "their" control
TOMORROW.........(sigh)

And I am NOT speaking of YOU, of course: I AM SPEAKING OF "THEM." GET ME
RE-SCHEDULED AND WE WILL HAVE A WONDERFUL TIME!

God bless, Pamela
************************************************** *****************************

From: "Gianni D Hayes" <ndhayes>
To: "'Truth 4 All'" <truth>
Subject: RE: Don't WORRY... I WILL CALL EVERY.....
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 11:38:17 -0500

Hi Pam,

I was just told of a change in plans...totally out of my control. The
station producer had to leave unexpectedly for the east coast, and all the
shows this week are being done through another studio and another producer
who does not accept call-ins. I'm so sorry. They will do a replay of one
of my shows. Can we reschedule you? I just learned this; had I known, we
would have rescheduled you yesterday.

Thanks so much for understanding.

Gianni

Text Box: Gianni DeVincent Hayes, Ph.D
- Host, radio show: Wed. 8:00-10:00pm
www.theamericanvoice.com

SO DRIVERS, MAYBE WE SHOULD ALL "STAY TUNED".

[Fozzy]

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c346/FozzyNOK/mindHat.gif

[Shebear]

FOZZY, that's a neat antenna on your head. Do you drive with that on?

Shebear..... Remember to take your tinfoil hat off when you go near a microwave.

[greg3564]

I'm sure some truckers reading this KNOW that new detention centers have been built across America and are now standing empty.
WAITING FOR US.


Shebear....the crazy house called, your padded room is ready. :roll:

I can't believe people go for this garbage. Prisons for waiting empty for us, underground cities...please!!! Get a grip on reality would you? I'm sure you think black helicopters follow you around too.

[OK]

Am so glad to have someone FINALLY! Admonish all these Posters making those hateful comments against America and Americans… Well done Twilight Flyer!



it (NAFTA) is still the law of the land. They will be here legally, doing their jobs legally. If they break those laws, then they should be subject to whatever fines and penalites are associated with the breaking of those laws.

So what your saying is... that when the Mexican drivers abandon their trucks in the US and become Illegal Aliens then ICE gets to deport them? I don't know who you know at ICE but I thought that was one of those laws we don't bother with? Oh thats right you said, "The Laws the Law"! But not really huh? I mean some we do... some we don't, depends on what day of the week it is, cloudy or sunny... that kinda thing? I wish someone would make me a list of the laws to follow and the ones NEVERMIND. I keep forgetting and get confused?



But we've got people on here that are very clearly racist in their posts and in doing so, you undermine the legitimate arguments that you might have. Wetbacks? I mean, come on! You can't get much more racist than that. It's the equivalent of the N-word when speaking of blacks.


I find it interesting that you admonish the American poster publicly that made that awful "wetback" comment but somehow failed to do the same with Mexican "Pepe" who called Americans "Gringos", a nasty racists slur. I know you know about if Flyer cause I told you about it in my PM to you. Your disappointing me? I'm sure it was just an oversight that you will remedy publicly? I'm sure you don't believe that Mexican posters making racist comments should "Get a Pass"? Nawwww?


Then we have people on here that are advocating violence and sabotage. :shock:: When the hell did we become a terrorist organization of insurgents?

I am so glad you brought that up ! You were probably talking about that Gutierrez guy that RoadKing has at the bottom of his posts? The leader of 8 million Mexicans in America, followers of La Raza and MECHA who advocates the killing of ALL Americans? I'm sure you were not thinking about the American poster talking about letting the air out of some trucks tires? Were you?

Well actually some of the provisions of NAFTA are not the law of the land... yet. Hearings are Scheduled before Congress and many will testify... some whom I know. I can tell you this, the traitorous powers that set this "scheme" in motion to undermine America have an equally powerful group that hopes to stop them!. Big things are in the works over the next two months, keep an eye on the news!

But then isn't that how Uprisings and Rebellion occur? One group is not required to obey some laws and another group is held to their strictest standards? Like maybe when American Border Patrol Agents are jailed for doing their job but Mexican drug smugglers are not? Or maybe when tens of million of illegal Mexicans are not deported for entering illegally, forging Americans I..D.’s and stealing their social security numbers, but an American presents false information at the Drivers License office and they call in the SWAT team? I also don’t condone it (really!) but sometimes when Govertment fails it's populace and many cumulative event like this occur, frustrated and oppressed peoples take matters into their own hands?

Think about this quote from Alexis de Tocqueville's "Democracy in America", 1835:

"Men are not debased by the exercise of power or by the obedience to the rule of law, but rather, by the exercise of a power they believe to be illegitimate , and obedience to laws that are usurped or oppressive"

Think about it. Things to come?

[Twilight Flyer]

You don't get it, do you? :roll: I suggest you take the blinders off and view the real world because it's not near as black and white as you think it is.

I find it interesting that you admonish the American poster publicly that made that awful "wetback" comment but somehow failed to do the same with Mexican "Pepe" who called Americans "Gringos", a nasty racists slur.

If you'll go back to my last post on the subject, the one in RED...

http://www.classadrivers.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=245236&highlight=#245236

...you'll see I encompassed BOTH sides of the coin. In addition, the poster you mentioned received a warning PM from me as well. I tolerate NO racist remarks from either side and I made that clear.

A further concern is that those people that claim to have the same concerns about NAFTA and Mexican drivers that I do, don't come off looking like a bunch of crazed lunatics, thereby clouding the message in a big way. That's happening right now and driving a big wedge between people that essentially feel the same way.

Well actually some of the provisions of NAFTA are not the law of the land... yet.

I am well aware of that and truly hope they don't pass. But I also won't hold my breath. There is a lot behind pushing this through and they have enough coporate and political muscle to make it happen. In just such a case, those of us that don't like it would do well to hold off on the straight-forward approach and work to undermine the political side by voting them out of office, starting grass roots campaigns, and getting the word out. That's how change comes about...not by slashing tires and brake lines and committing other acts of sabotage that could get innocent people killed.

I don’t condone it but sometimes when Govertment fails it's populace and many cumulative event like this occur, frustrated and oppressed peoples take matters into their own hands?

I agree that government fails the populace, usually more times than not. But if you resort to or condone random acts of violence and sabotage, then you are no better than the dirtbag insurgents in Iraq doing the very same thing for the very same reasons. They kill school children and don't bat an eye. When some disgruntled American cuts the brake lines on a Mexican truck, which in turn wipes out a school bus and kills dozens of American children, will you be as apathetic as they are? Collateral damage is acceptable, then, to make the point? I don't know about you, but I find that postively disgusting.

That aside, the bottom line is simple. There are rules on this board...there are rules/laws to this country. If you don't like them, that's not my problem. While you are on this board, you will toe the line. I don't care if you are opinionated; as a matter of fact, we welcome it. I am opinionated, too, and you will find that I probably share the majority of your opinions regarding NAFTA and the like. But I don't need to be racist or threatening to get my point across. As far as what you do regarding the law of the land, that's your province. But I can all but guarantee that there are more than a few new lurkers on this board looking at the recent racist comments and overt threats and considering legal action. Not sure that's something I would want to gamble with.

[OK]

Flyer...

I'm not sure why your raining on me Flyer... I've never even come close to making any inappropiate comments. I've always thought my posts were reasoned and calm? I am just disappointed that you chose to admonish only one side when commenting about the racists posts made here?

I have never made any comment even suggesting that vandalism was acceptable and am disappointed and feel insulted you would accuse me of such? And who said I didn't like the rules? I'm not the one making the racist comments and suggeting vandalsim! I'm just the one pointing it out as wrong? You are preaching to the choir here. You are spilling on the wrong guy?

I don't know about all your posts but I don't have anything legal to worry about with regards to racists posts or overt threats?

I'm thinking your blowin your cork at the wrong guy and might want to consider reposting to those that apply?

And I'm not sure what it is I don't get?

[Twilight Flyer]

I did admonish everybody.

Once more:

http://www.classadrivers.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=245236&highlight=#245236

And I never once indicated that you were the one posting racist comments and threats. For that matter, up until your recent post, I hadn't made comments really directed at anyone in particular, least of all you.

But my point stands. Racism and threats are not tolerated, regardless of who makes them. But if you condone them and remain apathetic to everything, then you are in the same boat in the long run.

[OK]

But my point stands. Racism and threats are not tolerated, regardless of who makes them. But if you condone them and remain apathetic to everything, then you are in the same boat in the long run.

Why tell me these things are not tolerated? I don't need that. Try posting to those that need a reminder and leave me out of it?

I condone them? What/who are you talking about? Again you might want to send that off to some other poster also?

Apathetic... me? You got the wrong guy again! I'm all about getting the news out and trying to change those policy's (and laws... NAFTA?) I disagree with and not just complain. Check my posts!

And yea , you admonished both racists posters in your red letter commentary but in your recent post above you only admonished the poster that made the WETBACK comment and didn't even mention the poster that made the GRINGOS slur? Why? Aren't BOTH equally offensive and deserving of equal condemnation?

[Fozzy]

No they are not equally offensive...

[Fozzy]

Then again, I find the word "Honkie" quite funny!

[OK]

You know this is really not a topic I am usually interested in wasting alot of time on, but...





...you'll see I encompassed BOTH sides of the coin. In addition, the poster you mentioned received a warning PM from me as well. I tolerate NO racist remarks from either side and I made that clear.




No they are not equally offensive...

Then again, I find the word "Honkie" quite funny!



It looks like someone didn't get that memo Flyer? So how does it work here...? Remember Orwells "Animal Farm?? "All animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others"?

Surely we don't ban long time members just for a few hatefull racist comments.... do we?

WOW What a forum!

[Fozzy]

I think you may need to drag that gigantic wad of panties out of your crack..