Mubarak in "de Nile!"

[golfhobo]

Wow! Things are changing FAST around our little empire!

No links.... I'm sure you've all seen footage or heard about it.

I think it will be a GOOD thing. And they will have free and "monitored" elections in Sep. No chance in Hades that the Islamic faction (Muslim Brotherhood?) would WIN a free election there.

I might even allow his son... the heir apparent... to be on the ballot! [But NOT the father/current president.]

IF the young, educated, middle class of Egypt rises up and demands a PEACEABLE "change" to a democratic form of government, they will make me extremely proud! [and optimistic.]

IF that happens... I will expect all American citizens to give Obama a little credit for his speech there in 2009. However.... and here's the SHOCKER...

I will give Pres. George (Dubya) Bush a HUGE amount of credit!!

He made NUMEROUS speeches during his "reign" that inspired this "class" of educated MUSLIM people throughout the MidEast and the World to aspire to this level of personal freedom!

And although I still (and forever will) disagree with him about the necessity, wisdom and COST of his "War on Terrorism" ... and especially his "foray" into IRAQ....

I feel that, today... in this situation in Egypt.... it POSSIBLY bears fruit.

I honestly believe that the people demonstrating in Egypt are demanding something they've always HEARD about, but have only recently SEEN in the STRUGGLING "democracy" we imposed on their neighbor Iraq.

Bush DID believe strongly, and often tout/predict, that a "regime change" in Iraq and the "example" of an Arabic - MUSLIM "democracy" would create political CHANGE in the region. I believe he MAY turn out to be right on that one.

Hehe... I bet SOME of you never thought you'd hear me say THAT!

Those who pray... please do so. And those who don't... please cross your fingers, toes, legs, arms and whatever ELSE you "commie pinko liberals" DO.... that this turns out as well as I BELIEVE it will!

I'm sure somewhere Sarah Palin is thinking.... WTF????

But, I think Bush is smiling.

Hobo

[Mr. Ford95]

Not to mention the folks in Yemen are also apparently starting to rise up after seeing Egypt follow suit with Tunisia. Imagine the former Tunisia leader's thoughts right now, he scurried to Egypt for safety and now Egypt is out of control. Having Egypt rise up like this in that region is very good if they become more of a democracy. They are a regional power over there.

[golfhobo]

Mr. Ford said:

Not to mention the folks in Yemen are also apparently starting to rise up after seeing Egypt follow suit with Tunisia.

I don't know much ABOUT the government in Yemen. I HAVE heard rumblings of a revolution there but haven't seen anything on the news. They are somewhat helping us in the "war on terror," but... not sure how much I trust them.

Imagine the former Tunisia leader's thoughts right now, he scurried to Egypt for safety and now Egypt is out of control.

Too funny. I didn't KNOW that is where he fled to!

Having Egypt rise up like this in that region is very good if they become more of a democracy.

Well, that was the thought behind my post, but.... let's be careful what we wish for! Democracy can be a dangerous weapon in the hands of an uneducated, religiously controlled, and oppressed people. The birth of America is a prime example!

Although I don't believe the 1/3rd of the country that is "influenced" by the Muslim Brotherhood would gain total power, they WILL end up with recognized seats of representation for "their" people.

90% of the population is Muslim. Will 51% want to maintain the peace with Israel? [I believe so.] What will they do about the fillibuster?

Can you IMAGINE the massive "redistribution of wealth" from the Mubarak "kingdom" to the "entitlement" society that currently lives below the "new" legislated poverty level?

Wait.... is that "socialist?" or democratic policy?

They are a regional power over there.

They certainly ARE! Armed almost entirely with U.S. Weapons Systems. EQUAL to the Israeli systems that we ALSO sold THEM! And the Saudis! No WONDER the Iranians are nervous!

[Mr. Ford95]

Yes, I read a report the other day, might have been on Yahoo UK that was talking about unrest in Yemen growing after seeing how Tunisian and now Egyptian revolutions were going. I'm with you on Yemen, I'd rather nothing happen there. The current leadership is very keen on keeping us happy and playing ball, we have them by the balls basically after the Cole attack and other incidents within their country against US interests. They have no choice but to work with us, look who is to their North and West, The Saudi's and Oman. Both work very closely with the US so Yemen is on their own if they try to work against us. The people want a change though, rebels in the North and al-Qaida factions popping up everywhere are apparently fueling the unrest.

In Egypt the people are fed up with what they call complete corruption and want change. I don't think we see a true democracy like we have tried to place in Iraq and Afghan. The people are very happy if the military taker over the whole country due to their goodwill over the years.

[Midnight Flyer]

I'll just be glad when that mess is over with as my daughter's father-in-law in Texas works in Egypt on oil rigs. Talked to her today and she said he and his crew is being moved to a military base where they think they'll be evacuated tomorrow (Monday). I sure hope so as Tommy is one helluva good guy and we don't want anything to happen to him. They live near Austin, Texas and I'll be glad when he's back in the Lone Star State. He's also the man responsible for making me a Texas Longhorns fan so HOOK 'EM HORNS!!

[GMAN]

OK. Who kidnapped hobo? I know this poster can't be hobo. He is giving GW credit for something positive. Nope, it can't be our hobo. Who are you and what have you done with hobo?

[GMAN]

I'll just be glad when that mess is over with as my daughter's father-in-law in Texas works in Egypt on oil rigs. Talked to her today and she said he and his crew is being moved to a military base where they think they'll be evacuated tomorrow (Monday). I sure hope so as Tommy is one helluva good guy and we don't want anything to happen to him. They live near Austin, Texas and I'll be glad when he's back in the Lone Star State. He's also the man responsible for making me a Texas Longhorns fan so HOOK 'EM HORNS!!

I am sorry to hear that your daughter's father in law was caught in this situation. It sounds like he is being protected. I am sure that he will be fine. Let us know when you hear that he is safe.

[Southron]

Carter presided over the loss of Iran to radical terrorists and then he lost us the Panama Canal. Obama is presiding over the loss of Egypt to radical terrorists and will loose us the Suez Canal. Will Obama be 3 for 3 and usher in the next Ronald Reagan? One and done!

[golfhobo]

Carter presided over the loss of Iran to radical terrorists and then he lost us the Panama Canal. Obama is presiding over the loss of Egypt to radical terrorists and will loose us the Suez Canal. Will Obama be 3 for 3 and usher in the next Ronald Reagan? One and done!

In an attempt to keep the 'new' Hobo available for discussion, I will not respond in the manner I would LIKE to. However....

Carter didn't "preside over" the Iranian revolution. He had the unfortunate duty of BEING president when the Iranian people had had enough of the brutal dictatorship and corruption of the Shah (that EARLIER American administrations had propped up and supported for decades.)

He did not "LOSE" the Panama Canal. The 99 year lease ran out UNDER his watch, and he honored the treaty under which we had built and operated the canal in a foreign country. Would you have preferred that we reneged on said treaty and went to WAR over it? We still use it every day. It was not "lost."

[As I am typing this, I am seeing the "discussion" on FoxNews that is the BASIS of your ridiculous claims. Word for word.... right off the FoxNews channel! You have proven the point I've been trying to make for months/years now!]

Back to the discussion:

WE are not "losing" Egypt! We don't OWN Egypt!

Obama is "presiding" over America DURING the predominantly PEACEFUL transition of Egypt into a more "democratic" nation.... AS DUBYA planted the seeds for! And he is getting high marks from BOTH sides for how he is handling it. Almost NO ONE expects the outcome of this revolution to be an "Anti-American" Islamist State.

And we will not, CANNOT, "lose" the Suez Canal as we NEVER, EVER, had anything to DO WITH IT. It was a Franco-Egyptian enterprise.

You should REALLY do some google research before spouting off with the latest BIAS being spewed on FoxNews! [But, then your type NEVER do.]

And while you're at it.... look up the definitions of Gullible, Maleable, Impressionable, and Susceptible.

[golfhobo]

OK. Who kidnapped hobo? I know this poster can't be hobo. He is giving GW credit for something positive. Nope, it can't be our hobo. Who are you and what have you done with hobo?

It is indeed "I" Gman! The CENTRIST.

As I've said several times, the "me" you see on most threads is the "defense attorney" for the Democratic Party. I have started VERY FEW threads of my own here, and it seems that ONLY then can I show my true moderate nature and political views.

I don't have a laptop and 10+ hours OFF every night or you might have seen MORE of "me."

I will admit that, in the past, I have used the terms Bush, Dubya, GOP, Republicans and Conservatives pretty much "interchangeably," and that probably wasn't fair to ANY of them/you.

There were/are some things I liked about Dubya, but he was the figurehead for the administration and party that I find to be "anti-Middle Class." Since he is gone now, and the GOP continues to wage class warfare in America, it is only fitting that I be more specific in the future.

But, that doesn't mean that it wasn't "all his fault!"

[Mr. Ford95]

If anything, this could be good for us in dealing with Israel and the West Bank/Gaza mess. We have been trying to reign them in from purposely stirring up trouble there and it has not been working. Mubarak could care less in jumping into that fray but the people of Egypt want Israel to knock it off. If the people get their way, Egypt will help us in getting Israel to chill out. It could eventually leave us with an even stronger ally than Israel also even though no one should ever cross them. The Suez Canal will not be closed, you may have to pay to use it like a toll road but it will stay open. Egypt isn't dumb, they will not close it off to the rest of the world because then it does nothing for them.

[golfhobo]

Mr. Ford said:

If anything, this could be good for us in dealing with Israel and the West Bank/Gaza mess. We have been trying to reign them in from purposely stirring up trouble there and it has not been working. Mubarak could care less in jumping into that fray but the people of Egypt want Israel to knock it off. If the people get their way, Egypt will help us in getting Israel to chill out.

You are dangerously close to sounding like a Liberal here, my friend. You should know by now that opposing Israel is "Anti-American" according to the Conservative HAWKS.

From what I am hearing, the Egyptian "people," who WILL prevail in this crisis, recognize and appreciate the PEACE they have with Israel, but also support the cause of the Palestinians. A more 'democratic' administration in Egypt MIGHT be more persuasive with Israel. I hope so. I don't know exactly WHY America is so pro-Israeli, but I'm getting a bit tired of it myself!

A "two state" solution is the ONLY thing that will work as I see it. But, two states cannot occupy the SAME land without ENORMOUS changes in political thinking and influence.

I have always thought that Jordan should give up some land for the Palestinian cause. Perhaps, the NEW Egypt will. But, even THAT will never be enough! The Palestinians MUST have access to Jerusalem, but they must be "guided" into a peacefull solution by more moderate Arabic countries and cultures.

It is also extremely important, at this time, that America be seen as even-handed with all parties. Israel has its OWN problems in the region due to ancient prejudices. But, America's problems are almost ENTIRELY due to what is seen as "one-sided" support for them!

It could eventually leave us with an even stronger ally than Israel also even though no one should ever cross them.

If OBAMA gets this right.... we will have MANY more allies in the Arabic/Muslim world! The younger generation (which constitutes about 70% or more of all Arab/Muslim nations,) are just as tired of this chit as WE are! They want democratic "access" to their governance. They want economic reforms and less corruption. And Al-Quaida and their ILK are losing support by the day!

The Suez Canal will not be closed, you may have to pay to use it like a toll road but it will stay open. Egypt isn't dumb, they will not close it off to the rest of the world because then it does nothing for them.

I'm pretty sure we've ALWAYS had to pay to use it.... as has every OTHER country in the world. Interestingly, the Israeli's have now ALLOWED the Egyptian military to move forces into the Sinai penninsula for the first time since it was demilitarized after the 67 war. They WANT the Egyptian military to maintain civil control over the area, AND to prevent a radicalization of the border tunnels and such. [And to keep the Suez Canal open.]

Wow.... co-operation between the Jews and the Arabs already!

I think this is an exciting moment in World affairs. I remain optimistic. I KNOW the tinder is dry and the spark is bright. But, I have always loved a bonfire! I truly believe that the flame will burn bright but UNDER CONTROL. Not necessarily under OUR control.... but, under the control of educated and rational minds.

I could be wrong, but I believe this is the most ANTI-apocalyptic event in modern world history.

[GMAN]

With the exception of some looters and vandals, this does seem to be a more civil demonstration than some in the past in other countries. I hope it stays civil. It would be a shame to have a civil war in Egypt. Unless the military starts using force, it is likely to stay civil. It doesn't look good for Mubarak. The way it seems, he is on the way out. I hope that the Muslims don't get a strong foothold in their politics. They are likely to be a strong force. It would be much better for Egypt and the rest of the world if the new regime were secular.

[Southron]

In an attempt to keep the 'new' Hobo available for discussion, I will not respond in the manner I would LIKE to. However....

Carter didn't "preside over" the Iranian revolution. He had the unfortunate duty of BEING president when the Iranian people had had enough of the brutal dictatorship and corruption of the Shah (that EARLIER American administrations had propped up and supported for decades.)

He did not "LOSE" the Panama Canal. The 99 year lease ran out UNDER his watch, and he honored the treaty under which we had built and operated the canal in a foreign country. Would you have preferred that we reneged on said treaty and went to WAR over it? We still use it every day. It was not "lost."

[As I am typing this, I am seeing the "discussion" on FoxNews that is the BASIS of your ridiculous claims. Word for word.... right off the FoxNews channel! You have proven the point I've been trying to make for months/years now!]

Back to the discussion:

WE are not "losing" Egypt! We don't OWN Egypt!

Obama is "presiding" over America DURING the predominantly PEACEFUL transition of Egypt into a more "democratic" nation.... AS DUBYA planted the seeds for! And he is getting high marks from BOTH sides for how he is handling it. Almost NO ONE expects the outcome of this revolution to be an "Anti-American" Islamist State.

And we will not, CANNOT, "lose" the Suez Canal as we NEVER, EVER, had anything to DO WITH IT. It was a Franco-Egyptian enterprise.

You should REALLY do some google research before spouting off with the latest BIAS being spewed on FoxNews! [But, then your type NEVER do.]

And while you're at it.... look up the definitions of Gullible, Maleable, Impressionable, and Susceptible.

I looked up those words you suggested, all the search results yielded were pictures of Democratic campaign rallies and mindless robots chanting, "Si, se puede!"

[Mr. Ford95]

I have always thought that Jordan should give up some land for the Palestinian cause.

I've been dumbfounded by that situation Hobo. Supposedly all these other Arab countries are so sympathetic to the Palestinian cause, in particular Lebanon, Syria and Jordan. They are sooooo concerned with what Israel does to them and how Israel goes about dealing with them but they won't give them some land to form their own state. I guess weapons are enough? Risk Israel taking a pot shot at you for giving them weapons is better than giving up some land and bringing peace to everyone. Real bright.

If OBAMA gets this right.... we will have MANY more allies in the Arabic/Muslim world! The younger generation (which constitutes about 70% or more of all Arab/Muslim nations,) are just as tired of this chit as WE are! They want democratic "access" to their governance. They want economic reforms and less corruption. And Al-Quaida and their ILK are losing support by the day!

He's definitely doing the right thing right now with the current situation. We are showing goodwill towards the people by getting on Murbarak's case for limiting internet and such from the people. That will go a long ways with the people of Egypt, it shows we are siding with them in a way. At the same time, if Murbarak somehow survives this revolution, we aren't being that much of rear posterior's towards him. Good political talk we have going, playing both sides of the fence nicely.

I'm pretty sure we've ALWAYS had to pay to use it.... as has every OTHER country in the world.

And that is why it will stay open. Wasn't sure myself if anyone paid to use it. They aren't going to cut off that income since it's a huge shortcut for European bound ships and vice versa.

I think this is an exciting moment in World affairs. I remain optimistic. I KNOW the tinder is dry and the spark is bright. But, I have always loved a bonfire! I truly believe that the flame will burn bright but UNDER CONTROL. Not necessarily under OUR control.... but, under the control of educated and rational minds.

This could/should be right up there with the fall of the Berlin Wall if all goes down as many think will happen. It definitely opens up a new Mid-East.

[golfhobo]

I looked up those words you suggested, all the search results yielded were pictures of Democratic campaign rallies and mindless robots chanting, "Si, se puede!"

RIGHT.... and you are now EXCUSED from any further discussions on this thread. Here's a HALL PASS. Go smoke your chit in the bathroom like you did during HISTORY class in High School.

This is My thread, and I don't tolerate ignorance very well. Nor Racism. You apparently have not ONE THING to say that I would care two chits about. And BTW.... I KNOW you are lying about looking up those words. You haven't got the B@lls to do so!

But, you CONTINUE to prove my point!

[Mr. Ford95]

Speaking of Jordan, read today on USA Today that they are having unrest there as well. The King, King Abdullah has sent his entire Cabinet packing supposedly after several peaceful protest demonstrations by the people of Jordan........seems the entire region is unstable. Something about corruption there as well, looks like a theme that the people are fed up with. Guess they want some of what the Iraqi people have now now that they've seen how it's working(granted it's not even near the level of us but it's better than what they had.) No more corruption, no more fighting?

[Southron]

You say that you don't tolerate ignorance... how about your own ignorance, such as when you started a thread after the Arizona shooting titled "Looks like we have a conservative terrorist" or something similar to that. Dude, you totally jumped the gun on that one, as did 99% of all libs out there. Before Giffords even arrived at the hospital, people like YOU were already blaming Sarah Palin, Rush Limbaugh Glenn Beck and the tea Party folks for what happened. No, Hobo... the shooter was not a conservative, in fact he had more in common with your average Bush-hating/9-11 Truther nuts, but then we just found out he was a crazy loner who had been stalking Gabrielle Giffords for years and didn't care about politics. But I haven't heard you retract your "chit" or admit that you spoke before you had all the facts. Go to the dictionary and look up the meaning to "Premature", "Unfounded", "Jumping the Gun" and "Speaking from a position of Ignorance"
We had libs on the internet posting videos proclaiming that they were relieved to hear that the shooter was a "gringo"... you're telling me that's not racist? We didn't hear from you about that! And how do you know that I'm not Hispanic? You just instantly assume that because I have conservative views that I'm white. Now, THAT is racism. If a trucker posts his favorite recipe on enchiladas, would you assume he's Mexican? Or if one of us here said we love fried chicken and watermelon, would you assume we were black? Probably so, because as a liberal, you see groups, not indiviuduals. FYI... I love enchiladas and chicken and watermelon, and my father's mother was born in Mexico!
And, no, I didn't look it up, because... frankly, I really just don't care! I know Egypt and the Suez Canal don't belong to us. The point I was originally making was that Obama is just as much a lousy president as Carter was. And yes, I know we didn't "loose" the Panama Canal, Carter gave it back to Panamanians... which was a huge mistake! Carter's weakness and ineptness played a MAJOR factor in Iran falling to radical Jihadis and if he had been re-elected, our American Hostages would have been there till 1985... or longer.
I'm guessing that you must be retired because no working trucker would have this much free time to post such long diatribes and then critique replies to his nonsense one sentence at a time. My average time here is about 10 minutes a day (except for today). My advice to you is, turn off the computer and go find something productive to do. Take your grandkids to the park or go buy a 57 Bel-Aire and start a project.

[Mr. Ford95]

Actually, Hobo didn't start that thread Southron, that was Kentla.

As for the rest, carry on.

[One]

With the exception of some looters and vandals, this does seem to be a more civil demonstration than some in the past in other countries. I hope it stays civil. It would be a shame to have a civil war in Egypt. Unless the military starts using force, it is likely to stay civil. It doesn't look good for Mubarak. The way it seems, he is on the way out. I hope that the Muslims don't get a strong foothold in their politics. They are likely to be a strong force. It would be much better for Egypt and the rest of the world if the new regime were secular.

Once again i agree with Gman. I like secular governments wether abroad or at home. We no need to be aware of the age old tactic of having secret police agitating and posing a pro- mubarak protesters and thugs supressing the media including burning down the Al-jezeera office in cairo that is to thank for the majority of the footage we have seen on our tvs. Without the media to shine a light on the situation the secret police will be able to run unchecked and we will see deathsquads :/

Carter presided over the loss of Iran to radical terrorists and then he lost us the Panama Canal. Obama is presiding over the loss of Egypt to radical terrorists and will loose us the Suez Canal. Will Obama be 3 for 3 and usher in the next Ronald Reagan? One and done!

WTF u talking about who are the radical terrorists taking over Egypt???? cry wolf a little more, will ya?!