John Murtha is gone

[Windwalker]

Twilight Flyer said and Windy, if you want to follow along, better get it TiVo’d so you can take regular bathroom breaks.

He died for our sins in place of the sacrificial lamb of the Old Testament. Again I ask you.... do WE have eternal life due to his sacrifice and the ancient Jews do NOT?

Again, I would question why you would believe that everyone that came before Christ’s death, would not be covered by his sacrifice? I find it hard to even debate that. I have supposed that anyone that at least understood Christ’s sacrifice would automatically understand that Christ died for ALL man, living at all times, both before and after the crucifixion. Perhaps that was an erroneous assumption on my part.

For what it's worth, for the record... Back when I was in school, I was taught that Christ did not just die for "our" sins, but for the sins of all mankind. The souls of those that came before him, and died before he did, went to a place called "LIMBO" and waited there for him to "free their souls" so that they could go on to Heaven. And, since Hobo, himself, has commented on how thorough the Catholic Church is in it's facts, that was Catholic Teaching. No, they did not go to Hell, but to Limbo to wait for Christ's Sacrifice.

So, now ALL Liberals cannot make logical conclusions? B.S.!! I took my statements to the point that I needed to make my point clear. And ONCE AGAIN I must tell you how TIRED I am getting of your constant condescension

I’m not the one taking offense and getting absolutely riled up. That would be you. I stand by my conclusions. By and large, Liberals take things to a point where it is most convenient for them and they will go no further. If you make a liberal and a conservative run a foot race for 10 miles, but tell them they can stop when they get tired, a liberal will do just that and claim victory because he stopped first, while a conservative will endeavor to go the full distance. Yes, it’s a broad example, but usually fits.

Ok. Ready for my take on Liberals? Ready or not, here it comes.

I've heard judges dismiss felony charges against a suspect that most certainly was guilty "because he came from a broken home".
(Obviously, a LIBERAL judge.)
We've had a number of school shootings, and I've heard people on national television state that we have to teach our children to be responsible for their own actions.
Then, within half an hour, some of those same people are out on the hiways, with their SUVs, (not designed to go over 75) doing 85 and 90 with under-inflated tires...
And, when something happens, it's Ford and Firestone's fault.
A judge in Canada, decided that a motorcyclist should get money from a trucking company's insurance "because the cyclist did not have enough insurance of his own", even though the accident was entirely the cyclist's fault.

If Jesus was a Liberal, he would have given man a way around things. That is not what he did. When you sin, you have to own up to it in order to be forgiven. You get to accept the full blame instead of passing it onto someone else.

But that is what the Liberals have done in this country. They've given us many ways of putting the blame on others so we can try to get off scot free.

A company in WI makes trailer hitches for 4-wheelers. (along with a few other things) When a guy bought a ball that was too big for the trailer, instead of exchanging it for the right one, he put it into a lathe and cut it down. When it failed, he admitted it in court, and the manufacturer still was held liable.

All the people that went "POSTAL" in the past and killed and wounded others, then killed themselves... And, who did they go after? The gun manufacturers, even though they have no control of the weapons once they leave the factory/warehouse and are delivered to the dealers.

That's Liberals, and it's one of the reasons this country is where it is today.

[golfhobo]

Perhaps it's the way that you refer to it as a 'biz' that makes it appear that you really have no understanding of it beyond an intellectual one. I don't doubt that you've heard thousands of sermons, but have you ever actually listened to one with an open mind? Or more importantly an open heart? Or do you just assume you know what they 'meant' to say?

After breaking out the FIRST part of your response from my post (which is lost when quoting for reply,) and being halfway through MY response.... I lost my post when I went to "favorites" for the reference to a book/discussion on whether it was ONE or TWO trees.

As I am short on time now.... I will just post the link and let you study it for yourself. Scroll down through the crap and then skim the preface... but read mostly the introduction and most importantly, section 1.2 about whether or not it was one or two trees.

The Eden narrative: a literary and ... - Google Books


As for your question/implication above....

Boy, it sure is hard to use "figures of speech" around here these days! But, more specifically.... My father's BUSINESS is the ministry. I have been "around" that BIZ all of my life.... and most of HIS. Furthermore.... I don't recall even telling YOU about the exact status or circumstances of my personal relationship with God.

But for the record, I often awake early on a Sunday morning to find my t.v. still on, and search the channels. I usually run across a sermon by Dr. Charles Stanley. No matter HOW hard I try.... I cannot seem to turn away from him. He is really good, and he speaks DIRECTLY to me as if he KNEW I was there. NOW.... he rarely says anything I don't already KNOW.... but, he says it with conviction and MAKES ME THINK!

But, more than that.... he (or someone) tugs at my heart! You have NO IDEA.

I will try to get back to this discussion about the two trees this weekend. For now, I apologize if Hoggie thought I was being dismissive! I didn't mean to be. I believe there is a reason why I don't recall the verse or discussion of TWO TREES, but I maintain that I've never heard of GET AND GIVE when it comes to their purpose.

[RebelDarlin]

After breaking out the FIRST part of your response from my post (which is lost when quoting for reply,) and being halfway through MY response.... I lost my post when I went to "favorites" for the reference to a book/discussion on whether it was ONE or TWO trees.

As I am short on time now.... I will just post the link and let you study it for yourself. Scroll down through the crap and then skim the preface... but read mostly the introduction and most importantly, section 1.2 about whether or not it was one or two trees.

The Eden narrative: a literary and ... - Google Books

Thank you for the link, as well as the specific instructions on what I should read.

However, I prefer to read literary/linguistic analyses in their entirety, which I did. The section you refer to (Section 1.2) is titled "One or Two trees? A Survey of Opinions". You know what they say about opinions, right?

If you read further Chapter 3.4 for example, which is titled "The Two Trees", the author addresses the above mentioned opinions. And in his conclusion states "It should be clear by now that sound principles of paradisiacal forestry require an Eden Narrative with two special trees. The idea of a one-tree narrative that was subsequently enriched to include the other tree as well is no longer tenable."

IIRC I was addressing your statement that you had never heard of there being two trees in the garden. A statement that was made in such a way (arrogant and condescending) as to imply that you couldn't possibly be wrong. But you were WRONG.

Your own link confirms the argument that there were indeed two trees. The saying "Can't see the forest for the trees" comes to mind.


As for your question/implication above....

Boy, it sure is hard to use "figures of speech" around here these days! But, more specifically.... My father's BUSINESS is the ministry. I have been "around" that BIZ all of my life.... and most of HIS. Furthermore.... I don't recall even telling YOU about the exact status or circumstances of my personal relationship with God.

IMHO your 'figure of speech' is, at the very least, disrespectful. Biz, implies a quest for profit or glory (fame) neither of which appear anywhere in your fathers ministry.
Actually you and I have had many discussions on this very subject. Whether you 'recall' them or not doesn't erase them from my mind.

But for the record, I often awake early on a Sunday morning to find my t.v. still on, and search the channels. I usually run across a sermon by Dr. Charles Stanley. No matter HOW hard I try.... I cannot seem to turn away from him. He is really good, and he speaks DIRECTLY to me as if he KNEW I was there. NOW.... he rarely says anything I don't already KNOW.... but, he says it with conviction and MAKES ME THINK!

But, more than that.... he (or someone) tugs at my heart! You have NO IDEA.


I have more than an idea, and understand more than you give me credit for. And here once again you have diagnosed your own problem. Your head won't let you follow your heart. Faith (and love) are illogical, (and often confusing) therefor you dismiss them as 'weakness' and fail to see that it takes a strong mind and a brave soul to embrace them as an integral part of the human 'condition'.

I will try to get back to this discussion about the two trees this weekend. For now, I apologize if Hoggie thought I was being dismissive! I didn't mean to be. I believe there is a reason why I don't recall the verse or discussion of TWO TREES, but I maintain that I've never heard of GET AND GIVE when it comes to their purpose.

I can't imagine what the reason could be that you don't recall one of the fundamental stories of Christianity since you have been exposed to the 'biz' your entire life.

[Orangetxguy]

Where is the Bayer?



God?




Where is the Bayer??




I have a headache now!!!!