Attention...

[Rev.Vassago]

I doubt these protesters were carrying signs that represented themselves as Nazi's. My guess is that they were calling congress Nazi's.

Ah yes. Socialist Nazis.

[Twilight Flyer]

Hey Rev, I was kinda thinking over my last post and where I said I was done for a while. I don’t want you to think I was trying to cut you off and that I was trying to get the last word in. Nothing like that at all. Just going to be some busy days ahead and admittedly when I get wrapped up into a political discussion like that, I tend to find myself getting bitter at our government and the world in general and I have to step back for a bit.

So if you want to run a point-by-point rebuttal, that’s cool…I just probably won’t get a chance for an in-depth reply for a while.

[Fredog]

What do you mean?

you stated that there are no living ex slaves or owners, the only way you could ascertain that information is to interview every living person, so I figured while you were interviewing them, you could have asked them if they were at the protest, then count how many said yes, and BINGO, you have the number

[Rev.Vassago]

a bunch of stuff

I had a huge reply all written out, but then I decided there was little point. You weren't really contradicting me, and you were more so delving into the realm of actual debate. I rarely talk about my personal political beliefs, and have no desire to start. That's one of the reasons why both sides label me as the "enemy." It takes skill to have a Democrat claim you're a Republican, and a Republican to claim you're a Democrat. Especially when it happens in the same forum (that's happened too. true story)

My ultimate goal in interjecting myself into this discussion is to shine a flashlight on the BS, and say "wait a minute! that isn't true!" Think of me like factcheck.org. I wasn't always like this. I had ideals, and things I believed to be true. Then Bush left office, and the nutjobs on the left had nothing to complain about anymore, so they disappeared into the shadows, only to be replaced by the nutjobs on the right. It made me angry to think that a group I had considered myself aligned with would resort to such levels, and with such strong ignorance. So I fought back. Sure, it's pissed people off along the way, but so be it. If it exposes the hypocrisy for what it is, then it's worth it.

Don't get me wrong; I am strongly in favor of people having personal beliefs. But I believe that if you're going to have personal beliefs, and you're going to express those to other people, you had better be damn sure you can back those beliefs up, because I'm gonna challenge them. I do the same thing with people who push Christianity. It might shock you to know that I actually support a lot of the same things Christians do. I believe that people should be allowed to pray in school if they want to. I believe if someone wants to talk about Jesus in their valedictorian speech, they should have that right. But if you're going to say "Christianity is this," then you had better be ready to stand by that belief, because I will challenge it. I guess what I'm getting at is, if someone can't stand behind what they believe, and give concrete reasons WHY they believe something to be true, then I would contend that maybe their belief in it isn't really what they think it is.

So profess your political beliefs. Profess your religious beliefs. But be prepared to support them, because I can assure you, I'll challenge them. If you're not willing to support them, then I say you really don't believe them.

[GMAN]

you stated that there are no living ex slaves or owners, the only way you could ascertain that information is to interview every living person, so I figured while you were interviewing them, you could have asked them if they were at the protest, then count how many said yes, and BINGO, you have the number

I was referring to U.S. slaves and owners. Since U.S. slaves were freed about 150 years or so ago I felt that it was a safe assumption that none were still among us. I forgot about some of the recent slave trade where some African nations or tribes have been capturing and selling other Africans into slavery. I remember seeing something about some U.S. organizations attempting to buy these people from their captors in order to set them free. Which protest are you referring? There have been many during our 200+ year history.

[Fredog]

I was referring to U.S. slaves and owners. Since U.S. slaves were freed about 150 years or so ago I felt that it was a safe assumption that none were still among us. I forgot about some of the recent slave trade where some African nations or tribes have been capturing and selling other Africans into slavery. I remember seeing something about some U.S. organizations attempting to buy these people from their captors in order to set them free. Which protest are you referring? There have been many during our 200+ year history.

I dont wanna play anymore, your attention span is even shorter than mine

[GMAN]

No, he hasn't. Congress provided federal loans with certain stipulations attached to them, just like any other lending institution would.


Not exactly. Most lenders don’t require an equity stake when they make a loan. The government has a 60% equity stake in GM. The government has a 10% equity stake in Chrysler. The government has a 36% equity stake in Citigroup. The government has a 80% equity stake in AIG.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/.../1....16217125.html -

topics.nytimes.com/top/news/business/.../citigroup.../index.html

- Bloomberg.com -

Leftlane – news, reviews, and info for the auto-industrygovernment-ownership-of-chrysler-gm.html -

genevalunch.com/.../general-motors-prepares-for-60-us-government-ownership/ -




No, he hasn't. The SEC asset guarantee program had certain stipulations attached to it, just like any other lending institution would.

See above. The government required an equity stake in these companies.

No, he doesn't. That's just ridiculous. He's trying to create a program that would offer insurance to the 47 million Americans who currently have no health insurance. That's hardly "taking over the entire health care industry."

So he says. I would like to see healthcare costs reduced. Creating another beauracracy is not the answer.

www.thehealthcareblog.com/...health_care.../a-detailed-anal.html -


No he doesn't. He is trying to end federal subsidies of private student loan lenders, which will ultimately save the taxpayers money. Is that supposed to be a bad thing?

It depends on whether he will either create or expand another government beauracracy. I think we may have been better off when we had to save and work our way through college.


GM requested assistance from the government, and agreed to the provisions set forth in the bailout. Therefore, GM gave him the right to fire the CEO. Nobody made GM take the money.

I don't believe the bailout has yet been finalized when Obama fired GM's CEO. Obama isn't qualified to evaluate any executive or business. As far as I know, he has never actually held a real job in his life. I doubt that he can even read a balance sheet. The only thing that gave him a right to fire the CEO is the government equity in GM. You are right about one thing. Nobody forced GM to take the money.




You've provided absolutely no proof of this whatsoever.

Check the references above.



Yes you do. That's why you keep harping on it.

My dad is a Christian. So is my mom. I attended Christian classes as a child. I have relatives who are Christian. Using your "duck" theory, does that make me a Christian?


You become a Christian by professing a belief in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. Do I need to reference scriptures to prove that point? It is easy to assume that if you were raised in a Christian household with parents who professed to be Christian, that you will most likely be a Christian. Not everyone who is raised in a Christian household becomes a Christian, but we tend to reflect our environment.


This stuff is so easy to disprove when you provide nothing to back it up.

Religious identification in the U.S.

76.5% (159 million) of Americans identify themselves as Christian. This is a major slide from 86.2% in 1990. Identification with Christianity has suffered a loss of 9.7 percentage points in 11 years -- about 0.9 percentage points per year. This decline is identical to that observed in Canada between 1981 and 2001. If this trend has continued, then:
at the present time (2007-MAY), only 71% of American adults consider themselves Christians
The percentage will dip below 70% in 2008
By about the year 2042, non-Christians will outnumber the Christians in the U.S.

Any questions?


There has been a decline of Christianity in recent years in the U.S. It is really sad that so many people have lost their faith.



I suppose that's why he's trying to negotiate peace between the Israelis and the Palestinians. Because he's turned his back on them.

He is embracing the Palestinians and turning his back on Israel. If you have missed the news I will see if I can come up with some references for you.



No you didn't. You said he was like Hitler, and then said if we wanted to know how, we should look it up.



Hell - I'd settle for you providing a link to a tenth of the claims you make.

Have I reached my tenth yet?



Making a claim, especially a ridiculous one, then expecting others to do your research to prove it is a cop out. If that's the standard, I can make any sort of ridiculous claim that I want, and then expect you to prove or disprove it. The burden of proof is ALWAYS on the person making the claim. Do your own research into your claims. I've already done my research in rebuffing them prior to you providing a shred of evidence to support them (which you have yet to do). The fact of the matter is, I have provided evidence to support virtually all of my statements, and you've provided nothing other than rumors, talking points, and conspiracy theories.

So why not actually back up your statements instead of continually repeating them in your attempts to wiggle around having to prove them? It isn't that hard to do, and it only serves to strengthen your argument. I'm challenging you to put me in my place. PROVE ME WRONG. I'M BEGGING YOU. The longer you fight this, the more ridiculous you end up looking in the discussion. I don't want to make you look ridiculous. But I am sick and tired of people making unsubstantiated claims about our government officials without having the common courtesy to prove them. It's a cheap shot tactic used by those who are simply looking for a reason not to like someone.

I don't see where you have disproved anything that I have stated. But enjoy your delusions.

[Rev.Vassago]

Not exactly. Most lenders don’t require an equity stake when they make a loan.

Really? If I default on my house, the bank has a 100% equity stake in it. If I default on my truck, PACCAR has a 100% equity stake in it. Basically what you're saying is that most lenders do unsecured loans. That's completely and utterly wrong.

So he says. I would like to see healthcare costs reduced. Creating another beauracracy is not the answer.

Yes - so he says. And nobody has yet proven otherwise. I'd love to see health care costs reduced too. I don't agree with how Obama is going about it. But that doesn't mean I make up silly lies about how it's "Socialized Nazi Medicine" as a result.

I don't believe the bailout has yet been finalized when Obama fired GM's CEO. Obama isn't qualified to evaluate any executive or business. As far as I know, he has never actually held a real job in his life. I doubt that he can even read a balance sheet. The only thing that gave him a right to fire the CEO is the government equity in GM. You are right about one thing. Nobody forced GM to take the money.

Ok, after doing some digging, I realized I was way off on this one. The $25 billion that the auto industry was given was done on September 30, 2008, over a month before Obama was even elected. So if you want to blame someone, blame Bush.

As far as "never having held a real job in his life," you'd be incorrect on that one too.

You become a Christian by professing a belief in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. Do I need to reference scriptures to prove that point? It is easy to assume that if you were raised in a Christian household with parents who professed to be Christian, that you will most likely be a Christian. Not everyone who is raised in a Christian household becomes a Christian, but we tend to reflect our environment.

So not everyone raised in a Christian household becomes a Christian, but because Obama was raised in an Islamic household as a child, he is a Muslim? Talk about a double standard.

There has been a decline of Christianity in recent years in the U.S. It is really sad that so many people have lost their faith.

That's not what you were saying before....

Have I reached my tenth yet?

Not even close.

I don't see where you have disproved anything that I have stated. But enjoy your delusions.

As I said, you see what you want to see, and you're flip flopping more than a fish out of water.

[GMAN]

You need to get back on your meds, Rev. Or maybe you should get off of them. It sounds like you are over medicating. Your posts sound like you are delusional. You are reading things that are not there and making up things as you go along. You deny facts even when they are presented to you. And by the way, I never mentioned Nazi's when I referred to socialized medicine. I think you have way too much time on your hands. Have you been hanging out with Michael Moore?

[Rev.Vassago]

And by the way, I never mentioned Nazi's when I referred to socialized medicine.

I figured since you were mixing conflicting ideologies, so I would too.

As far as the rest of your personal attack, I see no need to justify it with a response. Thanks for playing!

[Twilight Flyer]

Neutral corners, gentlemen.

The kids are watching. As a matter of fact, I expect to hear from their leader shortly.

[jagerbomber3.0]

This place is like my wifes Kindergarten class...."teacher, he called me a name" The persoanl attack thing on this site has just become ridiculous.....and no i dont mean the people supposedly calling names and attacking. It's an internet freaking message board for crying out loud!!!!!!!! Unless it comes down to outright racsim and bigotry...get over it and grow some skin just a little bit thicker. This personl attack thing just sounds so assinine and childish over an internet message board. It's like people that constantly pull the race card...after you do it a few to many times it just becomes ridiculous and kind of funny.Might as well just shut the thread down like so many others before. Thats the answer to everything on this whole board anymore it seems. when i first got on this board it was a really cool place,was really busy with traffic and new threads almost all the time,we had an interesting cast of characters with great stories and stuff all of the time. What do we have now? Locked down threads and warnings of personal attacks all the time.I would rather read Steve Booth talking about mad bomber hats and monkey but and listen to Kevin rattle off about closed roads than see another post with the mention of personal attacks in it. What happened to this place. It used to be a real cool message board.

[RostyC]

Wow! that was a lot of reading.......... I can't really add anything, but I agree with a lot said here by various posters. One thought did come to mind though while reading the responses and that was this.........
The moment we label ourselves or others it's a breeding ground for conflict, which can lead to hatred and eventually war, killing, slaughtering of people because they're different from you, when actually we're all the same deep down.

Think about it, it starts at a very young age, perhaps elementary school (the kid with the no name shoes....... oh my, he's poor, or the kid with a slight learning disability........ oh my, he's slow, )and continues from there as we age. (and no guys, I wasn't the kid with the no name shoes, I had Nikes......... I just couldn't spell it. ) Sorry, couldn't resist.

I try not to label myself or others. I'm neither Democrat or Republican. I'm for common sense politics. I'm not christian, jew, muslim or any other. Oh,I believe there's a higher power but I don't know what it is.......yet. I'm just Dave, if you like me great if not, then you don't hurt me and I won't hurt you.

It's easy to divide and go to war and kill one another, it's much harder to find ways to live together, and that's why the world is like it is.

Just my thoughts.

Now, let's go see if Tom and Jerry need help with the entertainment room...............

[Rev.Vassago]

This place is like my wifes Kindergarten class...."teacher, he called me a name" The persoanl attack thing on this site has just become ridiculous.....and no i dont mean the people supposedly calling names and attacking. It's an internet freaking message board for crying out loud!!!!!!!! Unless it comes down to outright racsim and bigotry...get over it and grow some skin just a little bit thicker. This personl attack thing just sounds so assinine and childish over an internet message board. It's like people that constantly pull the race card...after you do it a few to many times it just becomes ridiculous and kind of funny.Might as well just shut the thread down like so many others before. Thats the answer to everything on this whole board anymore it seems. when i first got on this board it was a really cool place,was really busy with traffic and new threads almost all the time,we had an interesting cast of characters with great stories and stuff all of the time. What do we have now? Locked down threads and warnings of personal attacks all the time.I would rather read Steve Booth talking about mad bomber hats and monkey but and listen to Kevin rattle off about closed roads than see another post with the mention of personal attacks in it. What happened to this place. It used to be a real cool message board.

personal attack. There. Just added one more post with it in just for you.

BTW, you make it sound like I care what GMAN calls me. Here's a news flash: I couldn't care less. I'm just having fun doing what I do best.

[Twilight Flyer]

and no guys, I wasn't the kid with the no name shoes, I had Nikes......... I just couldn't spell it.

Come on, admit it Dave. You were the waterhead, weren’t you.

.
.
.

On a serious note, I am well aware of what hydrocephalus is. Nasty thing to have. But Rosty opened the door for that one.

[RostyC]

Come on, admit it Dave. You were the waterhead, weren’t you.

Absolutely not..........well not quite...........oh a little I guess.........alright it was me. Man, your good TF, you got it out of me. I put up a hell of a fight though.

On a serious note, I am well aware of what hydrocephalus is.

How do you spell that?

[golfhobo]

Ok, now I have to take issue with you. Our country clearly has a penis.

When he's right, he's right! Looked at a map recently? What's that "appendage" hanging out down there in the Gulf? Residents call it "Florida."

Well.... we all KNOW what it LOOKS like.... and it surely FRUCKED us up in the 2000 election.... spawned an ILLEGITIMATE potus... (with the help of a SCOTUS)....SCREWED everything up in the Middle East for another 100 years....spends most of it's time in the "hands" of old Jews and Conservatives.... and was "manipulated" by a BUSH!!

Every couple of YEARS, it gets "blown" by a HERicane.... and spends the time inbetween MOSTLY on welfare!

But, ya gotta admit..... it has some lovely Beetches! And it knows how to PARTY!!

[golfhobo]

It is my understanding that it was the BBC who first reported about 1.7 million people. I think it is the left who would like this to go away and for the numbers to be so low. It is my understanding that this was the largest march they have ever had in Washington. I suppose you can either believe it or not. I don't know. I wasn't there counting people.

This was in response to the REV correctly questioning the figure of 1.7 million people CLAIMED to have been there by that fakir Glenn Beck. The guy who "sponsored" this rally.... but, didn't SHOW at it!

He was on FOX NEWS morning show, where even the conservative idiots who pretend to RUN the morning show, tried to back him out of his claim. But, he persisted.... claiming some "University of I don't remember the name" had done some photo analysis and come up with that number!

The PROBLEM here, GMAN..... is that YOU believe it without checking the facts! There were MORE people on the "mall" during the "Million Man March." There were 3 TIMES as many people there for both the Clinton and Obama innaugurations!

The crowd was properly estimated by those who do this for a living.... at about 70,000 people. To exagerate that by a factor of TEN... would only be 700,000 people! And to DOUBLE that fantastical exageration would ONLY get you 1.4 Million.... which is 300,000 people SHORT of the claimed 1.7 Million!

That's a "margin of error" of more than FOUR TIMES the actual number of people who attended.... JUST to make up the difference in a 200% error in counting a fictictious exageration of a factor of TEN!!

Put another way.... about 4% of the CLAIMED number of people showed up! [70k is about 4% of 1.7M ]

That puts EVERYTHING you hear on FOXNews within the 4% "margin of error" and therefore..... quite possibly worthy of being IGNORED!

YOU said something in an earlier post about how you "care" when Obama (or any President) LIES! The ONLY "proof" you can offer that he ever HAS 'lied" is based on what you hear on (apparently) the ONLY source you listen to for news! And based on the numbers I just gave you.... standing by your statements... and their sources... is the EPITOMY of "hypocrisy!"

I've SAID that I respect you, GMAN. And I want to believe that you are intelligent and educated. I can SEE that you are a common man with common sense.... and I APPRECIATE that. But, you are not giving me much to believe in lately! [I once intended a major in International Business Administration, too. I had dreams of "capitalizing" on my interest and understanding of world cultures. I studied them, and LIVED amongst them. At one time, I spoke 4 languages conversationaly.]

Some here have "labeled" me as a Liberal. They are wrong and I think MOST of them KNOW it. I am a "Centrist." I love to watch MSNBC because they expose the lies and foibles of the Conservatives who spend their time being "praised" by the ideologues on FOXNews. I ALSO enjoy many programs on FOXNews.... because they present the other side of the story...and I WANT to hear both sides of the story! I STILL believe CNN is the most "centrist" of the "big 3," but I am not so stupid that I don't see that they are somewhat biased towards Democrats (not so much LIBERALS.)

But, I have a pretty well educated, intrinsically intelligent, mind of my own. And I know B.S. when I hear it! And.... FOX is FULL OF IT!

I don't claim that Obama is the Messiah. I have serious doubts that he can effect the "change" he promised. I don't even AGREE with some of his policies (energy is highest on my list.) But, having HEARD and studied all sides to the story.... I absolutely REJECT and DESPISE the unproductive CRAP that most on "your" side are spewing, and the "obstructionist" measures they are taking, to DENY him a chance to make his mark on American history and policy!

And... IF it is not "intentional," then I PITY you and your side for being SO gullible and STOOPID as to believe all the crap you are being spoon-fed and are regurgitating!

I had THREE basic problems with Dubya:

(1) his legitimate election. (both of 'em.)
(2) his motivation and "generalship" of the war he declared on Terror.
(3) his pandering to the richest class at the expense of the middle class of America.

He was a "likable" guy. Somewhat in the vein of Reagan. I like "cowboys" and I like people who are committed to their beliefs. I believe he was a "first class" PATRIOT! Though I would, and DO, accuse him of selling out to the RICHEST class.... I would NEVER accuse him of being a Fascist, a Nazi, or the Anti-Christ.

I COULD have many debates here on HIS policies, motivations, effectiveness.... and how both Americans AND foreign nations and their leaders have had diminished views of America under his leadership, but there is no POINT as long as the majority here insist on remaining CLUELESS!

But, it is time to move on. The American people have spoken and elected Obama in a FAIR ELECTION! So far....he has continued MORE of Bush's policies than he has instituted his own! So... WHAT are you afraid of?

Nevermind.... that was a rhetorical question. I know EXACTLY what you are afraid of... and I know the SOURCE of your fear! And until you rise ABOVE your "institutionalized" fears based on racism, bigotry, and "class ideology," you CANNOT be "reasoned with" (as I said before,) and any attempt at conversation or "debate" is futile.

Although I don't want to address it here, I want you to know I was LISTENING when you showed that you were willing to put SOME of the blame on Dubya's policies, etc. I give you credit for that. That is pretty much the ONLY reason I consider it worth my time to discuss things with you.

I am NOT on this 'messageboard' to make ENEMIES. I like almost everyone here! We are ALL Truckers, and have at least THAT in common! I LOVE my country, and I LOVE the people who are citizens of it. EVEN those I disagree with. But, I do not HATE the rest of the World, either!

But, I don't know how to react to some of the LIES I hear here! I get frustrated when the volume is more than I have time to contend with. I admit that my "skin" is sometimes not THICK enough to withstand the INSULTS hurled at me for having, or expressing, my opinion! My first reaction is often to fire back with insults and degradation.... which only gets me banned! And that is NOT the way I want to BE.

But, lest ANY of you wonder, that is NO REFLECTION on my professionalism as a truck driver. I have ALWAYS been "the best" at anything I have done.... and THIS is no exception. I may not know all the mechanics of a truck that some of you know, but I am learning... and KNOW why I am learning. And I still say that I can hold my own against ANY of you when it comes to driving a truck.... ANY truck!

But, what bothers me most, is the MORAL discrimination that is rampant on this "messageboard," and as an extention... in life. I'm going a bit off track here, not addressing GMAN anymore (who has never made a moral accusation that I'm aware of...) but squarely addressing Twilight Flyer.

Those who THINK they have the "moral high ground," are as the Pharisees in the Bible. Pride goeth before a fall. Judge not, lest ye be judged.... lol! Does ANY of that ring a bell? Probably not. YOU.... who accuse me.... have absolutely NO "moral presence" that I have any reason to respect.... or that will BE respected by YOUR God. MY "morals" are NOT subject to YOUR question or appraisal.

As a Minister's son, I grew UP with "morals" and a recognition of those who espoused them. Deacons were the worst! NOT being "called by God" to be ministers, they set themselves up as "watchdogs" of those who WERE. Most of my friends who were "deacon's sons" were more OPPRESSED than I was! It was as if these men had to CONTROL their own lives, and those of their family, to be "worthy" of recognition by God. They NEEDED some level of "status" within the church and the community.

As the SON of a minister... who WAS "called by God"... I was given more freedom of expression.... more leniency for being "human." My father was "secure" in his belief and relationship with his God.... and so was "I."

[Gee, I just saw a huge "question" in that statement. Was it my FATHER who was "called by God?"...... or ME? Here's a "newsflash" for you RELIGIOUS types.... it was BOTH!]

The "morals" I was taught included TOLERANCE and acceptance. HUMILITY was a big part of it, as I recall. Though a minister "preaches" morals to those who care to listen.... he is NOT free to "moralize" against those who choose NOT to.

Okay.... I KNOW this has turned into a rant.... for which I will be severely degraded. But, I don't really care. I didn't feel like addressing 5 or 6 posts, on the specific points, when I KNOW the pertinent posters are reading THIS!

I have ALREADY spent MORE time than this board is worth, to address this situation. I DO have other things to do. I don't WANT to attack the last post in question by T/F, because I actually LIKE him.... and don't want to wage war on him. I'm glad to see him BACK. If it makes him feel IMPORTANT (though not a truck driver) to have a "respected opinion" here, who am I to question it?

The REV has taken up my "cross" and is questioning the beligerant dogmatism that many have displayed recently.... so, I am not needed anymore.

My recent inability to control my thoughts and expressions, have turned a few very important "friends" against me, and, though not an uncommon occurrence in my life, is considered a failure on my part.... a familiar one.

But, I'll get over it.

[Dejanh]

I don't understand what you are talking about? Are you talking about meetings that she attended concerning seceding from the union?

Yes i am talking about those meetings..

What would be over if Obama was questioned?

He would be done and over with if he was in a similar situation like she is..
Last time i checked she is giving speeches left and right and has a support base who still want her to be a president or active in political life...

[golfhobo]

Hey, Dejahn:

PLEASE don't take this wrong! I am a BIG fan (so far) of your posts. I have to admit, when I first saw you join in, I thought you were black. If you KNOW me, you KNOW that is not a problem.... just a statistical thing I like to know about. Your profile says you are in Charlotte, but one of your posts said "Virginia" was "down there." I'm a bit confused.

Being a linguist, by trade, I can't help but believe you are of "Slavic" decent. Is this true? If so.... where do you, or your family, come from. I'm VERY interested. You speak pretty good English, but with a Slavic "mechanics."

Your insights on America are very refreshing and IMPORTANT! Your "points" have been absolutely "spot on" without fail! I wanted to give a big to most all of your posts! Many here won't understand where you are coming from. I DO!

Like Obama, I'm offering an open hand if you don't respond with a closed fist! I'm sure you didn't MEAN to tell your life story here on CAD... but, SOME of us wouild like to hear it! This is the premier forum for new drivers in the USA. If you feel the same, we'd like to know WHY. How can we do better to serve ALL drivers who share the roads.

More importantly, I believe SOME of our drivers here are open to learning about the World outside our borders! keep talking, Bro!

And, if you EVER need a friend.... I'm just a half hour away from you! We'll get a bumper sticker or something!