July 4 - A time to mourn and weep.

[2]

No celebrations...
Not until blood runs in the streets, from a revolution to restore the Constitution of the United States of America.

The Constitution has been under attack for at least 30 years.
I saw a link to an article, over the week end, that congress was poised with legislation, to make a direct assault on the Constitution.
I failed to read it, and not long ago, I would have dismissed the idea.
The idea is very plausible, today.

Liberals have taxed and regulated many jobs off shore, so the future looks bleak.

Liberals have bankrupted this country and led employers to seek cheap labor.
Illegal aliens are given preferential treatment, while citizens are harassed all too often.

There are many stories that get brief exposure, then you hear no more.
One such was the military exercises in residential neighborhoods in Indianapolis, a few weeks ago.

I am under the impression that UN troops are here, and would have no problem shooting citizens on site, under martial law.

There are enough things going on, right now, that martial law in the USA, looks likely.

But, in all likelihood, I am completely off base...
Either way, I am without power to do much of anything about it.

So, no celebration for me, for the freedoms that we once enjoyed.

Thank a liberal.
They are the enemy within.

[BigDiesel]

Liberalism is a mental disorder....

[JeffTheTerrible]

My original response consisted of only two words. The first was "bull". I'll leave you to guess what the second one was.

I saw a link to an article, over the week end, that congress was poised with legislation, to make a direct assault on the Constitution.
I failed to read it

So let me get this straight... you saw only a link to an article, which you didn't bother to read? So you can't tell me what it said? You can't tell me what the source is, or if this source was credible in any way, whatsoever?

Liberals have taxed and regulated many jobs off shore, so the future looks bleak.

Really? Companies didn't decide to outsource the jobs on their own for the sake of increasing their profit margin? And neither side could offer them incentive not to do this?

Liberals have bankrupted this country

I was no fan of Clinton, but he actually was quite the frugal spender. Now, let's see... massive monetary loans which have essentially put this country in the pockets of China and Japan.. yep, that was the Neo-Cons. $12 billion/month on the war in Iraq... again, there's your Neo-Cons. The US Dollar falling to an all-time low in the world market?

and led employers to seek cheap labor.

Employers have historically sought out cheap labour. Look at the Chinese migrants brought in to build the first railroad across the United States.

Illegal aliens are given preferential treatment, while citizens are harassed all too often.

How many citizens are at risk of being deported? Perhaps if border security had actually taken seriously by either party, then there wouldn't be so many illegals in this country, that the government would be forced to grant amnesty.

One such was the military exercises in residential neighborhoods in Indianapolis, a few weeks ago.

So, tell me? Was this the Indiana National Guard, or the federal military? And what was the extent of these military exercises? Or was this some overzealous conspiracy theorist who freaked out at the sight of a military convoy outside of the cantonment area?

I am under the impression that UN troops are here, and would have no problem shooting citizens on site, under martial law.

Where do you get this load of crap from? Do you have any idea just how many troops it would actually require to occupy the US? Factor that in with the fact that most military forces have undergone serious cutbacks in their forces since the end of the Cold War, and you really have no plausibility behind this claim.

There are enough things going on, right now, that martial law in the USA, looks likely.

Then give examples. What's going on that makes martial law such an imminent threat? "Things" is not a very good explanation. Black helicopters? Anonymous men in black suits? Is it the Illuminati?

[Roadhog]

A trained Liberal eye will spot the new Traffic Enforcement.

[Malaki86]

That's gotta be the best photo EVER

[golfhobo]

Liberalism is a mental disorder....

JESUS was a Liberal!! So.... you think He was a NUT?? :shock:

As a good, God fearing, Moral Majoritist Neo-Con.... you have just signed your own "death warrant." See you in Hell, Pal!

JEFF: Thanks for saying almost everything I was thinking! It is a blessing to hear from a Military man, who has given more than enough for this country, some amount of defense for the Democratic ideals that are cherished mostly by the Left!

Although I agree that the Constitution is under siege..... IMHO, it is being attacked by both sides.... but more heavily from the RIGHT!

There will be no revolution in the streets of America.... a simple ELECTION will do the trick! The sooner we get Dubya out of office, the sooner our freedoms will be restored!

[Uturn2001]

Although I agree that the Constitution is under siege..... IMHO, it is being attacked by both sides...

Agree with you on that.

but more heavily from the RIGHT!

I don't agree with that part though.

IMHO it is being equally attacked by all sides just in different ways.

[Rawlco]

Liberalism is a mental disorder....

Ahh, a Savage fan. :wink:

JESUS was a Liberal!! So.... you think He was a NUT?? :shock:

As a good, God fearing, Moral Majoritist Neo-Con.... you have just signed your own "death warrant." See you in Hell, Pal!

Actually Jesus was more libertarian. He had a lot of contempt for tax collectors. He also said that the poor will always be with us, a fact the modern liberals deny. By socializing and redistributing wealth you create more poor people, not fewer. There will always be people who are poorer than others. :wink:

[golfhobo]

Although I agree that the Constitution is under siege..... IMHO, it is being attacked by both sides...

Agree with you on that.

but more heavily from the RIGHT!

I don't agree with that part though.

IMHO it is being equally attacked by all sides just in different ways.

No problem, Uturn.. We ALL have the right to disagree! But.... please give me your thoughts and rationalizations concerning...

1) The Patriot Act....vs. the 4th Ammendment.

2) The (proposed) Defense of Marriage Ammendment vs. the Separation of church and State clause (assuming it exists... and without debate about its existence.) Does this not give tax breaks to those who conform to religious beliefs concerning a "marriage" or "bond" between two people?

3) The SECOND time, both by Republican administrations, that Illegals have been or will be "amnesticized" in contradiction to the Constitutional description of an American Citizen?

4) The abuse of the "Executive Privilege" provision to thwart oversight by the Congress, a purpose delineated in the Constitution as a Right and responsibility of the Congressional branch of our 3 level form of government.

5) Tax breaks for ONLY the richest in America at a time that the same administration is putting us ALL in debt for a WAR (without debating the legality of the war.) And.... IMHO.... in direct conflict with the 14th which gives "equal protection."

6) The attempt by this administration to hold "illegal combattants" in foreign countries for no other reason than to skirt both the Habeus Corpus law in the Constitution AND the Geneva Convention so that they can be tortured into providing information, while denying that we engage in torture! (An act that has now been struck down by the Supremes.)

7) ANY.... attack on the Constitution by the Democrats! (with the possible exception of the 2nd Ammendment debate, which has been discussed elsewhere, and I suppose.... has been "decided." But, you CAN mention this if that's ALL you have!

I am REALLY interested to hear your case that the LEFT is assaulting the Constitution... and in what way.

Please be specific and include cases or references to the Laws of the land.

I look forward to your response, as I have always respected you and your opinions.

[Colin]

That's gotta be the best photoSHOP EVER

Fixed for you... :P

[golfhobo]

Liberalism is a mental disorder....

Ahh, a Savage fan. :wink:

JESUS was a Liberal!! So.... you think He was a NUT?? :shock:

As a good, God fearing, Moral Majoritist Neo-Con.... you have just signed your own "death warrant." See you in Hell, Pal!

Actually Jesus was more libertarian. He had a lot of contempt for tax collectors. He also said that the poor will always be with us, a fact the modern liberals deny. By socializing and redistributing wealth you create more poor people, not fewer. There will always be people who are poorer than others. :wink:

My apologies for not "catching" a phrase used my Savage. I am AWARE of him, but can't say I've listened to him. At any rate, Dig D knows I am just "testing" him and having a bit of fun!

As for Jesus being a LIBERTARIAN..... I don't think so. I admit that I am not fully resourced in their platform, but.... Jesus did NOT have a contempt for tax collectors. Witness his saying, "render unto Caesar, that wihich IS Caesars." I think you are confusing the parable of him chasing the "money changers" out of the temple. He most certainly had a disdain for those who would use RELIGION as a reason to control or rip off the average man!

Jesus was ALL ABOUT helping the poor. Compassion for the suffering. I can't, and won't , say that he proposed "redistribution of wealth" other than he taught that those who HAD more than they needed should help those who DIDN'T. But, he DID so as a lesson that GIVING is more rewarding than HORDING. And BOTH would prosper spiritually, if not financially.

Yes, there will always be people who are poorer BY CONTRAST to those who are richer. But, that doesn't mean there has to be people who live below the poverty line in the RICHEST country in the World.

There is no doubt that "the poor" will always be with us. But Jesus taught compassion and even dispensation for them. Neither Jesus NOR I preach "redistribution" of wealth as the answer. Neither of us are/were Socialistic. But, Jesus taught that "giving" is better than "receiving," and that helping our fellow man is the mark of the "good" in a man, regardless of his politics. (RE: The good Samaritan.)

Jesus also said that "it will be harder for a rich man to enter heaven than for a camel to go through the eye of a needle." What did this mean? It meant that those who HAVE more are MORE "self absorbed" and less likely to exhibit Christian principles of helping others. It is the self PRIDE of the rich, and their disdain for the REST of God's creation, that makes it harder for them to enter heaven. He might as well have labeled them Conservatives!

Now, I realize that MANY Conservatives give to charities. I thank you for this! But, many do so only for the tax break, and others out of guilt. There are only a FEW that have gotten national coverage for their extraordinary benevolence.... and to me.... they are to be BLESSED!

The majority of Conservatives.... "conserve!" Look it up.... it means they HORDE! They have more than they will EVER need, yet they want more! And the worst part is their attitude towards those who have NOT!

I'm not advocating that the rich in America must "bail out" the poor. I'm just saying that the administration / government should not give the RICH tax breaks to help them horde MORE, while there are Americans who can't rise ABOVE the poverty level. Poverty in this land costs ALL of us much! Why wouldn't we want to at least TRY to alleviate or mediate it?

I DO know ONE thing.... throughout ALL the New Testament.... the so-called "blog" of Jesus's life.... he NEVER disparaged the poor for BEING poor! And yet, everytime I log on to this site, I see someone doing JUST THAT!

Bill O'Reilly says he thinks the "liberals" want his money! I don't want HIS money! I just don't want him to get tax breaks that give him MORE money than he needs, when there are Americans who need help!

The highest percentage of poor in America are in the Black demographic. Yet, they are often denied jobs because of prejudice. Next level up is the Blue Collar worker, who is losing his jobs to overseas workers because it means MORE profits for the rich company owners, and those who have money to invest in them. If THIS is not a case of "class warfare" I don't know WHAT in the history of the World is a better one!

No, I don't think Jesus was a Libertarian. And I'm SURE he wasn't a Conservative! Jesus is the embodiment of the Liberal mindset! No doubt about it in MY mind! And it totally baffles me that those who "claim" him as their "platform" have NO idea what he stood for!

Remember.... it was the richest and most powerful of the JEWS who insisted that he be "crucified" because he threatened THEIR way of life! HE was the first and ONLY "defender of the faith" and he was MURDERED for it! :shock:

Was Jesus the son of God? I don't know! Maybe, he was no more than the prophet that the Muslims consider him to have been. But, he was a WISE MAN nonetheless. And he DEFINITELY taught "Liberal" politics!

So.... if you Conservatives want to use him.... and GOD.... as your banner, you might want to actually READ the Bible and understand what he was about! Perhaps, THEN you will understand how SILLY you sound to those of us who HAVE!

Disclaimer: My use of YOU is collective and has no intended reflection on any poster of this board! IF the shoe FITS.... that is YOUR problem. And was NOT my intention!

[BigDiesel]

It is shocking that a topic like this would bring out the kool ade drinking resident liberal.....

[golfhobo]

It is shocking that a topic like this would bring out the kool ade drinking resident liberal.....

Don't know if you are refering to ME or Colin, but it doesn't matter. This topic would bring out ANY liberal who gets tired of being talked "down to" by conservatives who don't know their Azz from a hole in the ground!

I NOTE that your response had NOTHING of substance to it.... just MORE playground Bully mentality!

Why don't you try debating the issues for once? Oh, that's right.... you're a Conservative and therefore CAN'T debate the TRUTH! :shock:

[BigDiesel]

Oh, that's right.... you're a Conservative and therefore CAN'T debate the TRUTH! :shock:

and what " truth " would that be ??? Is that the same so called " truth " the liberals slant to their brainwashed minds....

The liberals are simply destroying this great country of ours..... It is sad.

The libs are so entranced by Obamas speeches that they cannot see the forest thru the trees.....

[JeffTheTerrible]

JEFF: Thanks for saying almost everything I was thinking! It is a blessing to hear from a Military man, who has given more than enough for this country, some amount of defense for the Democratic ideals that are cherished mostly by the Left!

Thanks for the kind words, but don't be so quick to assume that I'm taking my place in the liberal campground. At present, I really don't see any political party here which I feel that I identify with in any way, and I'd probably be identified more as a Right leaning sort than a Left leaning sort, but I certainly don't find any affinity with these Neo-Con types.

Although I agree that the Constitution is under siege..... IMHO, it is being attacked by both sides.... but more heavily from the RIGHT!

I wouldn't lump the entire right in with the Neo-Cons, just as I wouldn't lump the entire Left (American Left.. you really don't have a true Left Wing) in with the Hillary/Obama/Kennedy fanatics.
That aside, the biggest problem, the way I see it, is that both sides are more concerned with finger pointing and flinging accusations about, rather than trying to find any sort of solution to the problem. Why does every political discussion degenerate into, "Well, it was XXXXX's fault, and YYYYYY had the problem dumped on him/her", rather than trying to come up with some sort of solution to the problem?
It may be acceptable among those who aren't 'in the system' themselves, but this is what I see among the elected representatives. Certainly they weren't elected simply to piss and moan about things, while sitting with their thumbs up their rectums? Or maybe it's gotten to a point where the voting public is in submission and no longer expects anything more from them?
That's the ills of having two parties dominate the entire system. If you find yourself poorly represented by both parties, your only real choice is to accept what you perceive as the lesser evil, and go with that. If any third party candidate does make it into the polls, they can only act as a spoiler.
That being said, I'd still like to see some attempt by the thread starter to answer some of the questions which have been raised in this thread.

[2]

roadhog, what's the odds that chopper ain't got no tail rotor?

BigDiesel,
I'm afraid that you are not entirely correct.
It seems that liberalism is worse than a mental disorder.

Through greed and the lust for power, these people thinking themselves wise, they become as fools.

And, liberals consistently attempt to violate the laws of nature, at our expense. That is God's laws, and is more than the birds and the bees.

And, there are precious few republicans that are conservative. Even Newt showed up in a commercial with Nancy. ... ... Let's just say that making nice with the enemy, ain't right.

JeffTheTerrible, you sound like a thoughtful and considerate person. You certainly do sound smarter than me. This board does not consume a lot of my attention span, so forgive me if I don't quite measure up to your response.

You also sound like you may be young enough to be a product of the indoctrination of our public school system.

If so, there are likely things of which you only know because you were told to know. I can't blame you for that.

I see and hear a lot of disturbing things, these days. I'm not sure of what to believe, much of the time.

It does cost me money and freedoms, that I once enjoyed. I resent the loss of my money and my rights.

Here is the link to the story. I don't have to read it, to know that it isn't good. If your eyes are open, you can see daily evidence of the direction this country is moving. And, the pace is fast.

AT&T Whistleblower:
Spy Bill Creates Infrastructure for a Police State'
http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/200...istleblow.html

Here are a couple of pages, from another site, regarding the UN. Again, I don't need to spend a lot of time investigating this site, to see daily evidence of the serious threat that is looking us straight in the eye.

http://www.getusout.org/artman/publi...index_26.shtml

http://www.getusout.org/


And, you would do well to learn to use your eyes, ears and mouth, in direct proportion to which you were blessed.

[Uturn2001]

Maybe you should spend some time reading then you might understand the reasoning behind the call for the US to withdraw from the UN, and it has nothing to do with UN troops being in America.

[2]

Maybe you should spend some time reading then you might understand the reasoning behind the call for the US to withdraw from the UN, and it has nothing to do with UN troops being in America.

I don't need to spend any time at the fruit factory, to know that it is not wise, to compare apples and oranges...

[WarHorse]

Through greed and the lust for power, these people thinking themselves wise, they become as fools.

That is a clear definition of a neo-con Republican.

And, liberals consistently attempt to violate the laws of nature, at our expense.

I would really like to see this opinion extrapolated.

[2]

Through greed and the lust for power, these people thinking themselves wise, they become as fools.

That is a clear definition of a neo-con Republican.

And, liberals consistently attempt to violate the laws of nature, at our expense.

I would really like to see this opinion extrapolated.

The neo-con term is used a lot, these days, yet, I have no clue what it really is.
FWIW, I was a registered republican, until I last renewed my CDL. Now, I'm independent.
I have no political leanings - I am decidedly in favor of a most conservative government.

Your request is too much, for this driver.
You, as an individual, are responsible for your own education, enlightenment, understanding, ect.

Rush is right, on almost all things.
His books are concise, easy reading and well done.

I also subscribe to his tenet that nothing I say or do, will ever change your mind. All I can do, is to challenge you to find your own answer. A liberal will give you their answer, then forever defend it.

This is a problem with liberals. They will say anything - if it sounds good, and the truth be damned.

Only you can convince yourself, if you take the time to do your due diligence. I know that is a tall order.

You have the tools at hand. The www. is a great tool to educate yourself about the truth.

Here are a couple of links, to get you started.
It is all up to you...

Adam Smith - An Inquiry into the Nature And Causes of the Wealth of Nations, 1776.
http://www.adamsmith.org/smith/won-index.htm

"A vast and stinging critique of the crippling regulation of commerce and trade that was then current, it argued that if people were set free to better themselves, it would - "as if by an invisible hand" - actually benefit the whole of society. The book influenced thought and politics profoundly, and was one of the foundations of the era of liberal free trade that dominated the Nineteenth Century."

The Adam Smith Institute is the UK's leading innovator of free-market economic and social policies.
http://www.adamsmith.org/

From the same site:
Milton Friedman
http://www.adamsmith.org/milton-friedman/

There are some enlightening Friedman quotes, on this page. Here is one:
"Wherever the state undertakes to control in detail the economic activities of its citizens, wherever, that is, detailed central economic planning reigns, there ordinary citizens are in political fetters, have a low standard of living, and have little power to control their own destiny"
Free to Chose p. 54-55"

The details don't matter, when you violate the principles.