Swapping unborn children to save the planet...

[golfhobo]

golfhobo, your theory has some extremely large loopholes that you would limit nothing.

Well, I DID say that there was MORE to it. I didn't feel the need to post the entirety here. But, please tell me more about the loopholes.... and explain what you mean by.... "that you would limit nothing." I honestly didn't understand what you meant.

You only gave people more reason to be immoral and more reason to divorce,

I don't see how I DID, and since I certainly didn't MEAN to..... I must assume that YOU didn't understand what I was saying. Again.... please explain. Contradicting and criticizing me means nothing, if you can't explain what YOU mean by what you say.

while at the same time you are effectively shutting down long lasting stable families.

Shutting down?? What are you talking about? It only takes ONE son who HAS a son, to carry on a family name.

Your theory would have done a much, much, much better job than the welfare system could have ever done along those lines.

Sorry, STILL don't know where you are coming from. ESPECIALLY your reference to the welfare system. MY theory would put a STOP to people on welfare having more than 2 children that WE have to support!

Bravo :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:

I take it you don't agree with my (incomplete) THEORY. But, I'll be danged if I've got a clue as to what you MEAN, or what you think my theory would do to "worsen?" the situation. Please EXPLAIN.

I look FORWARD to your explanation.

[golfhobo]

I don't agree with your Opinion Hobo, but I do understand it..and you have every right to your opinion.. I think the problem here is the way you presented it! You presented it as fact, and not an opinion..Nor a theory!.

Thanks, Slim..... but I must disagree. I've re-read what I posted MANY times (along with all the responses) and I can't see how it was stated as a FACT as opposed to an opinion. Now.... that the planet is becoming overpopulated IS a fact, and I can get you plenty of links to those who agree. But, what I said, was an opinion, (as MOST posts here ARE,) and should have been taken that way! The only reference to a "theory" was MINE, and I clearly stated that it was. I also clearly stated that I wasn't presenting the WHOLE of the theory, and truth be known, I never completely finished "fleshing it out." I'm ALSO working on a theory for Star Wars, but I haven't completely fleshed THAT one out yet, either!

If the world becomes over populated, God has built nature to control this. Whether it be disease or famine or weather, and even possibility's of producing more produce, if it chooses to sustain the population. Can we as humans help, yep we already do-- we kill in the name of God, we war for oil, and other products that we don't have in abundance, but others do {etc}!

Is that your OPINION?? Or are you stating that as FACT? :wink:

God certainly HAS built in safeguards, but modern science has decided to PLAY God, and extend lifespans, cure diseases, and even CLONE (at least) ORGANS to keep us alive! So.... WHO's playing GOD?

Since I was a kid, all these things where problems that plagued the imagination of government and the gone a little to far on both ends of righty or lefty..its there control issue!

Apparently, I am a bit older, and when I was a kid, these things weren't even a consideration...... other than the fact that we all KNEW the Chinese had nearly a Billion people and could overrun us in a MONTH! Thing is.... back then, they were content to ride BICYCLES!!! Now they want to drive CARS, and they have MORE money than WE do to buy the OIL with! :shock: Supply and Demand.... when THEIR demand outpaces ours, THEY will get the supply, and WE will go begging!

If you were to look at prophecy, soon there will be a 4th of the population which will be killed with war, pestilence, and famine, so on and so forth. Thats if you believe in prophecy. and IMOP whether you believe or not it will happen.

SOON??? Between Dubya's policies, AIDS, SARS and the new one ( I forget the acronym) and the starvation in Africa, we are allready IN those "times." But.... it doesn't seem to be making even a DENT! Look at how the people in Hong Kong live in high rises, and also in Dubai. Many other cities around the world are building UP instead of OUT, because it is cheaper to pump water UP than OUT! Look at what the drought in Georgia is doing, and North Carolina. Whole populations of MAJOR U.S. cities have less than 3 months of water resources left, (at this time) and very little rain in sight. Do you remember at least READING about the Dust Bowl???

I haven't DONE the math, (that would be a good challenge for me,) but on the spur of the moment, I think I would believe that you could wipe out 1/4th of the population tomorrow, and what is left, if UNCHECKED could replace that population in less than TWO generations!

So as for your opinion, you have every right to it, and I think it can be a good discussion. Just as long as like you tell me, you state it as a opinion, and not a fact that needs to be acted on..

My opinion is just that, it requires no action, at least not at MY command. But, the problem IS real, and DOES require action...... or we will suffer the consequences! We allready ARE!! :shock:

All peace to you Hobo and look forward to chatting with you more.

Chatting with YOU, Slim, is ALWAYS a blessing! I "wish" you good health so that you can participate MORE!


In finale..... It SEEMS to be the consensus here, that I stated my OPINION as some kind of FACT, and that my THEORY was some sort of MANDATE or EDICT instead of just a THEORY of how we might preserve the resources of the planet for ALL our decendants! I apologize if some here misunderstood me and my THOUGHTS! But, I WILL not, and DO NOT, apologize for having them or stating them!

If ANY of you have a problem with them, I suspect it lies in your OWN lack of English comprehension! And for THAT.... you can blame OVERCROWDED classrooms in your local schools!! GEE.... I wonder how THAT happened??? :shock:

I can't help but think that the most PROVACATIVE statement on this thread was that GOD has designed population control through RELIGIOUS WARS!! Without all the unborn chldren from DEAD soldiers (throughout History,) we would exceed our resources in about ONE generation!

Maybe we SHOULD let Dubya suspend the Constitution and continue being President for another DECADE! THAT should lower the world population by 1/4th at least!

Hobo


Slimland

[Fozzy]

More 2+2 = 5 garbage..

[mommee]

Hobo-

What you say about God building is safeguards I believe is true. I found out that 1 in 4 pregnancies end in miscarriage, usually in the 1st trimester, due to some kind "mistake" on the genetic or chromosomal level. But I don't think the doctors are playing God, so to speak. They are trying to give hope to people and where would we be without those doctors-back in the middle ages using leaches.

I saw the shine on the road and slowed down before a curve. Apparently, another trucker didn't, and killed the driver of a 4wheeler. We are ALWAYS only one instance and God's will (or fate) away from such a calamity during this Winter season! Be careful out there..... ALL of you!

God still wants you on this earth so we can pick on you :wink:
All kidding aside, glad you are safe. That was some nasty weather out there and now it's coming here.

[golfhobo]

Mommee said:

What you say about God building in safeguards I believe is true.

Actually, SLIM said it.... I just commented on it.

I found out that 1 in 4 pregnancies end in miscarriage, usually in the 1st trimester, due to some kind "mistake" on the genetic or chromosomal level.

So, you think God makes "mistakes?"

But I don't think the doctors are playing God, so to speak. They are trying to give hope to people and where would we be without those doctors-back in the middle ages using leaches.

I'm not REALLY saying they are playing God. I'm asking us all to THINK about it. I think the advances in medicine and science are good things, but, we have to consider what it means to us as a society. I'm not against curing diseases, heck... I'm FOR stem cell research!

I do, however question fertility treatments, simply because the result is far too often something unasked for like 6, 7, or 8 kids - usually to a family who could barely afford the procedure, or ONE kid! Yes.... I "FEEL" for them, and I've SAID I wish everyone could have at least one child. If they ever perfect the procedure to ensure only one or two children (per treatment,) I think that would be GREAT..... and fits into my "theory."

But, maybe God HAD HIS REASONS. Perhaps, it was so that SOME parents could opt to adopt the many children that are orphaned or UNWANTED. I don't know. I doubt any of us will ever know.

As YOU said.... reference to doctors playing God IS a "figure of speech." I've asked you not to take everything I say so literally. :wink:

I SEE what such advances are doing to our life expectancy and population, and I am NOT saying whether it is right or wrong. I'm saying it HAS consequences. And I'm SUGGESTING that it would not be so unwise for us to "balance" things out with a little "family planning" of our own! Planning that allows ALL who can or wish to know the blessing of children, considers the plight of the children who HAVE no family to love and care for them, and is economically and financially RESPONSIBLE to society as a whole.

Now, I'm gonna go out on that limb again, so I'll expect to be insulted by SOMEONE, but..... I believe that if Jesus walked the Earth today, and he was asked about my "opinion," He would not necessarily disagree with it, NOR would he call it the "dumbest thing He ever heard."

I saw the shine on the road and slowed down before a curve. Apparently, another trucker didn't, and killed the driver of a 4wheeler. We are ALWAYS only one instance and God's will (or fate) away from such a calamity during this Winter season! Be careful out there..... ALL of you!

God still wants you on this earth so we can pick on you :wink:
All kidding aside, glad you are safe. That was some nasty weather out there and now it's coming here.

Well..... I'm GLAD he has SOME reason to keep me here! Though, we may disagree on my purpose!

As I said.... I was a "middle child." A little more on that: My parents (God fearing Christians) believed in family planning. I have an older brother. They hoped "I" would be the daughter they wanted to "complete" the family "unit." Since I disappointed them, they went around once more.... and GOT that daughter.

I LOVE my sister...... but I would have liked that left window seat just about as much!

[mommee]

No, I don't think God makes mistakes. But mother nature also has a way of "weeding out" so to speak, the bad genes in our species. All creatures are constantly evolving. I am a practicing Catholic. I was thinking that maybe I miscarried twice because something was wrong and it was God or nature's way of correcting it.

The fertility treatments, that's something else. Couples know there are possibilities of multiples happening. They can also choose not to reduce the pregnancy when this occurs. It's hard to say which one to abort or not at that point. It's a tough question.

[golfhobo]

No, I don't think God makes mistakes. But mother nature also has a way of "weeding out" so to speak, the bad genes in our species. All creatures are constantly evolving. I am a practicing Catholic. I was thinking that maybe I miscarried twice because something was wrong and it was God or nature's way of correcting it.

The fertility treatments, that's something else. Couples know there are possibilities of multiples happening. They can also choose not to reduce the pregnancy when this occurs. It's hard to say which one to abort or not at that point. It's a tough question.

Well, I learn something every day! If I understand this correctly (it is not something I ever heard or thought about,) then..... indeed that would be a tough decision! One that "I" believe should not have to be FACED! [And, since I wasn't aware of it.... not something I considered in my "theory."]

It would certainly be tough for a practicing Catholic! (Or ANYONE!) But.... then again..... GOD didn't "create" the pregnancy, so I suppose it wouldn't be a SIN to "alter" it. But, I can't help thinking that Catholics wouldn't condone fertility treatments.

Not looking for a fight.

There are surely many things I don't know about Catholicism. I would have thought that, since they don't believe in aborting what God created, (or pre-empting his "plan,") they wouldn't believe in "creating" what God had NOT! :?

BTW..... my condolensces on your miscarriages. I know what that is like, as it happened to "us" once as well. Unfortunately, I believe my wife "helped it along" under advice from the Witch-in-law! Then again.... it might just have been God's plan to keep me from suffering TWICE the pain I have now, over not seeing my child.

Either way.... I must point out, that there is no such WOMAN as "Mother Nature." You refer EITHER to "evolutionary science" OR GOD! I'll leave it to YOU to decide.

[mommee]

Either way.... I must point out, that there is no such WOMAN as "Mother Nature." You refer EITHER to "evolutionary science" OR GOD! I'll leave it to YOU to decide.

I see it as God working through nature or evolutionary science, just my personal belief of course.

I think we can agree on that :wink:

[golfhobo]

Either way.... I must point out, that there is no such WOMAN as "Mother Nature." You refer EITHER to "evolutionary science" OR GOD! I'll leave it to YOU to decide.

I see it as God working through nature or evolutionary science, just my personal belief of course.

I think we can agree on that :wink:

I think we can agree on MANY things! But, yes... certainly THAT! Since I see no reason why GOD couldn't have created the Universe with a Big Bang, and have had some interest in the "evolution" of his creation, I cannot see how some HUMAN'S theory of Evolution is SO far outside what God has determined. However, I cannot.... and never WILL believe that we evolved from a Monkey, who somehow evolved from a fish that used to be an amoeba! That is just totally ridiculous!

But, that leaves me in the "camp" of the Creationists, and I'm not totally committed to THAT, either.

No ONE "camp" can explain the intracacies of human life and development. Why are women's HIPS wider these days? Because their children are born LARGER, of course. But, WHY? And how did that happen? And is there a purpose? No offense but, looking at women today, it seems we are "regressing" towards the physique of the Neanderthal woman! So, WHY did women's waistlines get down to 22 inches at one point? And why have they expanded once again?

Neither "camp" can explain this. And without explanation, I am left without a "belief." And I fully accept that this is MY decision!

[Slimland]

Hobo that was just one of the first things that kill of the 4th of the population, then comes plenty more.. But in the end if I remember right all that will be left is a 4th.. So 3/4ths of the population will be killed of by a combination of war, pestelence's, famine, natural disasters, and the unnatural.